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Dina ([info]redina) wrote in [info]fandom_wank,
@ 2003-10-26 17:08:00


Previous Entry  Add to memories!  Tell a Friend!  Next Entry
Who says DomLij has all the 'fun'?
There's this wonderful thing called LOTR RPS. I'm fond of it from an entertainment and fictional POV. While some of the actors are... amused by the imagination of fans.

Now, there's two rather large LOTR RPS lists on Yahoogroups: LOTR_RPS and Closer Than Brothers (CTB).

Rest of wank follows:

One of the reasons CTB was created may have been because LOTR_RPS was more open to discussion and all sorts of LOTR RPS-based fic, which some were bothered by and they would later branch off to form CTB.

The CTB list is the second largest LOTR RPS list AFAIK and because of this still 'holds cards' in this division of the fandom.

I'm going to skip over the wank involving me and the CTB mods and the privately emailed threat I received. It's also amusing but I've had my 'bad days' as well.

However, I know this gal, Connie, and others do too. She has shown a good sense of humour and is friendly on LOTRGossip@yahoogroups.com.

Evidently, Yahoogroups has been acting more wonky than usual (I've heard one person say she's lost hundreds of Y!G emails this week) and Connie emailed out a message to CTB:

I am not receiving any e-mail from any of my yahoo groups. I am
trying to keep track of things at the group sites, but it's hit or
miss. I'm VERY agravated as you can imagine, if it's something
crucial, please have someone notify me by my private
email... ***email edited out for posting to wank***
Thanks!
Connie


Okay, probably not the best choice to post that to CTB and I'll explain why later on.

What she got was an admin response of:
For the millionth (at least) time, OFF TOPIC MESSAGES
ARE NOT ALLOWED ON THIS LIST. Do NOT make off-topic
posts here!

Wendy
List Owner



Connie's final on-list CTB response:
I see that I was in error. I will take my name off of your list so that you
won't have to deal with my heinous errors again.

If you'll look at my message, you will see that I was already having
difficulty with my accounts, and trying to get them up and running. To reduce someone
who is already stressed to tears is not an act of kindness.

I won't bother you again.
Connie



Again, probably not the best response because I've seen what the CTB mods post in the past. I'll stand by what I said earlier that Connie is a nice person... and was obviously having a bad day.

Apparently, she received a final response from Wendy, which can be found on LOTRGossip:
} I see that I was in error. I will take my name off
} of your list so that you
} won't have to deal with my heinous errors again.

Thank you. It saves me the effort.

} If you'll look at my message, you will see that I
} was already having
} difficulty with my accounts, and trying to get them
} up and running. To reduce someone
} who is already stressed to tears is not an act of
} kindness.

If you're going to cry over that, you've got serious
mental problems that I can't help you with.



As an extra bonus from the same mod, a posting made to a Viggo Mortensen list back in June:
I also run a rather active list of over 1400 people. The rules there are more stringent than the rules here...yet nobody bitches, nobody moans, and everybody gets along. We post all the time on that list.

This is not a Hollywood gossip rag. Viggo's personal life is none of our business. That is why we have rules. It's a matter of respect.

As far as people not posting here -- that is not my fault. I set the list up so people could get together and chat. I am not the entertainment staff, and I'm not about to force people to talk. Talk or don't talk... frankly, I don't care.


Okay, this mod has multiple 'bad days'. {g}

Based on the membership number and the fact this listmod is also known for moderating on this list, I'm assuming it's CTB. Now, I learned about LOTRGossip from CTB's FAQ. Almost ironic to be anti-LOTR Gossip but pro-LOTR RPS.

As to why most 'got along', 'fear' tends to be a pretty good incentive...

Now, what some folks may have missed was the CTB rules had this moderation clause in their rules at one point:
The new rules are as follows:
7. List members making "one liner" posts will be placed on moderated status for one week. After they have been placed back on regular status, any further one-liner posts will result in indefinite moderated status and/or removal from the list at the owners' discretion.

8. List members making OT posts (with or without the labeling) will be subject to disciplinary action based on the owners' discretion. If we deem it a 'mild' offense, we will send a warning first. If not, and for the second offense following a warning, moderated status for one week will result. Further infractions will result in further moderation (one month) and then removal from the list.

9. Fics posted without the proper warnings (ie. death, NCS, squicks, etc.) will be removed from the Yahoogroups archive and will not be archived on the BTF site. The author will be placed on moderated status, length of which is at the owners' discretion. The fic may be resubmitted with proper warnings attached.

10. Fics posted with unbeta-ed and/or with improper grammar and/or spelling... will be removed from the Yahoogroups archive and will not be archived on the BTF site. The author will be placed on moderated status for one month and directed to a beta-reader's list. Further posting of improper grammar and spelling after this will result in removal from the list.

11. ANYONE caught forwarding fics off of this list to someone NOT subscribed to this list WITHOUT permission from the author of that fic will be removed from the list and banned with no warning. If you have friends not on the list who would like to read the stories, please direct them to join the list or to contact the individual authors. Do not forward the fics.

Please note. We will be harsh. Let me repeat that....we will be harsh. We view this list as a haven and we are sick of bad-fic. Yes, we know that you have the right to speak and write whatever you choose. You will just not do it on *our* list. There are plenty of RPS lists that have little standards and we are not one of them. We apologize for any confusion this may cause with writers whose work is not up to our basic standards, yet we remain resolved to stand firm. If your fics are deleted from the archive and you receive a moderation status notice, you may e-mail us and we will work with you to help you. Or you may leave.


There's almost something... impressive to that. Obviously, Connie fell under #8.

I will note the list rules have recently been revamped to edit out the phrase 'placed on moderation'.

As an additional comment, on-list feedback was somewhat discouraged at one point. So, current on-list feedbacks are very limited and often only from newbies, who aren't aware of the 'it's best to keep out of sight' (lurking) practice some have taken up.

Back to the moderation clauses... Okay, I can understand the why for some of this. I think the problem lies in we obviously don't read rules that much. {g}

For many lists, they aren't structured to be a 'democracy' and this is something a number of us realize when signing on. Although, some do practice stricter rules more than others. {g}

Dunno, I think LOTR RPS fans can 'compete' with Harry Potter fans.



(Post a new comment)


(Anonymous)
2003-10-27 12:11 am UTC (link)
A cut, a cut! My entire bukkake video collection for a cut!

Really, that's too long to be there uncut...

~Julia

(Reply to this)(Thread)


[info]redina
2003-10-27 12:13 am UTC (link)
{chuckle} Yeah, I noticed within two minutes the cuts didn't kick in.

(Reply to this)(Parent)(Thread)

(no subject) - (Anonymous), 2003-10-27 12:18 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]redina, 2003-10-27 12:23 am UTC

[info]gabbyhope
2003-10-27 12:21 am UTC (link)
Seems you're missing an italics tag somewhere.

I tend to think that Wendy is forever in a bad mood (she once sniped at me after I called her 'love' while correcting a statement she had made to the group), but she's always in the right for pointing out the rules. I'm a member of both lotr_rps and CTB, but the reason why I am on no-mail at lotr_rps is that it's all omg elijah and orli r sooo hottt! and there's only so much of that I can take without my eyeballs melting and leaking out of my head. Did you see the email that was sent to the list not ten minutes ago from someone named Mother (dlr mother, methinks)? To paraphrase, "You're a meanie for treating my friends like that, so I'm unsubbing, too!!!1" pffft. Grow spines, people! And learn not to make OT posts on OT-free groups.

Lotrips: still not as wanky as HP, but dammit, we're trying our hardest to get there!

(Reply to this)(Thread)


[info]redina
2003-10-27 12:33 am UTC (link)
Damn, y'all are quick to read. {g} Unfortunately, I didn't notice any 'preview' option until it was sent to the group. I usually try to 'proof' posts.

As to the chatty side of LOTR_RPS, there is actually a fic-only version of LOTR_RPS. Comes in handy at times. Although, the posting still has to be relayed to the main group.

(Reply to this)(Parent)(Thread)

(no subject) - [info]redina, 2003-10-27 12:35 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]iamtheenemy, 2003-10-27 12:43 am UTC

[info]iamtheenemy
2003-10-27 12:28 am UTC (link)
Wow. Uhh...it's a good thing she's not crazy. Jesus.

What is it with list mods being completely off their rockers? How is anyone expected to post on a list if they live in fear of some kind of tyrannical bitch-fit backlash? Honestly, between this chick and MsA, I'm surprised more LOTR-RPS fans haven't just given up already.

And isn't their website completely down now, anyway? Unless they moved it somewhere else, I can't seem to locate it.

Steph

(Reply to this)(Thread)


[info]gabbyhope
2003-10-27 12:33 am UTC (link)
It's down, yes. Jo is speaking to someone about taking it over, but until then, poof, no BTF. It was about time, really. It hadn't been updated in almost a year.

(Reply to this)(Parent)


[info]mauralabingi
2003-10-27 01:08 am UTC (link)
Ahahaha!! And if I remember right, the major reason why the CtB group was started was because of an absolutely excruciating, non-stop hail of posts from MsA on the LOTR_RPS group about her, her sexuality, her methods of fucking her husband, her amazing grasp of sociology and queer theory, her, her rotten childhood, her (then-nascent!) theories on Elijah Wood's sexual and laundering preferences, movies she'd seen lately, what she had for lunch, her work in the musical theater, her, and her. I'm so serious, the verbal spew was astounding; it was just message after message day after day, in spite of numerous requests to her to please just shut up. Finally people started unsubbing left and right.

I can't remember if I joined CtB (I haven't been to either Yahoo group in more than a year) but when Wendy started it, there was a general rush over there and a lot of exhortations from the refugees to please, please never allow anyone launch on a Shawna-like flood there. I'm definitely not saying the mods aren't carrying Der Discipline Und Control thing too far, but ifrc that's where all those rules originally sprang from.

(Reply to this)(Thread)


[info]iamtheenemy
2003-10-27 01:47 am UTC (link)
God, I would love to read through that for the entertainment value. Sadly, I can see her doing that so easily. Thank God she's got her own place to spew now.

Steph

(Reply to this)(Parent)(Thread)

(no subject) - [info]redina, 2003-10-27 02:56 am UTC

[info]cimorene111
2003-10-27 08:35 pm UTC (link)
that and someone posting a nasty review trashing jo's viggorli serial.

(Reply to this)(Parent)(Thread)

(no subject) - [info]eyebrowofdoom, 2003-10-28 03:43 pm UTC
Re: - [info]cimorene111, 2003-10-28 08:33 pm UTC

[info]snacky
2003-10-27 01:32 am UTC (link)
Is it just me, or does anyone else need a scorecard and a program to follow this? *g*

(Reply to this)(Thread)


[info]iamtheenemy
2003-10-27 01:44 am UTC (link)
I'm with you. Too many acronyms.

Steph

(Reply to this)(Parent)


[info]redina
2003-10-27 01:45 am UTC (link)
snacky wrote:
Is it just me, or does anyone else need a scorecard and a program to follow this? *g*

{chuckle}

If 'this' was in response to the 'volley' of comments within this post, probably a programme. {g}

However, if 'this' referred to fandom, we keep on saying there should be a scoreboard for 'my fandom can outwank your fandom'.

Ah, screw it... There's always option C for all of the above needs a scorecard. ;-)

And bugger it all! There's a 'preview' option on replies in journals but not on the first actual posting to a group. {snort}

(Reply to this)(Parent)


[info]iczer6
2003-10-27 01:42 am UTC (link)
{8. List members making OT posts (with or without the labeling) will be subject to disciplinary action based on the owners' discretion. If we deem it a 'mild' offense, we will send a warning first. If not, and for the second offense following a warning, moderated status for one week will result. Further infractions will result in further moderation (one month) and then removal from the list}

How DARE list members attempt to alert other members to potential, non-RPS related problems!

Okay I understand wanting to cut down on spam and squeeing by tapdancing Christ folks, maybe if they actually *relax* they could get that giant pole outta their ass.


Icz

(Reply to this)


[info]texta
2003-10-27 01:44 am UTC (link)
Am I missing something? I've read it twice and I'm still not seeing the wank here.

(Reply to this)(Thread)


[info]iamtheenemy
2003-10-27 01:49 am UTC (link)
This is kind of OT, but I have just spent several minutes trying to imagine myself wearing the shoes in your icon and not tipping over. The image is not coming.

Steph

(Reply to this)(Parent)(Thread)

(no subject) - [info]texta, 2003-10-27 02:15 am UTC

[info]redina
2003-10-27 01:55 am UTC (link)
Ah well, in light of all the HP wank, LOTR RPS also has its share of 'love and light' among fans.

Ironically, with as much of this alleged 'love and light' that was directed at supposedly 'closeted' actors, not much was spared for the fans themselves.

(Reply to this)(Parent)(Thread)

(no subject) - [info]gabbyhope, 2003-10-27 02:07 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]redina, 2003-10-27 02:19 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]sagralisse, 2003-10-27 04:53 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]msilverstar, 2003-10-27 08:43 am UTC

[info]sagralisse
2003-10-27 02:06 am UTC (link)
Almost ironic to be anti-LOTR Gossip but pro-LOTR RPS.

Or... like not.

(Reply to this)(Thread)


[info]eyebrowofdoom
2003-10-27 05:40 am UTC (link)
Yeah.

(Reply to this)(Parent)


[info]kkscatnip
2003-10-27 05:09 am UTC (link)
*hobbles around on cane* why, i remember when there was just lo-trips! and i remember when CTB was formed... and i remember that fucking HORRIBLE orlando-on-drugs fic... something about angels or some rot. and i remember the other orlando on drugs fic that was actually good, but the author never finished. sigh. oh, and i remember getting kicked off of CTB because i talked about viggo's son. because it was a NO-NO. we must not discuss the offspring, even if we find the offspring attractive! and we can't give honest feedback, either.

oooohhhh wonder if i can find all of those old e-mails... it will be a challenge, if nothing else. heh.

(Reply to this)(Thread)


[info]eyebrowofdoom
2003-10-27 07:25 am UTC (link)
Oh my god, this is like a high school reunion from Hellmouth High (class o'... 2001?)!

You didn't, perchance, in the aftermath of that kerfuffle over Zarah's badfic-needs-concrit post, tell me that the reason I didn't think there was a clique of da popular kids who considered themselves above concrit, was that I was one of them? Your name seems familiar... Hee!

I was always in two minds about the crit (specifically of the Orlando-on-drugs fic) kerfuffle that happened around about the time CTB was formed, if that's what you're talking about. I don't mind my work being discussed critically in public, but it's not rocket science to appreciate that other people do mind a great deal. Which doesn't mean you can't do it, but it does mean that if you announce it right in their faces, the only logical consequence is that you'll upset them, and you need to cop that on the chin. Whereas Ruth (...Sadelle Alderson? I think) opened her reviews with passive-aggressive declarations of her own past and pending martyrdom, and don't you just love that. And the pompous poison-pen tone was wildly inconsistent with the existing tone of the list, in terms of the sense of community that was there, and a real misjudgement of audience. And did I say pompous... and poison-pen? I don't want to read that full stop, let alone see it pushed under the nose of the person at whose work it's directing its pomposity.

Er, yes. :0

On a different historical note: you know what, re. Henry Mortensen? The same Ruth Sadelle etc had got herself in trouble before for posting Henry/Orlando slash (or so I hear, since this was before my time). So it was already a big sore point, and if you were vocally pro-crit at the same time as being pro-Henry-perving, you might have been perceived to be Ruth's partisan, or otherwise trying to rake up old conflicts.

Whee, I feel ALIVE! Now, let's see, what else can we dredge up... mod's love child dated Princess Diana...

(Reply to this)(Parent)(Thread)

(no subject) - [info]cimorene111, 2003-10-27 08:43 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]cimorene111, 2003-10-27 08:40 pm UTC
(no subject) - (Anonymous), 2003-10-28 02:24 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]kkscatnip, 2003-10-31 03:14 pm UTC
Re: - [info]cimorene111, 2003-10-31 06:19 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]lcsbanana, 2003-10-28 05:46 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]iczer6, 2003-10-29 03:01 am UTC

[info]eyebrowofdoom
2003-10-27 05:36 am UTC (link)
Oh god, you're not the person who got put on moderated for posting one too many replies to a person who flounced offendedly when I reminded people not to quote the whole text of the fic in their reply, are you? Or am I telescoping several ker-mini-fluffles into one?

On a slightly different note, it seems like *if* CTB is a fic-&-announcements-only list now, that if would be a lot easier if the rules just said so. At the moment, theoretically discussion seems allowed, but every actual example of discussion is frowned upon.

Back in the day when the mods were still talking to each other (and there were mods plural, rather than Wendy vs her ex-mod enemies, eep), and talking *to* everybody else about the list in a non-acrimonious way, I might have brought it up on lj to one of them. But Wendy is the only one I was never directly acquainted with, and I wouldn't dare say anything to her about it now! If you're the wrong person, that's a banning offence.

(Reply to this)(Thread)

(no subject) - [info]redina, 2003-10-27 05:53 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]eyebrowofdoom, 2003-10-27 07:35 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]gabbyhope, 2003-10-27 08:17 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]redina, 2003-10-27 08:26 am UTC
(no subject) - (Anonymous), 2003-10-28 02:21 am UTC

[info]oxydosic
2003-10-27 02:01 pm UTC (link)
There are plenty of RPS lists that have little standards and we are not one of them.

Oh really? I've read their archive site. If they have standards, they aren't many. What exactly is their standard for what is not badfic? Given the nature of some of the fics they archive it must be pretty flexible.

(Reply to this)(Thread)

(no subject) - [info]cimorene111, 2003-10-27 08:39 pm UTC

(Anonymous)
2003-10-28 01:59 am UTC (link)
I want to hear about the privately emailed threat, though my hopes aren't up.

I was watching with interest the conversation between you and Wendy about archiving, and how CTB is NOT LOTR_RPS. She really seemed incredibly intent on misunderstanding you.

But then the wank just stopped. I was very disapointed.

(Reply to this)(Thread)

(no subject) - [info]redina, 2003-10-28 05:19 am UTC

(Anonymous)
2003-10-28 02:06 am UTC (link)
And that's why I don't post my fics on CTB anymore.

I've also been the victim to one of Wendy's 'bad moods' once. Although that was RPG related and nothing to do with CTB. Someone needs to give her a chill pill.

Miss D

(Reply to this)


[info]sparkysrevenge
2003-11-03 11:30 pm UTC (link)
the "rules" seem more stringent than my grammar-obsessed friend's instruction manuals. jesus.

(Reply to this)


 
   
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