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A Guy Named Goo (![[info]](http://www.journalfen.net/img/userinfo.gif){kind=small} the_clansmen) wrote in ![[info]](http://www.journalfen.net/img/community.gif){kind=small} fandom_wank,@ 2006-12-20 15:10:00 |
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Son (or Daughter) of the American Girl Wank
Remember the recent American Girl wank? The one where mods of one board banned members of another because they didn't like them? Well, it marches on, my friends! The mods, who have been conspicuously silent since the news broke out in the AG fandom have finally spoken to Nethilia (kittikattie), a mod at ag_over_18, and they employ the kind of doublespeak that would make a politician caught with his pants down proud.
Dear Nethilia,
I am sorry it took me this long to answer your email. I was neither ignoring nor avoiding you; I just have not been on my computer at all from Friday night till just a few minutes ago.
Let me try to explain....
Over four years ago, the Society of American Girl Collectors forum was established as a place where collectors of American Girl dolls of all ages could come together to discuss their dolls and their lives. The founder of the Society wanted to provide a place of peace where there would be no conflict, no contention, no discord of any kind; with no surface ripples and no undercurrents. Did she intend it to mirror the "real world?" Not at all. Was she being idealistic? Absolutely. But it was what she intended it to be, and she set up rules for the forum to ensure that it would remain such. From time to time, people came in causing disturbances; and if they would not agree to abide by the rules and maintain peace, they were asked to leave or their memberships were removed.
About two years ago our founder stepped down to begin her family, changed the name of the forum to American Girl Fans Message Board, and handed the leadership over to women whom she trusted would continue providing the same safe and peaceful haven that she had intended. It seems an easy thing to ask members to leave keep controversy to themselves when they enter our forum, but still there are those who try to cause upset to our peaceful way of life.
Within a week after we moved to our new location, some of our members brought disturbing news to the attention of the moderating team. It seems that they also had memberships in another community where the members were beginning to make threats against our forum. They let us use their IDs to enter that community, where we found page after page of conversations where people were planning ways to bait us as AGFMB members and moderators, and forming plots to destroy the peace and harmony that has been a part of our board for as long as it has been in existence - even to break our board as it now exists. One of those people was you, Neth.
Now, we really don't care what other people say about us when they are not on our board. I know we have been called names and talked about in rather harsh terms. You and anyone else are free to choose what you want to say about us, and there is nothing we can or will do about that. We do, however, have a responsibility to our own forum; and that responsibility is to protect it in any way we can.
In order to protect the AGFMB as it is - as the vast majority of our many, many members desire and expect it to remain - we took the actions that we felt were needed. Are we being blind to life as it really is? Probably so. Are we being overly cautious? Most likely. Do we feel like we still need to keep our little board (which is really not so little anymore) protected from conflict, contention, and discord; with no surface ripples and no undercurrents of any kind - the way our founder originally intended? Absolutely.
I am truly sorry if you or any of your community members were hurt by our actions. It was not our intent to cause pain of any kind. I hope what I have said has helped you to see our intent more clearly.
Sincerely,
(mod)
Of course, Neth isn't going to take this lying down:
Oh, please. That's absolutely unfounded. As far as I know, none of the memebers of my forums brought any threats to anyone. If you're talking about my board on livejournal, AG over 18, we kept our snark and opinions there. We almost never used a single name unless it was an internet name (which we are allowed to use) While we brought our dissent there--especially when it came to unfair rules and unfair biases we saw in membership and the handling of problems--we never sught to attack a single person. We questioned your rules not to "bait" mods but to question rules that many people saw as unfair, oppresive, and unfairly applied to all members of the community.
That's the way the world works. People are not going to sit around and be told how to feel. The idea of a world without dissent or arguement is a pipe dream. Squashing dissent out of some idea that people must be imposed into agreeing with each other does not end the dissent, it only lets it fester and eventually, it will go off site and be handled in other ways.
And I did NOT try and break down your board. I behaved. I questioned your policies because that is what I do when I see unfairness. Given that a new rule imposed on the board pretty much targeted me for my religious faith because it's not mainstream or Christian, I had every right to be upset and distressed.
Don't try and tell me things that I know for a fact are not true. Memebers like Bean, Goo, and others never attacked. Keri never attacked. I saw how Bean posted and she was a MODEL poster. And Emsmombuysdolls dolls joined and then was banned an hour later from AG Fans. What could she have done in a whole HOUR?
People would say their piece at my forums and keep it there. I'm a grown woman. The idea that you think I'm just going to swallow this tripe about a good warm world and an attack coming out of the blue is a slap in my face. And I think that's even more insulting than the banning itself.
You go ahead and believe the words of other people and think we're out to just cause you grief. You can think we're somehow out to attack you. But don't you DARE try to tell me that somehow, another community talking is so threatening that you have to insitute a mass banning against people preemtively. We are not internet terrorists. And don't tell me that you're sorry. I don't buy that. If you were really sorry about what you're doing, you would honestly look at why that happened, why you banned first and didn't ask any questions, and why you felt a widespread ban that caught a bunch of innocents in the crossfire was a good idea. It's the equivalent of shoot first, ask questions later. Many people banned did nothing, and to claim that you sympathise is utter bullshit.
I see your policies. You kick out anyone who dissents, shame others into not talking about themselves if they're not the kind of people you want to hear about (under a guise of keeping everything "peacable"), and hurt other people in this process. That's not the way any forum or anywhere should be made to work. I see unfairness--unfairness towards other members based on lies and slander.
I'm kind of glad you banned me. I wouldn't want to continue to be a member of a forum that acts on the reports of a few to attack the many and treats so many so awfully.
I would advise you not to reply to me. Clearly you think I'm a moron and I don't talk to people who think I'm stupid. I may be young compared to other people who collect, but my momma didn't raise no fool. Don't talk to me like I am one.
--Tasha Metcalf
Proud Founder of AG over 18.
Most of the angry responses can be found onag_over_18's version of this post, but it's currently locked. I'm just linking to Neth's entry with her permission. And this isn't even counting the mods reappearing on the AG Playthings message board (again, locked to members) just to...pointedly ignore everyone's demands for answers.
American Girl Dolls = still serious business.
Remember the recent American Girl wank? The one where mods of one board banned members of another because they didn't like them? Well, it marches on, my friends! The mods, who have been conspicuously silent since the news broke out in the AG fandom have finally spoken to Nethilia (
kittikattie), a mod at ag_over_18, and they employ the kind of doublespeak that would make a politician caught with his pants down proud.Dear Nethilia,
I am sorry it took me this long to answer your email. I was neither ignoring nor avoiding you; I just have not been on my computer at all from Friday night till just a few minutes ago.
Let me try to explain....
Over four years ago, the Society of American Girl Collectors forum was established as a place where collectors of American Girl dolls of all ages could come together to discuss their dolls and their lives. The founder of the Society wanted to provide a place of peace where there would be no conflict, no contention, no discord of any kind; with no surface ripples and no undercurrents. Did she intend it to mirror the "real world?" Not at all. Was she being idealistic? Absolutely. But it was what she intended it to be, and she set up rules for the forum to ensure that it would remain such. From time to time, people came in causing disturbances; and if they would not agree to abide by the rules and maintain peace, they were asked to leave or their memberships were removed.
About two years ago our founder stepped down to begin her family, changed the name of the forum to American Girl Fans Message Board, and handed the leadership over to women whom she trusted would continue providing the same safe and peaceful haven that she had intended. It seems an easy thing to ask members to leave keep controversy to themselves when they enter our forum, but still there are those who try to cause upset to our peaceful way of life.
Within a week after we moved to our new location, some of our members brought disturbing news to the attention of the moderating team. It seems that they also had memberships in another community where the members were beginning to make threats against our forum. They let us use their IDs to enter that community, where we found page after page of conversations where people were planning ways to bait us as AGFMB members and moderators, and forming plots to destroy the peace and harmony that has been a part of our board for as long as it has been in existence - even to break our board as it now exists. One of those people was you, Neth.
Now, we really don't care what other people say about us when they are not on our board. I know we have been called names and talked about in rather harsh terms. You and anyone else are free to choose what you want to say about us, and there is nothing we can or will do about that. We do, however, have a responsibility to our own forum; and that responsibility is to protect it in any way we can.
In order to protect the AGFMB as it is - as the vast majority of our many, many members desire and expect it to remain - we took the actions that we felt were needed. Are we being blind to life as it really is? Probably so. Are we being overly cautious? Most likely. Do we feel like we still need to keep our little board (which is really not so little anymore) protected from conflict, contention, and discord; with no surface ripples and no undercurrents of any kind - the way our founder originally intended? Absolutely.
I am truly sorry if you or any of your community members were hurt by our actions. It was not our intent to cause pain of any kind. I hope what I have said has helped you to see our intent more clearly.
Sincerely,
(mod)
Of course, Neth isn't going to take this lying down:
Oh, please. That's absolutely unfounded. As far as I know, none of the memebers of my forums brought any threats to anyone. If you're talking about my board on livejournal, AG over 18, we kept our snark and opinions there. We almost never used a single name unless it was an internet name (which we are allowed to use) While we brought our dissent there--especially when it came to unfair rules and unfair biases we saw in membership and the handling of problems--we never sught to attack a single person. We questioned your rules not to "bait" mods but to question rules that many people saw as unfair, oppresive, and unfairly applied to all members of the community.
That's the way the world works. People are not going to sit around and be told how to feel. The idea of a world without dissent or arguement is a pipe dream. Squashing dissent out of some idea that people must be imposed into agreeing with each other does not end the dissent, it only lets it fester and eventually, it will go off site and be handled in other ways.
And I did NOT try and break down your board. I behaved. I questioned your policies because that is what I do when I see unfairness. Given that a new rule imposed on the board pretty much targeted me for my religious faith because it's not mainstream or Christian, I had every right to be upset and distressed.
Don't try and tell me things that I know for a fact are not true. Memebers like Bean, Goo, and others never attacked. Keri never attacked. I saw how Bean posted and she was a MODEL poster. And Emsmombuysdolls dolls joined and then was banned an hour later from AG Fans. What could she have done in a whole HOUR?
People would say their piece at my forums and keep it there. I'm a grown woman. The idea that you think I'm just going to swallow this tripe about a good warm world and an attack coming out of the blue is a slap in my face. And I think that's even more insulting than the banning itself.
You go ahead and believe the words of other people and think we're out to just cause you grief. You can think we're somehow out to attack you. But don't you DARE try to tell me that somehow, another community talking is so threatening that you have to insitute a mass banning against people preemtively. We are not internet terrorists. And don't tell me that you're sorry. I don't buy that. If you were really sorry about what you're doing, you would honestly look at why that happened, why you banned first and didn't ask any questions, and why you felt a widespread ban that caught a bunch of innocents in the crossfire was a good idea. It's the equivalent of shoot first, ask questions later. Many people banned did nothing, and to claim that you sympathise is utter bullshit.
I see your policies. You kick out anyone who dissents, shame others into not talking about themselves if they're not the kind of people you want to hear about (under a guise of keeping everything "peacable"), and hurt other people in this process. That's not the way any forum or anywhere should be made to work. I see unfairness--unfairness towards other members based on lies and slander.
I'm kind of glad you banned me. I wouldn't want to continue to be a member of a forum that acts on the reports of a few to attack the many and treats so many so awfully.
I would advise you not to reply to me. Clearly you think I'm a moron and I don't talk to people who think I'm stupid. I may be young compared to other people who collect, but my momma didn't raise no fool. Don't talk to me like I am one.
--Tasha Metcalf
Proud Founder of AG over 18.
Most of the angry responses can be found on
ag_over_18's version of this post, but it's currently locked. I'm just linking to Neth's entry with her permission. And this isn't even counting the mods reappearing on the AG Playthings message board (again, locked to members) just to...pointedly ignore everyone's demands for answers.American Girl Dolls = still serious business.
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