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	rotten_fish 2006-08-16 02:03 am UTC (link)
	Poor Heidi. (Reply to this)

	b_jellybean 2006-08-16 02:03 am UTC (link)
	She does? Or did I fall into the sarchasm? (Reply to this)(Thread)

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pyratejenni, 2006-08-16 02:13 am UTC

	sashenka 2006-08-16 02:07 am UTC (link)
	You might want to check the address in that link. Generallt 1 http will suffice ^__^ (Reply to this)(Thread)

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pyratejenni, 2006-08-16 02:11 am UTC

	syncopation 2006-08-16 02:15 am UTC (link)
	Death threats. Yikes. (Reply to this)(Thread)

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ignatius, 2006-08-16 02:25 am UTC

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pyratejenni, 2006-08-16 02:29 am UTC

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kenboy, 2006-08-16 02:46 am UTC

	ashenmote 2006-08-16 02:16 am UTC (link)
	"There's a discussion I tried to have five years ago about plagiarism - what is it, where are the lines drawn, how do we cite, how should we cite - but it often disolved and devolves into extremism." People were seriously hindering Heidi's attempts at having discussions about plagiarism on the internet? What did they do, threaten her with lawsuits and stuff? (Reply to this)(Thread)

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pyratejenni, 2006-08-16 02:18 am UTC

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syncopation, 2006-08-16 02:25 am UTC

Translation: -

issendai, 2006-08-16 05:54 pm UTC

	im_nucking_futs 2006-08-16 02:23 am UTC (link)
	If that's an apology, I have swampland in Kansa to sell you. (Reply to this)(Thread)

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im_nucking_futs, 2006-08-16 02:24 am UTC

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evilsqueakers, 2006-08-16 02:26 am UTC

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hitchhiker42, 2006-08-16 03:58 am UTC

	kijikun 2006-08-16 02:24 am UTC (link)
	I love how she makes it sound like it was just a line here or there, or a poem everyone should known. Is she saying sorry or complaining that people are you know calling her on things? (Reply to this)(Thread)

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missdaisy, 2006-08-16 03:28 am UTC

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rhiannonmr, 2006-08-16 06:10 am UTC

	ignatius 2006-08-16 02:31 am UTC (link)
	Okay, who's the first one who brought up the MLA? I know I read a subthread that was talking about that, somewhere, but it seems like that's being jumped on as the defense, ie- 'I had citations, but ooh, these unreasonable people, they're demanding MLA citations.' Srsly, there's a whole chasm of cite between the MLA and the word "inspired." (Reply to this)(Thread)

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pyratejenni, 2006-08-16 02:35 am UTC

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jim_smith, 2006-08-16 05:46 am UTC

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slackerbitch, 2006-08-16 05:19 am UTC

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(no subject) - (Anonymous), 2006-08-19 12:37 pm UTC

warrioreowyn
2006-08-16 02:38 am UTC (link)

And, of course, amid all that, I had YMs and emails calling me a plagiarist because I didn't do MLA citations for a fic that I wrote over five years ago, or because I stupidly forgot to cite a Prefab Sprout song, or a Shel Silverstein poem, or three lines from Cicero.

What's this about MLA citations? I don't care about MLA citations - any kind of statement along the lines of "this passage is taken from such-and-such a book by so-and-so" is fine by me. Sounds a lot like a straw man to me. But she said "inspired by", which isn't really truthful.

I do feel really sorry for her now, though - this may not have been the best time to bring stuff up.

(Reply to this)

janegraddell
2006-08-16 02:39 am UTC (link)

Well, she did actually apologize. That's a pleasant surprise. Good for you, Heidi.

On the other hand, she also managed to successfully divert the post away from the plagiarism issue by harping on "MLA Style citations," which fuck if I know if anyone actually ever demanded. (And if so, I *really* hope no one took them seriously.)

But in Heidi-world, "citations sufficient to explicate the degree of borrowing so as not to confuse one's works with the work one is borrowing from" = "OMG they want 5,000 pages of full MLA citations attached to every chapter, now isn't that ridiculous, please sympathize so as to distract attention from the fact that I was actually forced to admit wrongdoing OMG!!!!"

(Reply to this)

	m_butterfly 2006-08-16 02:43 am UTC (link)
	She's made me want to come up with some sort of clever term for "apology", just because she's such a master at nonapologies. Unfortunately my brain has been iffy all day and the best I can come up with is "fap-ology: an 'apology' destined to cause wank". Anybody else more lively than me with a better idea? (Reply to this)(Thread)

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vigilanterodent, 2006-08-16 02:47 am UTC

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toph, 2006-08-16 03:09 am UTC

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m_butterfly, 2006-08-16 03:56 am UTC

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bastet, 2006-08-16 05:17 am UTC

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yotz_fen, 2006-08-17 05:41 pm UTC

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brown_betty, 2006-08-16 03:44 am UTC

(no subject) - dearladydisdain, 2006-08-16 04:24 am UTC

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thecheese, 2006-08-16 04:59 am UTC

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dez_chan, 2006-08-16 04:52 pm UTC

	lerefuge 2006-08-16 02:48 am UTC (link)
	I.. huh.. well. I believe she simply tried to make it as such we are overreacting to something that doesn't deserve it. I don't think that's an apology but I may be reading this wrong. (Reply to this)

out_bottle
2006-08-16 02:50 am UTC (link)

So, I don't know Heidi, and I've never been involved in HP fandom. I am a fairly indifferent onlooker. I have no hate for anyone involved, and I'm sorry that this reveal has happened right when she lost a family member. And in the grand scheme, that tragedy is of greater importance than plagiarism.

All that being said, how can she ignore the ENTIRE paragraphs she copied and pasted word-for-word? How can she claim it was only a few sentences she forgot to cite? And how can most of her supporters dismiss the cold hard evidence?

It really destroys my faith in logic and reason.

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evilsqueakers, 2006-08-16 02:54 am UTC

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sarahkjrsten, 2006-08-16 03:07 am UTC

	ishie 2006-08-16 02:58 am UTC (link)
	I do feel bad for her; this must be a very painful time for her and her family. Hey, at least she's owning up to some of it and corrected some of the questionable passages in her fic. For anyone who is interested in a discussion about citation and fic and crediting and blah blah boring academic stuff, I have a poll up in my LJ. (Reply to this)

limyaael
2006-08-16 02:59 am UTC (link)

...She tried to have a discussion about citations and disclaimers and no one listened to her? What?

I do feel sorry that she lost a family member right as this happened. But I don't understand why she didn't:

a) just not mix fandom issues with real life, if she does want them to be separate.

b) just say clearly, "Yes, I do understand why people thought this was plagiarism, and I'll be putting proper disclaimers/citations in the fics now."

c) just ignore everything, if she wants it swept under the rug.

I don't understand why she and CC- and Ebony, if you take the way she called the people posting about plagiarism tools of the Devil- insisted that they were the ones wronged, that they were only trying to have fun with spot-the-quote games or "homage" or "inspiration" or serious discussion about disclaimers, and that everyone else is hell-bent on making their lives hard. I thought that perhaps Heidi had decided to do b, and then here comes the bit about people failing to acknowledge her Contribution to the Discussion About Citation. What is so hard about just apologizing without implicating someone else?

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averii, 2006-08-16 05:33 am UTC

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carlanime, 2006-08-16 01:29 pm UTC

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redcoast, 2006-08-16 04:24 pm UTC

Independent confirmation of the death threats.

bookshop
2006-08-16 03:16 am UTC (link)

Heidi was removed from the panel earlier today, and yes, they DID have death threats. Several, in fact.

They will not be releasing the statements to the public. The general feeling on their part is that Heidi and all of us have been through enough this week, and that the sooner this is done with the better.
I've been given permission from the head of the conference to confirm this.

I absolutely agree with them. At this point I think anything that she has done to merit being put in this position is completely, completely unthinkably minor compared to her having received legitimate death threats over this issue.

I should also admit that I was immediately skeptical when I read her post, and horrified that she might be inventing something like this. I confirmed the threats independently through the conference head, Amy Tenbrink, who has given me permission to confirm this here.

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Re: Independent confirmation of the death threats. -

ishie, 2006-08-16 03:23 am UTC

Re: Independent confirmation of the death threats. -

jail, 2006-08-16 03:31 am UTC

Re: Independent confirmation of the death threats. - teawithvoldy, 2006-08-16 11:04 am UTC

Re: Independent confirmation of the death threats. -

pyratejenni, 2006-08-16 03:27 am UTC

Re: Independent confirmation of the death threats. -

purebloodgryff, 2006-08-16 07:18 pm UTC

Re: Independent confirmation of the death threats. -

pyratejenni, 2006-08-16 09:02 pm UTC

Re: Independent confirmation of the death threats. -

purebloodgryff, 2006-08-16 09:20 pm UTC

Re: Independent confirmation of the death threats. -

pyratejenni, 2006-08-16 09:41 pm UTC

Re: Independent confirmation of the death threats. -

gun, 2006-08-16 03:27 am UTC

Re: Independent confirmation of the death threats. -

theantifooosh, 2006-08-16 04:51 am UTC

Re: Independent confirmation of the death threats. -

cmikhailovic, 2006-08-16 03:31 am UTC

Re: Independent confirmation of the death threats. -

syncopation, 2006-08-16 05:01 am UTC

Re: Independent confirmation of the death threats. -

ereshkigal, 2006-08-16 11:05 am UTC

Re: Independent confirmation of the death threats. -

snarkbunny, 2006-08-16 11:18 am UTC

Re: Independent confirmation of the death threats. -

ignatius, 2006-08-16 03:34 am UTC

Re: Independent confirmation of the death threats. -

britikitty, 2006-08-16 03:40 am UTC

Re: Independent confirmation of the death threats. -

bookshop, 2006-08-16 03:46 am UTC

Re: Independent confirmation of the death threats. -

britikitty, 2006-08-16 03:53 am UTC

Re: Independent confirmation of the death threats. -

rowsdower, 2006-08-16 03:43 am UTC

Re: Independent confirmation of the death threats. -

ladyrogue, 2006-08-16 03:45 am UTC

Re: Independent confirmation of the death threats. -

m_butterfly, 2006-08-16 04:29 am UTC

Re: Independent confirmation of the death threats. -

ladyrogue, 2006-08-16 04:34 am UTC

Re: Independent confirmation of the death threats. -

pyratejenni, 2006-08-16 04:55 am UTC

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syncopation, 2006-08-16 05:06 am UTC

Re: Independent confirmation of the death threats. -

ladyrogue, 2006-08-16 05:09 am UTC

Re: Independent confirmation of the death threats. -

pyratejenni, 2006-08-16 05:27 am UTC

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herongale, 2006-08-16 03:59 am UTC

Re: Independent confirmation of the death threats. -

bookshop, 2006-08-16 04:02 am UTC

Re: Independent confirmation of the death threats. -

herongale, 2006-08-16 04:11 am UTC

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bookshop, 2006-08-16 04:19 am UTC

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herongale, 2006-08-16 04:31 am UTC

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carlanime, 2006-08-16 01:21 pm UTC

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naienko, 2006-08-16 01:23 pm UTC

(Deleted post)

(no subject) - out_bottle, 2006-08-16 03:48 am UTC

Wrong icon...
ladyrogue
2006-08-16 03:46 am UTC (link)
I feel bad for Heidi and what she's been going through. And it seems she's learned something from this experience (if only that you need to CITE EVERYTHING). That said, it seems Shezan is trying to take advantage of Heidi's post to further her crusade against us. Big surprise there.
(Reply to this)(Thread)

Re: Wrong icon... - rachelmap, 2006-08-17 05:29 am UTC

laverinth
2006-08-16 03:57 am UTC (link)
Sometimes I think we all need to step back and remember that everyone is human.
(Reply to this)(Thread)

(no subject) - tehrin, 2006-08-16 04:29 am UTC

(no subject) - laverinth, 2006-08-16 04:32 am UTC

(no subject) - tehrin, 2006-08-16 04:39 am UTC

(no subject) - stella_polaris, 2006-08-16 10:57 am UTC

lunalovepotter
2006-08-16 04:21 am UTC (link)
I'm almost too stunned by the sheer insanity of this situation to form a coherent thought. I have my own opinions about the plagiarism affair, but to threaten someone's life over it is seriously crossing the line.
(Reply to this)

cry me a river
tehrin
2006-08-16 04:28 am UTC (link)
Death threats are way too extreme. Plagiarism isn't something to kill over.

Her justification for her actions shows some pretty dumb reasoning for not citing in advance. I don't think people really give a damn about MLA as long as the right information is included (i.e. title, author, publisher, copyright date, page/line number(s)). I am glad she did make some effort to go back add citations, though I am doubting that she did it for the whole bits she copied. I just hope she is doing it right.
(Reply to this)(Thread)

Re: cry me a river - bluemouse, 2006-08-16 01:10 pm UTC

Re: cry me a river - stinksap, 2006-08-16 01:24 pm UTC

Re: cry me a river - redcoast, 2006-08-16 04:26 pm UTC

Re: cry me a river - tehrin, 2006-08-16 09:48 pm UTC

Re: cry me a river - cmikhailovic, 2006-08-16 09:41 pm UTC

Re: cry me a river - stinksap, 2006-08-21 02:21 pm UTC

Re: cry me a river - soula, 2006-08-16 06:04 pm UTC

Re: cry me a river - pyratejenni, 2006-08-16 09:14 pm UTC

Re: cry me a river - renata_hpjc, 2006-08-16 08:01 pm UTC

redcoast
2006-08-16 04:33 am UTC (link)
My sympathies to Heidi. My favorite reaction to this debacle, however, has been Gehayi's. Heidi posts on her thread down there.
(Reply to this)(Thread)

(no subject) - sashenka, 2006-08-16 04:44 am UTC

(no subject) - tehrin, 2006-08-16 05:14 am UTC

(no subject) - sashenka, 2006-08-16 06:06 am UTC

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(no subject) - catatonia, 2006-08-16 11:36 am UTC

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(no subject) - kittikattie, 2006-08-16 11:43 pm UTC

j5780p
2006-08-16 04:46 am UTC (link)
Oh, HP fandom, you're more entertaining than my soaps. Please, never, ever change, I mean it.

Except for the death threats. Not cool, folks.
(Reply to this)

staroverthebay
2006-08-16 05:00 am UTC (link)
ETA: According to Aja, the death threats are real.

Jesus fucking wept, HP fandom.

Dood, WHAT THE FUCK?!

What part of "It's just a fucking pastime" don't these wankers get?! Geez, flinging death threats at Heidi now, because they aren't satisfied with her apology? FUCKING AY, DUDE!

*shakes head*

There is no fandom quite as batshit fucking insane as Harry Potter, no matter how hard Star Wars, LOTR, Star Trek and Sailor Moon all try. Nothing comes close. Fucking ay, but these people [read: the people logging the threats, not Heidi] need to be locked up and the key thrown away. They can just cannibalize each other. Safest that way.

I don't like Heidi one bit, but for FUCKS SAKE to threaten her life is taking it WAY TOO FAR.
(Reply to this)

jocondite
2006-08-16 05:33 am UTC (link)
I feel awful for Heidi, actually.

What the fuck, HP extremists? Just shut up. And get a little sense.
(Reply to this)

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