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eisoj5 ([info]eisoj5) wrote in [info]fandom_wank,
@ 2006-12-11 21:56:00
Previous Entry  Add to memories!  Tell a Friend!  Next Entry
Entry tags:fandom: heroes, homophobia

Heroes: "*I* didn't think he was gay, so it's not a big deal"
(First Heroes officially reported wank? Maybe? *apparently missed out on some good stuff in another comm*)

So AfterElton.com posts an article about Heroes supporting character Zach, who's been arguably coded as gay (or bi) almost since we met him on the show. The article concerns recent NBC comments that no, Zach has never been anything but the straightest straight straight that ever straighted, sorry.

Said article is quoted and linked to on [info]heroes_tv, and within an hour, the comments are flying.

Highlights:

Arguing over whether or not Zach's gay, including pointing out of typos, anecdotal evidence, and other totally mature lines of evidence.

A brief diversion into America's political and cultural stance on homosexuality, including the comment "And who says lack of acceptance of homosexuality is "screwed up?" Some would say homosexuality is screwed up."

But-it-was-just-my-opinion-why-is-everybody-picking-on-me?

I'll admit it; I've been following this all day, so I'm in there a couple of times. Mainly exhorting people to actually read the article first and waiting for it to get good enough to post. :)
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[info]squeakytoy
2006-12-12 07:10 am UTC (link)
Oh, I really gotta get me some of this fandom. I've only watched to 1.03 and I've enjoyed, but it looks like the wank potential is gonna be off the grid!

...uhhh...which one's Zach? *tries to remember* Claire's nerdy schoolfriend?

(Reply to this)(Thread)

(no subject) - [info]scorpio20, 2006-12-12 07:17 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]yotz_fen, 2006-12-12 07:42 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]gloria_mundi, 2006-12-12 07:48 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]hearsawho, 2006-12-12 07:50 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]amxjm, 2006-12-12 08:47 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]hearsawho, 2006-12-12 08:51 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]yotz_fen, 2006-12-12 05:19 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]selene_avis, 2006-12-14 02:14 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]katarin, 2006-12-12 07:55 am UTC

[info]breecita
2006-12-12 07:13 am UTC (link)
I maintain that people are blaming the wrong person for this.

Obviously Claire's daddy made Zach straight when he de-BFF'd him.

(Reply to this)(Thread)

(no subject) - [info]pyrrah, 2006-12-12 10:42 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]lillyv, 2006-12-12 05:16 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]breecita, 2006-12-12 07:28 pm UTC

[info]squib
2006-12-12 07:27 am UTC (link)
I never thought Zach was gay or that Niki has MPD. I think both are much too simplistic, plot-easy explanations for what they're doing-- apparently I'm insane.

(Reply to this)(Thread)

(no subject) - [info]girl_friday, 2006-12-12 08:28 am UTC
Claire/Zach FTW! - [info]katarin, 2006-12-12 08:52 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]squib, 2006-12-12 09:17 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]hearsawho, 2006-12-12 11:25 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]plazmah, 2006-12-14 12:40 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]wrongly_amused, 2006-12-12 11:46 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]amberwaves, 2006-12-13 09:37 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]cadesama, 2006-12-12 10:56 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]hearsawho, 2006-12-12 11:14 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]cadesama, 2006-12-12 11:49 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]squib, 2006-12-12 06:38 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]cadesama, 2006-12-13 12:33 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]selene_avis, 2006-12-14 02:18 am UTC

[info]herongale
2006-12-12 07:37 am UTC (link)
I think all movie, television, and fiction writers should issue press releases definitively stating the canon sexuality of each and every one of their characters from now on. Obviously a winning strategy.

(Reply to this)(Thread)

(no subject) - [info]herongale, 2006-12-12 07:55 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]lottelita, 2006-12-12 10:39 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]selene_avis, 2006-12-14 02:23 am UTC

[info]amxjm
2006-12-12 07:42 am UTC (link)
The article concerns recent NBC comments that no, Zach has never been anything but the straightest straight straight that ever straighted, sorry.

...oh, hell no.

(Reply to this)


[info]katarin
2006-12-12 07:43 am UTC (link)
oh YES!

[throws confetti for my fandom]

Congratulations Heroes! It's Baby's First Wank!

(Reply to this)(Thread)

(no subject) - [info]katarin, 2006-12-12 07:48 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]evilsqueakers, 2006-12-12 08:15 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]katarin, 2006-12-12 08:22 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]evilsqueakers, 2006-12-12 08:25 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]katarin, 2006-12-12 08:31 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]evilsqueakers, 2006-12-12 08:32 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]pyrrah, 2006-12-12 10:43 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]evilsqueakers, 2006-12-13 03:05 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]pyrrah, 2006-12-12 10:45 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]deerlike, 2006-12-13 10:38 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]pyrrah, 2006-12-14 03:58 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]girl_friday, 2006-12-12 08:29 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]eisoj5, 2006-12-12 06:10 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]ruffwriter, 2006-12-12 11:30 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]katarin, 2006-12-12 11:35 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]marumae, 2006-12-12 11:49 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]katarin, 2006-12-12 11:54 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]ruffwriter, 2006-12-13 02:40 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]deerlike, 2006-12-13 10:39 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]katarin, 2006-12-13 06:42 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]ruffwriter, 2006-12-13 07:15 pm UTC

[info]evilsqueakers
2006-12-12 07:52 am UTC (link)
Oh, god. These people sound normal compared to the people on the 9th Wonder boards.

You know, if it wasn't for the Ninth Doctor arriving on the show, I'd SO not be watching this crap. And I'm really tired of the 'Niki just has MPD/DID' argument, too. Did all the crazy people migrate to the Heroes fandom? If so, I might leave. They make the HP look normal.

(Reply to this)(Thread)

(no subject) - [info]melisus, 2006-12-12 08:03 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]evilsqueakers, 2006-12-12 08:04 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]supersyncspaz7, 2006-12-12 08:52 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]evilsqueakers, 2006-12-13 03:03 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]vinylgrrl, 2006-12-12 11:59 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]yotz_fen, 2006-12-12 05:31 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]evilsqueakers, 2006-12-13 03:13 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]yotz_fen, 2006-12-12 05:26 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]sithwitch13, 2006-12-12 08:43 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]evilsqueakers, 2006-12-13 03:15 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]edana_ni_emer, 2006-12-13 06:32 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]evilsqueakers, 2006-12-13 07:43 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]edana_ni_emer, 2006-12-13 07:45 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]evilsqueakers, 2006-12-13 07:50 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]edana_ni_emer, 2006-12-13 07:56 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]evilsqueakers, 2006-12-13 07:58 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]edana_ni_emer, 2006-12-13 08:02 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]evilsqueakers, 2006-12-13 08:06 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]edana_ni_emer, 2006-12-13 08:14 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]evilsqueakers, 2006-12-13 08:19 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]melisus, 2006-12-12 10:17 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]evilsqueakers, 2006-12-13 03:16 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]panthea, 2006-12-12 08:04 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]evilsqueakers, 2006-12-12 08:08 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]scootermcgaffin, 2006-12-12 08:10 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]evilsqueakers, 2006-12-12 08:13 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]scootermcgaffin, 2006-12-12 08:18 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]evilsqueakers, 2006-12-12 08:23 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]puipui, 2006-12-12 09:02 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]scootermcgaffin, 2006-12-13 02:37 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]puipui, 2006-12-13 04:18 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]blue_penguin, 2006-12-13 08:10 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]msmongi, 2006-12-12 10:30 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]msmongi, 2006-12-12 10:32 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]evilsqueakers, 2006-12-13 03:05 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]cadesama, 2006-12-12 11:01 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]evilsqueakers, 2006-12-13 03:10 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]cadesama, 2006-12-13 04:57 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]quettaser, 2006-12-12 02:33 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]evilsqueakers, 2006-12-13 03:14 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]coffee_mug, 2006-12-12 11:49 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]evilsqueakers, 2006-12-13 03:12 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]a_partridge, 2006-12-13 06:02 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]evilsqueakers, 2006-12-13 07:12 am UTC

[info]blue_penguin
2006-12-12 07:52 am UTC (link)
I admit that Zach never pinged my gaydar either, but boy is there a lot of of stupid in the comments to that entry. Particularly the one woman who said something along the lines of "well, no one I know has ever had a bad experience with being a gay teenager!" Either she lives in some sort of paradise of acceptance, or she doesn't actually know any gay people.

(Reply to this)(Thread)

(no subject) - [info]msmongi, 2006-12-12 10:33 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]seiberwing, 2006-12-13 08:41 am UTC

[info]soupspooks
2006-12-12 07:53 am UTC (link)
I thought he sounded at least potentially gay from the Wiki. Come on, telling people a character is straight is a surefire way to get the fanlings to disprove that. Even I know that.

(Reply to this)


[info]shinga
2006-12-12 07:56 am UTC (link)
Maybe they figure if they SAY Zach is straight, fans might actually ship him with a guy.

What? It works with every other fandom.

(Reply to this)(Thread)

(no subject) - [info]scootermcgaffin, 2006-12-12 08:07 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]shinga, 2006-12-12 08:13 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]msmongi, 2006-12-12 10:35 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]dreamoflife02, 2006-12-13 12:43 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]coffee_mug, 2006-12-12 11:52 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]scootermcgaffin, 2006-12-12 11:53 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]miraba, 2006-12-12 02:36 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]breecita, 2006-12-12 07:32 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]coffee_mug, 2006-12-13 12:58 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]selene_avis, 2006-12-14 02:34 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]coffee_mug, 2006-12-14 11:51 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]selene_avis, 2006-12-14 05:51 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]embyquinn, 2006-12-12 04:17 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]napalmnacey, 2006-12-12 11:35 pm UTC

[info]tehrin
2006-12-12 08:01 am UTC (link)
Hypothetically, I want the press release to be a trick to cover up a plot development for next season. Zack can get the gay on and stir wank up anew. NBC will all be "HAHA! GREAT TWIST!"

(Reply to this)


[info]hearsawho
2006-12-12 08:08 am UTC (link)
I didn't think any of those things the article listed proved that Zach was gay. I think they proved that he was sensitive, self-aware, sweet, supportive, and all around the best friend Claire could ask for.

Was it clear that the writers might very well go that route? Sure. But we had no more certainty of it than Jackie did.

[/my thoughts on yaoi Zach]

(Reply to this)(Thread)

(no subject) - [info]saleha, 2006-12-12 12:20 pm UTC

[info]athy
2006-12-12 08:15 am UTC (link)
Wow... I never thought he was gay and I LOOK for that. I mean... picked on and nice yes. I thought he was just acting -'whatever'- at Jackie for calling him gay. (There is seriously no better way to say that sentence.) Ahh to be on the outskirts of fandom is kind of nice in this case, it doesn't bother me one way or the other.

(Reply to this)


[info]microclimate
2006-12-12 08:38 am UTC (link)
I like that enjoying Priscilla, Queen of the Desert, Velvet Goldmine and Hedwig and the Angry Inch makes you gay.

(Reply to this)(Thread)

(no subject) - [info]doomsday, 2006-12-12 09:31 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]rotten_fish, 2006-12-12 09:37 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]zinkchan, 2006-12-12 11:02 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]coffee_mug, 2006-12-12 11:53 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]saleha, 2006-12-12 12:21 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]lillyv, 2006-12-12 05:08 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]scootermcgaffin, 2006-12-12 05:52 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]lillyv, 2006-12-12 06:30 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]amxjm, 2006-12-12 06:56 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]lillyv, 2006-12-12 07:05 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]dreamoflife02, 2006-12-13 12:46 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]coffee_mug, 2006-12-13 01:07 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]microclimate, 2006-12-12 04:11 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]zinkchan, 2006-12-12 08:10 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]wrenlet, 2006-12-14 02:57 am UTC
Whoa, deja vu!
[info]life_on_mars
2006-12-12 08:40 am UTC (link)
Isn't this the Malcolm Reed brouhaha all over again? "Yes, he's definitely gay" - right up until the moment the actor innocently asks if he's actually supposed to be gay, at which time the studio goes into denial.

One of the great lost opportunities, IMHO.

(Reply to this)(Thread)

Re: Whoa, deja vu! - [info]oh_envy, 2006-12-12 02:02 pm UTC
Re: Whoa, deja vu! - [info]oh_envy, 2006-12-12 02:02 pm UTC
Re: Whoa, deja vu! - [info]life_on_mars, 2006-12-12 03:08 pm UTC

[info]girl_friday
2006-12-12 08:44 am UTC (link)
Christ, MsA doesn't get less crazy with fandom change, does she? To continue my Monty Python theme: "Help, help, I'm being oppressed!"

Not saying NBC is right here; I don't really care. I think that so many people took his 'okay with who I am' statement is kind of a slap in the face to those of use who were 'different' but not queer in highschool.

And egads, is it so impossible to believe that Zach turned her down for the dance because either a) he refused to go to the dance for some reason (he was asking her to the game, yes?) or b) all ready had a date? Geeks do ask other geeks to dances so they don't go alone, and my god, if he dumped his geek!girl date for Claire, he'd be ostracised from the out-group, and trust me, that's no place to be.

I dunno. Maybe I'm being wanky here. NBC was wrong, but I think the who are freaking out about it aren't making it better. Now I'm off to bed to let this simmer overnight.

(Reply to this)(Thread)

(no subject) - [info]breecita, 2006-12-12 07:41 pm UTC

[info]rotten_fish
2006-12-12 09:35 am UTC (link)
I don't know what's more hilarious, MsA's blatant stupidity, or the fact that Zack likes Penny Arcade.

(Reply to this)(Thread)

(no subject) - [info]lady7jane, 2006-12-12 04:50 pm UTC

[info]airawyn
2006-12-12 10:03 am UTC (link)
It's not just that he was presented as gay. The creator said explicitly that Zach was gay.

Heroes will feature a gay character, according to Kring and Fuller, who is now writing for the show. In the pilot a popular high school cheerleader with superhuman invulnerability selects a loner from her class to divulge her secret to—though he’s not revealed as gay in that episode. Kring admits, “I’m feeling a little odd about it, because I literally haven’t even discussed it with the actor yet.”


And now, someone behind the scenes has forced that to change.

I am very sorry this has caused concern for the readers of your website. It was certainly not our intention to confuse the issue of Zach’s character being gay. We have too much respect for our audience to do that intentionally. However, it has simply become too complicated behind the scenes to push this issue further with this particular character. We apologize for misleading the audience, and wish that we could have handled things better on our end. But making a TV show is often a very imprecise business. As you stated, Heroes is a big, sprawling drama and there is no reason to believe that a gay character will not be represented on our show in the future. It is my hope than we do, we do it with honesty and dignity. That will certainly be our attempt.


*I'm* annoyed, personally, that a positive, subtle portrayal of a gay character on a TV show is suddenly being retconned. I'm now hoping that Zach will leave the show before it's an issue, and I really liked Zach.

(Reply to this)(Thread)

(no subject) - [info]fevered_ego, 2006-12-12 10:32 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]msmongi, 2006-12-12 10:39 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]cadesama, 2006-12-12 11:35 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]squib, 2006-12-12 06:46 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]cadesama, 2006-12-13 12:39 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]coffee_mug, 2006-12-12 11:58 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]pinkranger, 2006-12-12 03:41 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]trustanti, 2006-12-13 12:52 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]selene_avis, 2006-12-14 02:41 am UTC

[info]sabinelagrande
2006-12-12 10:27 am UTC (link)
Wait... is Zach the one who's really really gay for Claire?

(Reply to this)


[info]deerlike
2006-12-12 10:42 am UTC (link)
Well, I never really invested in Zach's sexuality, so it doesn't matter to me. Personally, I think Peter's the queerest of them all. ;)

(Reply to this)(Thread)

(no subject) - [info]katarin, 2006-12-13 12:59 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]deerlike, 2006-12-13 10:36 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]amberwaves, 2006-12-13 09:45 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]deerlike, 2006-12-13 10:34 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]amberwaves, 2006-12-20 04:21 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]deerlike, 2006-12-20 04:29 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]amberwaves, 2006-12-20 04:36 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]mambo, 2006-12-13 06:24 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]deerlike, 2006-12-13 06:29 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]selene_avis, 2006-12-14 02:45 am UTC

[info]lottelita
2006-12-12 10:42 am UTC (link)
LOL publicity stunt.

I hate it when execs spark wank just to get the ratings up.

(Reply to this)(Thread)

(no subject) - [info]scootermcgaffin, 2006-12-12 11:09 am UTC

[info]coffee_mug
2006-12-12 12:01 pm UTC (link)
First reaction: oh sweet, Heroes wank finally! Knew this'd happen. And glad it wasn't something ultralame like racist wank or incest wank.

Second reaction: I'm in a fandom with MsA? ...Fuck.

(Reply to this)(Thread)

(no subject) - [info]kosaginolegion, 2006-12-12 02:55 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]coffee_mug, 2006-12-12 08:00 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]eisoj5, 2006-12-12 08:16 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]kosaginolegion, 2006-12-12 10:15 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]coffee_mug, 2006-12-13 01:02 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]kosaginolegion, 2006-12-13 02:32 pm UTC

[info]puipui
2006-12-12 12:29 pm UTC (link)
I'll admit it; I've been following this all day, so I'm in there a couple of times.

:(

(Reply to this)(Thread)

(no subject) - [info]eisoj5, 2006-12-12 04:33 pm UTC

[info]qwertyuiop
2006-12-12 03:42 pm UTC (link)
It seems that one of the creators responded to the original article.

The comments on that article are bit heated. Me, I don't know what to think of this. I mean I haven't seen the show in question, but I had to wonder why the network would feel the need to clarify at all, most of the time they never comment unless it is out and out obvious, and this doesn't read as that obvious. At least not me.

On another note, is there anywhere I can get episodeso fHeroes? I have been wanting to see it forever, but for some reason my cable doesn't put through NBC so I have been unable to see it.

(Reply to this)(Thread)

(no subject) - [info]qwertyuiop, 2006-12-12 03:43 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]pinkranger, 2006-12-12 04:01 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]qwertyuiop, 2006-12-12 04:08 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]scootermcgaffin, 2006-12-12 04:47 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]qwertyuiop, 2006-12-12 05:00 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]selene_avis, 2006-12-14 02:50 am UTC

[info]ladycat
2006-12-12 03:57 pm UTC (link)
What's funny was that I was impressed with the show for making such a "stereotypically" gay teen straight. Blew that whole assumption thing right out of the water and, I thought, wasn't particularly unfriendly to gays.

I certainly wouldn't have been upset if he had been, either, but... it would've been refreshing, yanno? To have a gothy-geek with eyeliner that also happened to be a nice boy that wasn't automatically gay? That's kind of nice.

But man, I think textualevidence is a leeettle too up in arms about this. So one character is not gay -- it sucks, yes, it's not a good thing, no, but it's also kind of not the be-and-all of things. They never came out one way or the other, so it's not like it was a loss, just not a gain.

(Reply to this)(Thread)

(no subject) - [info]amyheartssiroc, 2006-12-12 06:10 pm UTC
(no subject) - redwarrior, 2006-12-13 01:08 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]candy, 2006-12-13 01:40 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]amberwaves, 2006-12-13 09:47 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]selene_avis, 2006-12-14 02:53 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]lovelypoet, 2006-12-13 05:04 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]msmongi, 2006-12-13 08:27 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]selene_avis, 2006-12-14 02:55 am UTC
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