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duraniedrama (![[info]](http://www.journalfen.net/img/userinfo.gif){kind=small} duraniedrama) wrote in ![[info]](http://www.journalfen.net/img/community.gif){kind=small} fandom_wank,@ 2011-07-03 20:47:00 |
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Another Doomed Attempt to Monetize Fanfic
(Thanks to the mousey on wank_report for the original notice andqem_chibati for boosting the signal on clairvoyantwank. I think it's grown all big enough for a Fandom Wank entry of its very own.)
Meet Keith Mander. He posts about things like the hierarchical ranking of how deep a company actively utilises social media and he buys websites. His recent purchases include Just Pooh (a Winnie-the-Pooh site) and he "snapped up" Twilight Archives, a Twilight fic site a couple of months ago. You can read about his purchase of Just Pooh here, where he shares such wisdom as:
I tend to avoid marketplaces such as SitePoint and eBay. Sellers using one of these platforms tend to have a better understanding of their site’s value, and therefore have higher expectations. My approach would be to directly contact site owners who are unaware of their site’s value and who’ve never experimented with online advertising. They’re usually surprised when you contact them with an offer and this eases the negotiation process. The potential with this approach is far greater.
His latest purchase? Lotrfanfiction.com, a site for fanfiction devoted to The Lord of the Rings. Yes, this would the same site that warned people about the debacle that was FanLib.
The announcement comes pretty much out of the blue, after a few mysterious days of the site being inaccessible and the fen getting nervous.
Hello,
My name is Keith and I'm delighted to make this very special announcement.
I've been talking with Adora for several weeks about the future of the site. We've come to an agreement where I will be taking on ownership and technical responsibilities for the site.
I can appreciate that this might surprise many of you. Rest assured that all of your stories are safe and the site will continue to exist for a long time to come.
Adora will continue to be very much involved with the site as the founder and moderator. You'll still be able to reach her using her site related e-mail address.
Adora has done an incredible job growing the community over the past 7-years and I'm super excited about helping take the site to the next stage as a team. Expect an all new design, new features and lots more over the coming month or two.
Please shoot an email to keith@lotrfanfiction.com if you spot anything that's not working on the site or if you'd like to chat!
I'll post more information about the plans real soon.
Speak to you again soon,
Keith
People are not reassured by this, particularly after Googling Mr. Mander and finding his previous dealings in buying and 'monetizing' websites.
I must admit that I'm rather concerned about this. You own a company that makes money from buying popular websites, which is fine - but I did not agree that my stories will earn money for the owner of this website when I signed up for the archive. I post these stories for free, so fellow fans might enjoy them - I most definitely do not want to be a user who generates free content for one of the many companies who want to make mone from the social media boom.
Furthermore, I am a little concerned about the legal aspects here. Fanfiction by its nature occupies a grey zone in the copyright and IP debates, and while I do think of fanfiction as trannsformative work that fulfils the requirements of fair use, the moment you try to earn money with it, it becomes quite a different matter. The Tolkien Estate particularly is very, very protective of their copyright, and I'd hate to see our entire fandom targeted because of this.
Previous owner Adora responds:
Fandom is about the gift, yes. I get that.
That is exactly why I've chosen to devote the time, effort and expense required to run the site for the past seven years. I wanted to give back to the community. This is also why I've never cluttered the site up with ads or attempted to profit off of it in any way.
I have paid out my ass for server fees for nearly a decade that I cannot afford. People love to talk about the supportive nature of fandom, but that doesn't extend to financial matters. I have requested donations several times over the past few years, in addition to providing a donation button directly on the site.
Do you know how many people have contributed over the years? I can count them on one hand.
I'm not criticizing people for that. I'm just saying that even within a fandom that ideally, shouldn't have anything to do with financial issues, someone has to pay.
I don't think it's necessarily fair to get all idealistic about the concept of someone making a little profit off of a site, when nobody seems to be bothered by the alternative of someone having to strain their own finances to keep a site open in the first place.
I've reached the point where I either needed to close the site... or I had to let go of financial responsibility. I felt that selling to Keith and working with him as a team was my best option.
That being said, I didn't just sell the site without extensive negotiation and stipulations in the contract that would allow me a high level of permanent involvement in the community and would protect members and their work.
I wish people would withhold judgment and talk to me about it directly if they have concerns, rather than assuming the worst.
I've chosen an option that not only allows us to keep the site open, but gives me the ability to work with someone who has the time and resources to improve the site in ways that I simply can't do at this time.
People will still be able to read, share and review stories, which was the entire point of the site in the first place.
This, of course, assumes that people are willing to keep their stories there under the new management. A number of writers start packing their stories away and find to their utter frustration that they are unable to delete their accounts there.
Elf at DreamWidth has collected the past week or so of links so far, mostly of the screams resounding around fandom. There is MUCH to be read there.
The most recent update is that Adora and Keith have thrown up the white flag and are placing all previous plans "on hold." Still, there's lots of amusing reading, especially down at Mr. Mander's blog where he flails around and tries to defend his business plan.
(Thanks to the mousey on wank_report for the original notice and
qem_chibati for boosting the signal on clairvoyantwank. I think it's grown all big enough for a Fandom Wank entry of its very own.)Meet Keith Mander. He posts about things like the hierarchical ranking of how deep a company actively utilises social media and he buys websites. His recent purchases include Just Pooh (a Winnie-the-Pooh site) and he "snapped up" Twilight Archives, a Twilight fic site a couple of months ago. You can read about his purchase of Just Pooh here, where he shares such wisdom as:
I tend to avoid marketplaces such as SitePoint and eBay. Sellers using one of these platforms tend to have a better understanding of their site’s value, and therefore have higher expectations. My approach would be to directly contact site owners who are unaware of their site’s value and who’ve never experimented with online advertising. They’re usually surprised when you contact them with an offer and this eases the negotiation process. The potential with this approach is far greater.
His latest purchase? Lotrfanfiction.com, a site for fanfiction devoted to The Lord of the Rings. Yes, this would the same site that warned people about the debacle that was FanLib.
The announcement comes pretty much out of the blue, after a few mysterious days of the site being inaccessible and the fen getting nervous.
Hello,
My name is Keith and I'm delighted to make this very special announcement.
I've been talking with Adora for several weeks about the future of the site. We've come to an agreement where I will be taking on ownership and technical responsibilities for the site.
I can appreciate that this might surprise many of you. Rest assured that all of your stories are safe and the site will continue to exist for a long time to come.
Adora will continue to be very much involved with the site as the founder and moderator. You'll still be able to reach her using her site related e-mail address.
Adora has done an incredible job growing the community over the past 7-years and I'm super excited about helping take the site to the next stage as a team. Expect an all new design, new features and lots more over the coming month or two.
Please shoot an email to keith@lotrfanfiction.com if you spot anything that's not working on the site or if you'd like to chat!
I'll post more information about the plans real soon.
Speak to you again soon,
Keith
People are not reassured by this, particularly after Googling Mr. Mander and finding his previous dealings in buying and 'monetizing' websites.
I must admit that I'm rather concerned about this. You own a company that makes money from buying popular websites, which is fine - but I did not agree that my stories will earn money for the owner of this website when I signed up for the archive. I post these stories for free, so fellow fans might enjoy them - I most definitely do not want to be a user who generates free content for one of the many companies who want to make mone from the social media boom.
Furthermore, I am a little concerned about the legal aspects here. Fanfiction by its nature occupies a grey zone in the copyright and IP debates, and while I do think of fanfiction as trannsformative work that fulfils the requirements of fair use, the moment you try to earn money with it, it becomes quite a different matter. The Tolkien Estate particularly is very, very protective of their copyright, and I'd hate to see our entire fandom targeted because of this.
Previous owner Adora responds:
Fandom is about the gift, yes. I get that.
That is exactly why I've chosen to devote the time, effort and expense required to run the site for the past seven years. I wanted to give back to the community. This is also why I've never cluttered the site up with ads or attempted to profit off of it in any way.
I have paid out my ass for server fees for nearly a decade that I cannot afford. People love to talk about the supportive nature of fandom, but that doesn't extend to financial matters. I have requested donations several times over the past few years, in addition to providing a donation button directly on the site.
Do you know how many people have contributed over the years? I can count them on one hand.
I'm not criticizing people for that. I'm just saying that even within a fandom that ideally, shouldn't have anything to do with financial issues, someone has to pay.
I don't think it's necessarily fair to get all idealistic about the concept of someone making a little profit off of a site, when nobody seems to be bothered by the alternative of someone having to strain their own finances to keep a site open in the first place.
I've reached the point where I either needed to close the site... or I had to let go of financial responsibility. I felt that selling to Keith and working with him as a team was my best option.
That being said, I didn't just sell the site without extensive negotiation and stipulations in the contract that would allow me a high level of permanent involvement in the community and would protect members and their work.
I wish people would withhold judgment and talk to me about it directly if they have concerns, rather than assuming the worst.
I've chosen an option that not only allows us to keep the site open, but gives me the ability to work with someone who has the time and resources to improve the site in ways that I simply can't do at this time.
People will still be able to read, share and review stories, which was the entire point of the site in the first place.
This, of course, assumes that people are willing to keep their stories there under the new management. A number of writers start packing their stories away and find to their utter frustration that they are unable to delete their accounts there.
Elf at DreamWidth has collected the past week or so of links so far, mostly of the screams resounding around fandom. There is MUCH to be read there.
The most recent update is that Adora and Keith have thrown up the white flag and are placing all previous plans "on hold." Still, there's lots of amusing reading, especially down at Mr. Mander's blog where he flails around and tries to defend his business plan.
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