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	back_in_black 2010-06-20 10:34 pm UTC (link)
	I think it boils down to me liking art - drawings and paintings. My favorite cartoons are the really old ones where the backgrounds are watercolors. I'm sure there's an art to making 3D cartoons but I'm not privy to it. Oh god I hate the hype. (Reply to this)(Parent)(Thread)

	bellomee13 2010-06-21 03:39 am UTC (link)
	Not to start wank, but yes, there is an art to making 3D or CGI animation. It takes just as much skill to animate and color objects such as hair, clothes and the human figure in 3D as it does in 2D. It's not like you simply push a button and it instantly generates a character or motion. There's a lot of work needed to get the computer to behave the way you want. (Reply to this)(Parent)(Thread)

	back_in_black 2010-06-21 03:42 am UTC (link)
	Oh yeah, I know there's an art and that it's hard to do and it takes artists and lots of time. Like I said, I'm just not privy to it so I don't see it and can't really appreciate it other than in a special feature. I CAN paint and draw so I tend to appreciate that more. (Reply to this)(Parent)

beejium
2010-06-21 03:46 am UTC (link)

You should really take a look at some of the "Art of..." books from Pixar. There's some really incredible paintings in there that were used to set the tone for the movie, colour scripts, storyboards, design concepts, etc, all of which have to be done in 2D, then made into maquettes (at least for the main things) before they can even think about doing 3D art. (Some examples here, but it's best to just go to your nearest bookstore and sit down with one of the books.)

I respect your opinion on not liking Pixar movies, if that's how you feel, but claiming it's not art is just straight up ig'nant, dog.

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	back_in_black 2010-06-21 03:53 am UTC (link)
	No, you're misinterpreting me. I didn't say it wasn't art. I said it wasn't art I appreciated because it wasn't painted or drawn and I might appreciate it if I had the skills to understand how 3D animation was done. I don't have those skills. (Reply to this)(Parent)(Thread)

	beejium 2010-06-21 03:55 am UTC (link)
	Okay. But apart from the fact that I don't understand how you could not appreciate art without being able to do it (I can't paint, for instance, but I can still appreciate a beautiful painting when I see one), you're still completely ignoring all the so-called "appreciable" art that does go into making these movies. (Reply to this)(Parent)(Thread)

back_in_black
2010-06-21 04:06 am UTC (link)

What I mean by appreciate is I like to try and see what kind of brush or what brush size they might have been using, whether or not they made use of *trying to think of examles* stippling or pthalo green, etc, and wondering if I could reproduce it. I like to get really technical, I guess. I can't do that with Pixar. I just look at it and think 'Hey, that's 3D. I bet that was hard to do." The end.

My issues are not just with Pixar, btw. I deeply dislike 99% of Disney movies with a passion, too, and I have ever since I was very, very young. I kinda just...hate family films. I'm sure it's the lack of a soul that's responsible, as someone above kindly pointed out.

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	beejium 2010-06-21 04:08 am UTC (link)
	No, I get it. You want to play the "dark and tormented" card. Whatevs. (Reply to this)(Parent)(Thread)

back_in_black
2010-06-21 04:15 am UTC (link)

What? No. I just don't like cutesy things. You're reading an awful lot into what I've said. I don't like Disney because they tend to aim really restrictive gender roles at children. It's like, have a bundle of cute while we imply that you if you're not attractive you're probably evil. Enjoy, kids!

Also they seem to have this really weird agenda with making things sad so kids cry. I mean, it seems purposeful. Bambi, anyone? When I was a kid I felt stupid when I cried and therefore I didn't like Disney. That's not dark and tortured, it's the reverse. I wanted to be happy and I still do.

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cyndra_falin
2010-06-21 08:32 am UTC (link)

imply that you if you're not attractive you're probably evil

I never went for the Disney Princesses. To me, the evil Queens were always much more beautiful and very attractive. *shrug*

When I was a kid I felt stupid when I cried and therefore I didn't like Disney.

So was it ONE Disney movie that made you cry and because of that ONE movie, you decided to hate Disney? Or was it several in a row that made you come to this conclusion? I'm really curious.

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cyndra_falin, 2010-06-21 08:34 am UTC

argylespy
2010-06-21 08:43 pm UTC (link)

Bambi, anyone?

Check the source material. Salten didn't linger too much on the death of Bambi's mother but I figure it was kind of a trade-off on Disney's part since Bambi's cousin does die a heartbreaking death but also doesn't appear in the movie at all.

. . . actually, come to think of it, the whole book is really all about everyone around Bambi dying while he tries to figure out why he has such a Deep And Meaningful Connection to the Old Prince over the course of twenty-some-odd chapters.

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pandonkey, 2010-06-22 05:02 am UTC

	back_in_black 2010-06-21 04:36 am UTC (link)
	By the way, I apologize for starting a mini-wank on a post you made. I didn't realize I'd get a strong enough reaction to derail things with a really long and unrelated thread. I figured I'd get maybe a "Yeah, me too" or something, not all this. Sorry. (Reply to this)(Parent)

	demonoflight 2010-06-21 07:05 am UTC (link)
	points at your icon excitedly Corpse Bride!!! (Reply to this)(Parent)

	cmdr_zoom 2010-06-29 07:16 am UTC (link)
	I understand what you're saying, I think. I sometimes regret I don't know enough about music to appreciate it more. :/ That said, there's a lot of art I like as a pure consumer/viewer/listener, knowing little or nothing about the techniques employed in its creation. I wonder, why do you feel the "need" to know how it was done before you can like it (or not)? (Reply to this)(Parent)

	back_in_black 2010-06-21 04:07 am UTC (link)
	phthalo (Reply to this)(Parent)

	back_in_black 2010-06-21 03:55 am UTC (link)
	And obviously I was less than clear or I wouldn't have gotten so many comments, I think. I really do not like Pixar movies though. I think it's an aversion to cute and heartwarmingness or whatever you'd like to call it. I like explosions and zombies and people shooting at things, and Pixar movies don't have that. (Reply to this)(Parent)(Thread)

	bellomee13 2010-06-21 04:11 am UTC (link)
	Fair enough. Though I will say The Incredibles had two out of the three things you listed (though Brad Bird, if there is some small chance you read this, an Incredibles sequel where they fight zombies would kick ass.) True it has some heartwarmingness, but I felt it had enough explosions to balance it out. (Reply to this)(Parent)(Thread)

	back_in_black 2010-06-21 04:20 am UTC (link)
	That sounds cool, I'll watch that one if I get the chance. Thanks! (Reply to this)(Parent)

	chibikaijuu 2010-06-29 09:25 pm UTC (link)
	I second this. BRAD BIRD, BRAD BIRD, PLEASE GOOGLE YOURSELF AND SEE THIS. (Reply to this)(Parent)

mochibuni
2010-06-21 10:33 am UTC (link)

But that's doesn't change that they tend to be legitimately good movies. Just because they don't pander to your aesthetic doesn't make them shit, that sort of thing. They clearly aren't meant for you, but that doesn't make them some little kid's macaroni project that will never see the light of day after it's removed from the refrigerator until Michael Bay attempts to blow it up.

On a side note, you'd probably like A.D. It's a (hopefully to be released) 3D movie about the zombie apocalypse. I'm totes excited.

*Arrrg, didn't link the trailer!

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	cyndra_falin 2010-06-21 06:36 pm UTC (link)
	BAY-SPLOSIONS!!!! (Reply to this)(Parent)(Thread)

	mochibuni 2010-06-22 02:48 am UTC (link)
	I read "BABY-SPLOSIONS," and, well, I'm sure you can imagine what I thought up. (Reply to this)(Parent)

	weyrlady 2010-06-21 04:59 pm UTC (link)
	I'd be curious as to your opinion on Mulan, which is a Disney movie that a) laughs hysterically at gender roles b) has a really sexy main villain and c) has lots of explosions and people shooting at things. Have you seen it? (Reply to this)(Parent)(Thread)

	argylespy 2010-06-21 08:48 pm UTC (link)
	Also ghosts! Which are not quite zombies but who's keeping track? And one of them is George Takei and that is reason enough right there if you ask me. (Reply to this)(Parent)

	chibikaijuu 2010-06-29 09:27 pm UTC (link)
	And even Eddie Murphy was still somewhat tolerable back then! And B. D. Wong is in it. Also it is really really pretty. (Reply to this)(Parent)

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