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Rukia ([info]_rukia) wrote in [info]fandom_wank,
@ 2010-07-13 13:36:00


Previous Entry  Add to memories!  Tell a Friend!  Next Entry
Entry tags:but what are your thoughts on otps?, doesn't mean what you think it means, fandom: doctor who, fandom_wank's thoughts on yaoi, meme origins, persecution, putting the 'me' in 'semiotics', stop sharing your thoughts

Small Who fandom wank
[info]mrv3000 sets out to address a lingering prejudice in fandom, one she is personally affected by. Doesn't sound funny so far, right? Just wait.

You see, it's not racism, or sexism, or classism, or anything similar Miss 3000 feels the need to address, oh no! Instead, she decides to discuss one of the more persistent problems in fandom: the horrors of OTP-ism! For you see, according to her:

I'm a serial OTP-er. I rather doubt this will ever change. Pretty much all of my fannish experience (even before the 10 years I've been hanging out in fandom) has been me latching on to one pairing and squeeing the hell out of it. I don't find it particularly juvenile that I generally only ship one pairing, but yet I see so many comments that indicate as much. That somehow a person is enlightened if they can multi-ship (or really enlightened if they like threesomes or more) and some sort of idiot fangirl if they OTP. Or that if a person has an OTP, then by that very definition they must be on a crusade to wreck every other pairing. Um, say what? Just because I don't find some other ship plausable doesn't mean that someone else can't. (Unless they believe that my thinking trumps their thinking; in which case, dude, get me a latte! I've always wanted a minion!)

Many people agree (especially at first), several people don't, and the whole thing rapidly spirals into a debate about whether or not 'mono-shipping' is the same as OTPing and if the 'true' in One True Pairing inherently invalidates all other ships. [info]jaythenerdkid/[info]bewarethespork writes a reaction post discussing 'sign-systems' as they relate to Doctor/Rose shippers, where people respond Very Seriously, and the entire thing pretty much reads like a war about whose shipping patterns are betterer with some big words thrown in.




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[info]sarracenia
2010-07-13 11:19 pm UTC (link)
What if I have an OTP that is an OTO, and I'd be very sad if anyone paired anyone in the orgy with anyone outside the orgy? Where do I fall on this scale of elitism?

(Reply to this)(Thread)

(no subject) - [info]artimusdin, 2010-07-13 11:25 pm UTC

[info]seca
2010-07-13 11:21 pm UTC (link)
Only in DW fandom would there be shipping-wank about how to ship.

(Reply to this)(Thread)

(no subject) - [info]artimusdin, 2010-07-13 11:24 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]doyle, 2010-07-13 11:36 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]seca, 2010-07-14 12:06 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]artimusdin, 2010-07-14 12:07 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]_rukia, 2010-07-13 11:48 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]octavia, 2010-07-14 10:20 am UTC

[info]eiviiaru
2010-07-13 11:26 pm UTC (link)
The best part of this is the weird meta-level where, beyond this being yet another OTP vs. Multishipping argument, it's actually Round 217 of Huge Majority Ship vs. Everyone Else In The Fandom. Old fandom arguments never die; they just regenerate and have to lie down in the Zero Room for a while.

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(no subject) - [info]cmdr_zoom, 2010-07-14 12:05 am UTC
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[info]phosfate
2010-07-13 11:41 pm UTC (link)
She must be so alone...so alone...

(Reply to this)


[info]mariem_1
2010-07-13 11:57 pm UTC (link)
There is also wank about it on wank_report.

(Reply to this)(Thread)

(no subject) - [info]eldritch, 2010-07-14 12:00 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]m_butterfly, 2010-07-14 05:57 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]seca, 2010-07-14 12:18 am UTC
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(no subject) - [info]drakyndra, 2010-07-14 10:17 am UTC

[info]rose_tyler
2010-07-14 12:08 am UTC (link)
Eh, this actually bugs me too. It is annoying in fandom to be treated as a fangirl or a close minded fan just because you are monoshippy. EveryonexEveryone is nice if that's what you like, but not everyone does and there's nothing wrong with that.

I haven't read all the comments yet, but I see nothing wrong and certainly nothing wanky about the original post.

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(no subject) - [info]risha, 2010-07-14 06:25 pm UTC
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A question from reading the full mrv3000 post.
[info]seca
2010-07-14 12:28 am UTC (link)
So if with each regeneration the Doctor changes so much to be considered a different person then how does Eleven/Amy even affect the Ten/Rose pairing?

(Reply to this)(Thread)

Re: A question from reading the full mrv3000 post. - [info]oxfordcomma, 2010-07-14 01:08 am UTC
Re: A question from reading the full mrv3000 post. - [info]seca, 2010-07-14 02:08 am UTC
Re: A question from reading the full mrv3000 post. - [info]alienist, 2010-07-14 05:48 am UTC
... - [info]ghostmaster, 2010-07-14 12:24 pm UTC
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Re: A question from reading the full mrv3000 post. - [info]skarrow, 2010-07-14 12:48 pm UTC
Re: A question from reading the full mrv3000 post. - [info]spawn_of_kong, 2010-07-14 01:53 am UTC
Re: A question from reading the full mrv3000 post. - [info]oxfordcomma, 2010-07-14 01:58 am UTC
Re: A question from reading the full mrv3000 post. - [info]lady_ganesh, 2010-07-14 01:42 pm UTC
Re: A question from reading the full mrv3000 post. - [info]seca, 2010-07-14 02:09 am UTC
Re: A question from reading the full mrv3000 post. - [info]spawn_of_kong, 2010-07-14 02:44 am UTC

[info]twinno
2010-07-14 12:32 am UTC (link)
Good use of the word "betterer," OP.

(Reply to this)


[info]gerorin
2010-07-14 12:41 am UTC (link)
As a fairly faithful shipper who sometimes only ships one pairing per fandom and generally don't pair off her ships with anybody else, I... don't see the appeal of telling other people How To Ship is SRS BZNZ.

Ah, Who fandom.

(Reply to this)


[info]ladyofviolets
2010-07-14 12:56 am UTC (link)
FFFFFF, why can't people just either multi-ship or OTP-ship and leave the others alone? No need to act uppity over such stuff.

(Reply to this)(Thread)

(no subject) - [info]dark_puck, 2010-07-14 03:03 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]rusty_halo, 2010-07-14 05:55 pm UTC

[info]snacky
2010-07-14 01:03 am UTC (link)
you need to be aware of the context and history behind your words

Is there an entrance exam one must take before entering into Doctor Who fandom? You know, so one will be aware of the context and history? Is [info]jaythenerdkid in charge of administering it and grading it?

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(no subject) - [info]oxfordcomma, 2010-07-14 01:11 am UTC
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(no subject) - [info]evilsqueakers, 2010-07-14 12:22 pm UTC

[info]risha
2010-07-14 02:49 am UTC (link)
Pshaw. I ship The Doctor/TARDIS, and everyone knows, deep down in their hearts, that I am right.

(Reply to this)(Thread)

(no subject) - [info]spawn_of_kong, 2010-07-14 02:53 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]risha, 2010-07-14 06:20 am UTC
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[info]re_weird
2010-07-14 02:55 am UTC (link)
I can't believe they're lecturing on semiotics to explain how you're doing shipping wrong.

(Reply to this)(Thread)

(no subject) - [info]jaythenerdkid, 2010-07-14 06:18 am UTC

[info]nostalgia
2010-07-14 03:10 am UTC (link)

I just enjoy oppressing people IS THAT SO WRONG?

(Reply to this)(Thread)

(no subject) - [info]veleda_k, 2010-07-14 05:35 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]nostalgia, 2010-07-14 05:38 am UTC
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[info]lydiabell
2010-07-14 05:59 am UTC (link)
I feel like Rip Van Winkle or something. Like I just woke up after 20 years and suddenly there are entire swaths of fandom where "OTP" = "the only valid pairing, and anyone who ships any other pairing is DOIN IT RONG".

Did HP fandom start this bastardization? Is HP, once again, the reason we can't have nice things?

(Reply to this)(Thread)

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... - [info]lady_ganesh, 2010-07-14 01:46 pm UTC
... - [info]ecchaniz0r, 2010-07-14 03:52 pm UTC
... - [info]lady_ganesh, 2010-07-14 04:07 pm UTC
... - [info]sapote3, 2010-07-15 02:24 am UTC
... - [info]phosfate, 2010-07-14 03:30 pm UTC
... - [info]gerorin, 2010-07-14 04:24 pm UTC
... - [info]veleda_k, 2010-07-14 05:34 pm UTC
... - [info]gerorin, 2010-07-14 06:32 pm UTC
... - [info]risha, 2010-07-14 06:50 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]lydiabell, 2010-07-15 04:21 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]dragonfangirl, 2010-07-14 02:49 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]gerorin, 2010-07-14 04:26 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]rusty_halo, 2010-07-14 06:07 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]victoriabloom, 2010-07-14 08:18 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]surrexi, 2010-07-15 11:07 am UTC

[info]agent_hyatt
2010-07-14 06:07 am UTC (link)
I'm just relieved that it's not Amy/Rory wank.

(Reply to this)(Thread)

(no subject) - [info]anthologia, 2010-07-14 06:19 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]agent_hyatt, 2010-07-14 08:09 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]coffee_mug, 2010-07-14 08:33 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]agent_hyatt, 2010-07-14 08:45 pm UTC
... - [info]coffee_mug, 2010-07-14 09:25 pm UTC

[info]jaythenerdkid
2010-07-14 06:17 am UTC (link)
*sigh* And yet, at the end of the day, there are still very few people who subscribe to my real thesis: that if there really is an OTP in this fandom, it's clearly Seven/Ace.

(Reply to this)(Thread)

(no subject) - [info]risha, 2010-07-14 06:24 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]jaythenerdkid, 2010-07-14 06:27 am UTC
... - [info]risha, 2010-07-14 06:55 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]alienist, 2010-07-14 05:44 pm UTC
... - [info]singe, 2010-07-14 09:09 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]cmdr_zoom, 2010-07-14 08:21 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]jaythenerdkid, 2010-07-14 08:25 am UTC

(Deleted post)
... - [info]jaythenerdkid, 2010-07-14 08:35 am UTC

(Deleted post)
... - [info]jaythenerdkid, 2010-07-14 09:22 am UTC

(Deleted post)
... - [info]jaythenerdkid, 2010-07-14 09:29 am UTC

(Deleted post)
... - [info]jaythenerdkid, 2010-07-14 09:34 am UTC

(Deleted post)
... - [info]jaythenerdkid, 2010-07-14 10:03 am UTC
... - [info]singe, 2010-07-14 09:24 pm UTC
... - [info]jaythenerdkid, 2010-07-15 06:35 am UTC
... - [info]risha, 2010-07-15 08:25 am UTC
... - [info]jaythenerdkid, 2010-07-15 08:28 am UTC
... - [info]risha, 2010-07-15 08:38 am UTC
... - [info]jaythenerdkid, 2010-07-15 08:51 am UTC
... - [info]chibikaijuu, 2010-07-19 09:49 am UTC
... - [info]singe, 2010-07-15 10:02 pm UTC
... - [info]touchofstrange, 2010-07-15 08:43 pm UTC
... - [info]jaythenerdkid, 2010-07-16 12:53 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]ide_cyan, 2010-07-14 09:38 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]skarrow, 2010-07-14 12:51 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]jaythenerdkid, 2010-07-14 12:54 pm UTC
... - [info]skarrow, 2010-07-14 12:58 pm UTC
... - [info]jaythenerdkid, 2010-07-14 01:08 pm UTC
... - [info]dweo, 2010-07-14 06:55 pm UTC
... - [info]jaythenerdkid, 2010-07-14 06:58 pm UTC
... - [info]dweo, 2010-07-14 06:54 pm UTC
... - [info]amaresu, 2010-07-14 08:33 pm UTC
... - [info]skarrow, 2010-07-14 10:36 pm UTC
... - [info]biichan, 2010-07-15 06:40 am UTC
... - [info]skarrow, 2010-07-15 06:41 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]biichan, 2010-07-15 06:37 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]jaythenerdkid, 2010-07-15 06:41 am UTC
... - [info]touchofstrange, 2010-07-15 08:51 pm UTC
... - [info]jaythenerdkid, 2010-07-16 12:55 am UTC
... - [info]kelmendi, 2010-07-17 05:30 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]touchofstrange, 2010-07-15 08:41 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]jaythenerdkid, 2010-07-16 12:52 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]chibikaijuu, 2010-07-19 09:52 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]jaythenerdkid, 2010-07-19 10:58 am UTC

[info]sunhawk
2010-07-14 06:26 am UTC (link)
I'm a little taken aback by how many people are saying they were completely unaware of a) the "universal" meaning to OTP and b) the fact that many fandoms have fans who believe in the universal meaning and do, in fact, engage in the sort of "crazy OTP" stereotype stuff that is being protested. It must be nice in your fandoms!

(Reply to this)(Thread)

(no subject) - [info]ghostmaster, 2010-07-14 12:38 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]agent_hyatt, 2010-07-14 05:33 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]sunhawk, 2010-07-15 02:22 am UTC

[info]poisonyoulove
2010-07-14 06:52 am UTC (link)
Four/multi-colored-scarf is my OTP.
Anyone who ships Four/season-18-scarf IS A FILTHY WHORE!

(Reply to this)(Thread)

(no subject) - [info]silrana, 2010-07-14 12:41 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]alienist, 2010-07-14 05:43 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]spawn_of_kong, 2010-07-14 03:45 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]theelusiven, 2010-07-14 06:18 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]singe, 2010-07-14 09:30 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]cynicat, 2010-07-19 02:57 pm UTC

[info]chikane
2010-07-14 07:39 am UTC (link)
People, proudly stating that your intrepetation of a word is the only one valid isn't too different from people saying only their couple is valid.

It makes the objection pretty much hilarious.

Anyway... *Oppresses everyone with the OTP in her icon*

(Reply to this)


[info]herongale
2010-07-14 09:46 am UTC (link)
And this is what happens when fandoms cross-pollinate!

Seriously, different fandoms have different cultures... hell, most fandoms have tons of subcultures under the main fannish umbrella. In each of these little groups, everyone has their established, "understood" way to use certain popular generic fannish terms, such as the term "OTP." Worse, within each of these cultures, there's always going to be that debate over whether the "understood" way that the majority subscribes to is correct, and then there are always the mini revolutionaries who insist on having their own personal definition (not that there's anything wrong with this, I love being a mini revolutionary).

And people are SURPRISED that it's all different everywhere? God, I dunno. Maybe I've just been around too long, but I don't ever make any assumptions about what someone means by "OTP" anymore. A big part of the fun of fandom is having these discussions over and over again with all the new people you meet, precisely because everyone has their own special little story and most people are more than happy to tell it.

And yet, on the meta level it often feels kind of silly to me. Where people seem to be trying to extract some deeper, profound meaning out of these ongoing discussions in fandom. And it's when you get these "deeper meaning" conversations that all the contentiousness and wank comes in, because the further one moves away from talking about person preferences into the realm of SHOULD and SHOULDN'T, the more one gets into judgmental asshat behavior, as we see so beautifully demonstrated on page two of that wank.

Like, it's so obvious that the big problem there is that no one is listening to each other. Instead they'd rather spout off on their pet definitions and look for offense when they are being challenged, instead of seeing that maybe THEY ALL ACTUALLY AGREE. Because you know, they do. The ACTUAL bigger point there is the idea that fans should live and let live, and it seems like whether you have one OTP or fifty OTPs, or multi-ship, or wear Hawaii like a hat on your head, the overall consensus that they are failing to see is the the fact that none of them really want to mess with each other's fannish glee.

I'm finding this generally hilarious, so thank you. XD

(Reply to this)(Thread)

(no subject) - [info]snacky, 2010-07-14 05:13 pm UTC

[info]kuromitsu
2010-07-14 11:19 am UTC (link)
Damn, I commented on the post before checking here. :/ (But then, I agree with her.)

(Reply to this)(Thread)

(no subject) - [info]lady_ganesh, 2010-07-14 04:00 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]snacky, 2010-07-14 05:11 pm UTC

[info]tez
2010-07-14 01:24 pm UTC (link)
Apparently this wank is sort of like Pokerus minus the beneficial effects: you catch it yourself if you're next to it for too long.

(Reply to this)


[info]iczer6
2010-07-14 07:43 pm UTC (link)
So anyone else ship Amy/Vincent Van Gogh?

(Reply to this)(Thread)

(no subject) - [info]bienegold, 2010-07-14 08:33 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]singe, 2010-07-14 09:34 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]deludedvision, 2010-07-15 02:25 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]alienist, 2010-07-15 08:07 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]squeakytoy, 2010-07-15 10:54 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]chibikaijuu, 2010-07-19 09:55 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]misachan, 2010-07-22 05:45 am UTC



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