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Laurie ([info]knitmeapony) wrote in [info]fandom_wank,
@ 2010-05-14 09:22:00


Previous Entry  Add to memories!  Tell a Friend!  Next Entry
Entry tags:author entitlement, authors, can't escape the screencaps

Second verse, same as the first: Katherine Kerr hates your fanfic.
Katherine Kerr, editor of Weird Tales of Shakespeare and author of Celtic myth and Dungeons and Dragons 'inspired' novels decides to create another derivative work: her thoughts on yaoi.

A number of people on LJ have been expressing their views on fanfic, so I thought I'd add mine. I despise it.

http://aberwyn.livejournal.com/181755.html Deleted!

Caps of first post:
via alchemynerd on LJ: http://www.sendspace.com/file/7ovake
via alchemynerd on LJ: http://www.sendspace.com/file/nsjfzd
Perhaps you'd prefer PDF: http://knitmeapony.com/fw/kerr_kerfuffle_page1.pdf
Or HTML, via maneman on LJ: knitmeapony.com/fw/katherine_kerr_career_suicide.html


And this includes the professional transformative works:

If someone can think of no better idea than to take a classic kid's book series and try to wring a few more bucks out of it, like the whole 'Wicked' series, then they should get a real job.


Comment #2 is fellow author Jim Hines getting a bit snarky with the idea. She backpedals mightily in the face of a professional author.

There are disappointed fans! She replies to her own post rather than editing it!

Not to mention mocking, accusations of trolling, and weird discussions of how fanfic is like embroidery or other crafting.

First post deleted, with explanation: Because people got "offensive": http://aberwyn.livejournal.com/182244.html Also deleted, cap of this, courtesy of [info]zulu http://tinypic.com/r/akzz1d/5

Then there was a third post, which I missed entirely, dubiously titled "what's wrong with talking about quality?" Cap, courtesy of [info]woodenleg http://img217.imageshack.us/img217/5620/swrongwithtalkingaboutq.png


And when the second and third posts were deleted, a martyrish post went up here: http://aberwyn.livejournal.com/182619.html

Lordy, yet another post, preserved below. Edit: Post deleted, but thankfully preserved.

And one (final?) post, this time with comments turned off:

Summing up
1. 3 or 4 of the posts in the mobbing stage were interesting and intelligent; they made a nicely reasoned defence of fanfic. Good for you! You might have changed my mind if it weren't for the others.

2. The rest of the 200 or so posts actually proved my points about poor writing skills, lack of cultural knowledge, and lack of imagination, since they repeated each other's thoughts in varying degrees of inarticulate language. One person, in a post I screened by disallowed, even used a toilet reference that was supposed to embarrass me. He also seemed to think I'm man, oddly enough.

3. A sloppy syllogism for those who didn't get the B'rer Rabbit point:
A. I dislike fanfic and don't want anyone writing it about my work.
B. If you don't read my work, you can't write about it.
C. Therefore threatening to ignore my work does not injure me in any way. Rather, I'm relieved that you won't.

4. The mobbing was not merely rude to me. We can agree on the point that the flip tone of my original post deserved the response it got. However, the mobbing was rude to all the regular readers of this space. It bored them, it cut off their right of discussion, and I suspect it convinced some of them that my original post's opinion of fanfic writers was in the main correct.


Personally, I think this fanfic of the Diana Gabaldon kerfuffle has a paucity of imagination. And relatively dull.



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(Post a new comment)


[info]gmth
2010-05-16 12:45 am UTC (link)
LOL and now the syllogism post is gone, too. I'm enjoying this one way more than I should.

(Reply to this)(Thread)


[info]evilsqueakers
2010-05-16 04:43 am UTC (link)
The syllogism doesn't even work! At all.

I might have not understand that class. At all. But damn, even I know that doesn't line up correctly.

(Reply to this)(Parent)


[info]northen_light36
2010-05-16 12:54 am UTC (link)
And she's deleted the summing up post too. *shakes head* That woman really needs to fix the holes in her LJ. Her posts keep leaking out.

Actually, it reminds me of the plots in her novels.

(Reply to this)

(Deleted post)

[info]starfish
2010-05-16 03:17 am UTC (link)
+ 1 billion style points for "puling". "Vainglorious" was also v. good.

(Reply to this)(Parent)(Thread)

(no subject) - [info]tofuknight, 2010-05-16 07:52 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]emily_goddess, 2010-05-17 05:06 am UTC
GIP - [info]danceswithelvis, 2010-05-18 07:28 pm UTC

[info]cyndra_falin
2010-05-16 01:30 am UTC (link)
She such a special, special, special little snowflake! From the last post, which is now gone, no shock there, is that:

1: She was almost there, you guys but the rude people stopped her so its all their fault.

2: Basically, those that don't agree with her, who actually tried to reason with her, are unintelligent morons who prove her right or something that fan fic does suck and that idiots write it. Sticking her fingers in her ears and shouting "Lalalalala I can't hear you lalala I'm right lalalalala!!!"

3: Okay!

4: Baaawww I was being called on my crap and that hurt my feewings baaawww!

So it all goes back to shes right, fan ficcers are wrong, wrong, wrong and should burn in an eternal fire!

Yep. Very special snowflake.

(Reply to this)(Thread)


[info]dragonfangirl
2010-05-17 01:05 am UTC (link)
Tone argument, classical derailing tactic?

(Reply to this)(Parent)(Thread)

(no subject) - [info]cyndra_falin, 2010-05-17 08:09 am UTC

[info]izzy_the_hutt
2010-05-16 02:56 am UTC (link)
*scratches head*

What the shit?

(Reply to this)


[info]annepackrat
2010-05-16 03:27 am UTC (link)
So fanfiction is like doing predesigned needlepoint? Er, what?

Then again, if someone drew me one with my OTP on it, I'd have to take up crocheting.

(Reply to this)(Thread)

(Deleted post)
(no subject) - [info]shark, 2010-05-16 03:49 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]annepackrat, 2010-05-16 04:31 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]jonquil, 2010-05-16 06:42 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]bigbigtruck, 2010-05-17 11:51 pm UTC

[info]hadisia
2010-05-17 10:14 am UTC (link)
Calvinism for Stitch n' Bitches?

(Reply to this)(Parent)

(no subject) - [info]theelusiven, 2010-05-18 02:20 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]fyrdrakken, 2010-05-19 11:33 pm UTC

[info]arachnejericho
2010-05-16 04:40 am UTC (link)

(Reply to this)


[info]dragyn
2010-05-16 02:15 pm UTC (link)
Personally, I think this fanfic of the Diana Gabaldon kerfuffle has a paucity of imagination. And relatively dull.

F.T.W.

(Reply to this)


tetradecimal
2010-05-16 04:53 pm UTC (link)
However, the mobbing was rude to all the regular readers of this space. It bored them, it cut off their right of discussion, and I suspect it convinced some of them that my original post's opinion of fanfic writers was in the main correct.

I am the Kerr, I speak for the trees lurkers.

(Reply to this)


[info]issendai
2010-05-16 06:15 pm UTC (link)
Kerr's take on her readers' reaction is so far gone into denial that she's past the crocodiles, out of the water, and slogging dazedly through the Ethiopian desert. And when she finally makes it into Addis Ababa and checks into an Internet cafe to ask folks to wire her money to get home, her email is still going to be filled with comments saying, "DUDE. WHAT THE FUCK."

(Reply to this)(Thread)

(no subject) - [info]emily_goddess, 2010-05-17 05:09 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]ladyvyola, 2010-05-17 07:19 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]innocentsmith, 2010-05-18 06:09 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]issendai, 2010-05-18 03:23 pm UTC

(Deleted post)
(no subject) - [info]kita0610, 2010-05-16 09:04 pm UTC

[info]kirarose
2010-05-16 10:10 pm UTC (link)
This one doesn't know when to stop.

(Reply to this)(Thread)

(no subject) - [info]dragonfangirl, 2010-05-17 01:06 am UTC
I know I’m late to the party
[info]dana
2010-05-17 04:13 am UTC (link)
Here is my rant on Katherine Kerr's books, which I had in my head when I read her series, but now I can share it because dude, and maybe someone has already mentioned it, but I get frothy everytime I think of those books so I must vent.

Not to be confused with Katherine Kurtz who wrote similar genre but her books are cool….

(disclaimer it's been a few years since I read these books, so my details might be off, please feel free to correct)

The Deverry series of Kerr's, this is a series where this man and woman keep on getting reincarnated and falling in love with each other, or having attraction to each other in EVERY SINGLE incarnation BECAUSE IT'S epic eternal love, except the one where they are both incarnated as men, and then they are just BESTEST BEST FRIENDS ONLY OMG.

Which OK, that bugs me, but I'll let it slide, except there is only one gay character (there might be the suggestion that one is bisexual but it's been a while I can't remember, I think he was the half-brother of the hero) and this gay CHARACTER is evil dark wizard, super SUPER evil, and he likes to sodomise and torture his victims. And then when the hero comes to rescue one of the male victims who was coerced somewhat into doing something bad he was like 'OMG, yeah whatever you've been tortured and whatnot, but you've been RAPED BY A MAN, disgusting ick ick, go kill yourself, (I forget the outcome of that). And then when the EVIL gay villain has some suggestion that he might be attracted to the hero in some way, then the hero is like YOU MUST DIE, because all the torturing and generally being evil wasn't anything compared to daring to be attracted to hero.

God I hated that series.

(Reply to this)(Thread)

Re: I know I’m late to the party - [info]emily_goddess, 2010-05-17 05:11 am UTC
Re: I know I’m late to the party - [info]dana, 2010-05-17 05:23 am UTC
Re: I know I’m late to the party - [info]pfeffermuse, 2010-05-18 03:28 pm UTC
Re: I know I’m late to the party - [info]w00b, 2010-05-29 03:20 am UTC
and I wasn't imagining it - [info]dana, 2010-05-17 05:38 am UTC
Re: and I wasn't imagining it - [info]dragonfangirl, 2010-05-17 06:38 am UTC
Re: and I wasn't imagining it - [info]dana, 2010-05-17 07:09 am UTC
Re: I know I’m late to the party - [info]white_serpent, 2010-05-17 07:22 am UTC
Re: I know I’m late to the party - [info]dana, 2010-05-17 07:26 am UTC
Re: I know I’m late to the party - [info]white_serpent, 2010-05-17 06:08 pm UTC
Re: I know I’m late to the party - [info]aegflota, 2010-05-17 11:54 am UTC
Re: I know I’m late to the party - [info]aegflota, 2010-05-17 11:55 am UTC
Re: I know I’m late to the party - tetradecimal, 2010-05-17 03:32 pm UTC
Re: I know I’m late to the party - [info]sgaana, 2010-05-17 07:20 pm UTC
Re: I know I’m late to the party - tetradecimal, 2010-05-17 07:28 pm UTC
Re: I know I’m late to the party - [info]sgaana, 2010-05-17 07:34 pm UTC
Re: I know I’m late to the party - tetradecimal, 2010-05-17 08:34 pm UTC
Re: I know I’m late to the party - [info]white_serpent, 2010-05-17 08:13 pm UTC

[info]goblin
2010-05-17 03:29 pm UTC (link)
Where do people like Kerr and Sh*tt*rly get this idea that people disagreeing with you on the interwebs is "mobbing"?

When you become a midlist published author, do words suddenly start looking like pitchforks? Is it a weird form of acquired synthesia? Inquiring minds want to know!

(Reply to this)


[info]platedlizard
2010-05-18 01:16 am UTC (link)
The last link's baleeeted too.

(Reply to this)(Thread)

(no subject) - [info]platedlizard, 2010-05-18 01:19 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]arachnejericho, 2010-05-18 01:59 am UTC

[info]danceswithelvis
2010-05-18 07:34 pm UTC (link)
You know, I'm a bit strung up on cold/flu meds atm, and honestly thought this was part of some weird ass dream I had earlier...but, I came to check anyway. And it's real. I'm not sure if I feel vindicated for not having a seriously fucking weird dream about reading forums, or terrified that there is that much stupid in the world.

(Reply to this)(Thread)

fuck - [info]danceswithelvis, 2010-05-18 07:35 pm UTC
I went away and did the math.
[info]sapote3
2010-05-19 06:01 pm UTC (link)
It took me a couple of days to source this, but I think it's pretty accurate. According to the US Department of Labor, there are about 43,000 people who make their living through writing (including screenwriting, ads, movies, etc), but only about 8,000 that make a living writing for newspapers, periodicals, books, and directories (all combined). According to the Writer's Directory 2010, there are about 23,000 writers in the world who have published at least one book in English, including nonfiction works. The Directory of American Writers and Poets (again, including nonfiction) lists about 8,000 names. According to Wikipedia, fanfiction.net has two million users, and I don't even know how big lj fandom is - lj searches top out at 2,000 people. Heck, there as many active Dreamwidth accounts as there are writers who have published any book in English ever - 23,000ish.

So while my numbers are vague, I think the idea that we're a smaller population then prowriters is pretty laughable.

(Reply to this)(Thread)

Re: I went away and did the math. - [info]sapote3, 2010-05-19 06:33 pm UTC
I WOULD NOT HAVE POSTED THAT IF I KNEW I'D GET LINKED - [info]sapote3, 2010-05-19 08:58 pm UTC
Re: I WOULD NOT HAVE POSTED THAT IF I KNEW I'D GET LINKED - tetradecimal, 2010-05-19 09:19 pm UTC
Re: I WOULD NOT HAVE POSTED THAT IF I KNEW I'D GET LINKED - [info]sapote3, 2010-05-19 11:09 pm UTC
Re: I went away and did the math. - [info]issendai, 2010-05-19 09:53 pm UTC
Yay for pedantic! - [info]sapote3, 2010-05-19 11:08 pm UTC
Re: Yay for pedantic! - [info]issendai, 2010-05-20 04:24 pm UTC
Re: I went away and did the math. - [info]kattahj, 2010-05-21 09:54 pm UTC

[info]the_labrat_army
2010-05-20 01:09 am UTC (link)
Ooh, I missed all the hooplah, now that it went on for much longer than I initially read. Dammit, I`m pissed, always missing the good stuff. ;_;

Her B`rer Rabbit analogy is....um, extremely ironic in light of how utterly-BAHLEETED her journal now is.

(Reply to this)


[info]harukami
2010-05-21 04:12 am UTC (link)
I know that Shakespeare guy totally needed a real job, that unimaginative git.

(Reply to this)


[info]carmarthen
2010-05-28 05:42 am UTC (link)
What I took away from that is that hobbies are bad because you don't get paid (hence waste of time) and probably don't assemble everything from component atoms (hence unoriginal).

The craftwank brought a whole new level to the fanfiction-is-evil argument, I thought!

(Reply to this)



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