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El Juno ([info]eljuno) wrote in [info]fandom_wank,
@ 2003-12-08 23:10:00


Previous Entry  Add to memories!  Tell a Friend!  Next Entry
Entry tags:fandom: harry potter, mary sues, mary sues don't work that way

Wank in waiting...
This hasn't quite splurted, yet. But as far as wank goes, the dick was just pulled out of the jeans. And guess who's behind it?

The MarySues community AND the Harry Potter fandom!

We start here, where a girl says that the new movie-verse Hermione is a Sue. Most people say she's wrong, but don't go MUCH further than that.

And then kinneas gets pissed off.


Er, question. In this community, is it not a groundrule to fill out the Mary Sue form in the User Info and not just paste a link to make do?


Also, does anyone here even remember what Mary Sue truly IS?
Because I am a lazy ho, I will paste a previous comment of mine pertaining to an HP post:

Honestly, this comm has gotten SO freaking out of control. Do you all even remember the very MEANING of Mary Sue anymore? It is a character of whom everyone loves. It is a character of whom the entire story is based upon. It is a character that has NO FLAWS WHATSOEVER and is PERFECT, a trait in itself that can NEVER be attained because the law of perfection states that for anything to be absolutely perfect, all atomic movement must cease and therefore the thing ceases to be.

Yet Mary Sue defies this law. That's the whole freaking POINT.

To the best of my knowledge, this Hermione and any other existing is NOT loved by everyone, nor is she absolutely gorgeous, nor is she even freaking stylish. While she's not as far as you can get, Hermione is a well-rounded character, which is exactly what we MarySue Report alumni originally STRIVED FOR.

UGH. This disgusts me. Signing off, mods feel free to delete.



There haven't been any comments on that post, yet, which is why we're still in the unbuttoned-jeans-and-lube phase, but I'll turn in my wankah card if it doesn't explode...



(Post a new comment)


[info]smo
2003-12-09 06:21 am UTC (link)
Kinneas needs to take a chill pill.

Also, his Schu icon is making the rest of us look bad.

(Reply to this)(Thread)


[info]gaisce
2003-12-09 07:23 am UTC (link)
It's because Shu is a dirty, dirty uke slut...

(Reply to this)(Parent)(Thread)

OT: Icon - [info]ichigatsu, 2003-12-09 07:50 am UTC
Re: Finally icon commentary! - [info]gaisce, 2003-12-09 08:01 am UTC
Re: Finally icon commentary! - [info]eljuno, 2003-12-09 08:23 am UTC
Re: Finally icon commentary! - (Anonymous), 2003-12-11 07:40 am UTC
yay, typos abound - (Anonymous), 2003-12-11 08:41 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]smo, 2003-12-09 07:54 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]gaisce, 2003-12-09 07:56 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]smo, 2003-12-09 07:59 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]panthea, 2003-12-09 08:16 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]smo, 2003-12-09 08:46 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]panthea, 2003-12-09 08:59 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]sorchar, 2003-12-09 09:21 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]smo, 2003-12-09 03:08 pm UTC
Re: - [info]sorchar, 2003-12-09 04:50 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]smo, 2003-12-09 05:01 pm UTC
(no subject) - (Anonymous), 2003-12-09 07:08 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]panthea, 2003-12-09 06:47 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]smo, 2003-12-09 11:23 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]panthea, 2003-12-10 12:00 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]smo, 2003-12-10 12:01 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]panthea, 2003-12-10 12:25 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]smo, 2003-12-10 12:39 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]smo, 2003-12-10 02:53 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]panthea, 2003-12-10 02:57 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]smo, 2003-12-10 03:09 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]panthea, 2003-12-10 03:28 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]smo, 2003-12-10 04:25 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]panthea, 2003-12-10 04:58 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]smo, 2003-12-10 05:12 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]panthea, 2003-12-10 06:18 am UTC
*sporfle* - [info]smo, 2003-12-10 07:04 am UTC
Re: *sporfle* - [info]panthea, 2003-12-10 07:16 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]panthea, 2003-12-10 03:47 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]smo, 2003-12-10 05:10 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]panthea, 2003-12-10 06:19 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]smo, 2003-12-10 04:30 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]panthea, 2003-12-10 06:20 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]smo, 2003-12-10 07:11 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]schuldig, 2003-12-09 07:05 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]ecchaniz0r, 2003-12-09 09:09 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]smo, 2003-12-09 09:27 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]schuldig, 2003-12-10 06:22 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]smo, 2003-12-10 06:42 pm UTC

(Anonymous)
2003-12-09 07:07 pm UTC (link)
Her Schu icon. ^^

(Reply to this)(Parent)(Thread)

(no subject) - [info]smo, 2003-12-09 10:21 pm UTC
(no subject) - (Anonymous), 2003-12-09 11:55 pm UTC

[info]cotume27
2003-12-09 06:34 am UTC (link)
I was going to post this one, darn it! Oh well, you beat me to it. :p

I didn't agree with the person who originally posted, and I agree that what some people post aren't really Mary Sues, but at the same time, kinneas needs to chill. This isn't something you really need to get that upset about.

And yes, I agree. It's only a matter of time before this one explodes, if the mods don't decided to delete it first.

(Reply to this)


[info]bohicamouse
2003-12-09 07:17 am UTC (link)
Ugh. Dude, I agree with his general point (calling Hermione a Mary Sue is one of the most laughable things I've ever heard) but this?

the law of perfection states that for anything to be absolutely perfect, all atomic movement must cease and therefore the thing ceases to be.

Yet Mary Sue defies this law.


Is wanky. Although now I want to see a parody fic where this actually happens.

Fred felt his heart thumping against his ribcage as he lowered his eyelids and moved in to kiss this girl, this perfect specimen of Gryffindor femininity, the one he had waited to touch for so long. . . .

Startled by the cold of her unresponding lips, Fred leaned back and regarded his motionless lifemate fearfully. And then her atomic structure collapsed, and she imploded.

"SERENITYYYYYYYYYY!"


Erm, yes. In any case, is there a law about inserting unrelated scientific trivia into your argument to make it look more credible?

(Reply to this)(Thread)


[info]vengeance_bean
2003-12-09 08:49 am UTC (link)
Ah, the angst. *dying of laughter*

(Reply to this)(Parent)


[info]banal_o_rama
2003-12-10 01:29 am UTC (link)
If she's perfect, and I remember my MST3K correctly, then the entire universe will implode.

Mary Sues: is there nothing they can't do?

(Reply to this)(Parent)(Thread)

(no subject) - [info]smo, 2003-12-10 02:36 am UTC
Re: - [info]banal_o_rama, 2003-12-10 05:38 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]smo, 2003-12-10 05:56 am UTC

[info]gaisce
2003-12-09 07:29 am UTC (link)
So, lemme get the gist of this straight:

Poster: I think Hermione is now a Mary Sue?

Reply 1: No, I don't think so. Please try again.

Reply 2: For normal clothes? They're tacky, but meh. *shrugs* I don't see it.

3rd Reply to 2: Nope, not a Mary Sue for me. But they do look a bit tacky from what I wore in '93.

Kinneas: '93 In AMERICA spazzes!

Reply 3: Lovely day, isn't it? Not a sue.

Reply 4: I think you're off.

And so on...

Kinneas's reply overall: OMG you all SUX0RZ for posting this! STUPID!!!!

Ah, wank, where the many not-bitchy voices of majority self-correction are ignored.

(Reply to this)


[info]iczer6
2003-12-09 07:30 am UTC (link)
Well I'll agree that kinneas's first paragraph was horribly wanky, I do kinda agree with the second.

Neither book nor Movie!Herimone strikes me as being particularly Sueish, and the reasoning behind this 'OhmyGod she's wearing PINK, and leaning on Harry! Unclean, unclean' seems horribly wanky.

kinneas needs to calm down and the OP needs to be smacked with a copy of 'Just because their not in robes doesn't mean their out of character' the hardcover edition.


Icz

(Reply to this)(Thread)


[info]amand_r
2003-12-09 07:37 am UTC (link)
Amen, man. I was a little surprised to see the OP, and the wank of both people is amazing. But then again, I think the canon sue disease is catching lately, like those wacky Salem witches.

::eats more ergot::

(Reply to this)(Parent)(Thread)

(no subject) - [info]iczer6, 2003-12-09 07:50 am UTC
Re: - [info]amand_r, 2003-12-09 07:55 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]eljuno, 2003-12-09 08:03 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]panthea, 2003-12-09 08:12 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]calluna, 2003-12-09 08:52 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]iczer6, 2003-12-09 09:44 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]virago, 2003-12-09 04:36 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]smo, 2003-12-10 09:04 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]virago, 2003-12-10 09:11 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]crickets, 2003-12-09 08:42 am UTC
Re: - [info]amand_r, 2003-12-09 08:51 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]crickets, 2003-12-09 09:11 am UTC
Re: - [info]amand_r, 2003-12-09 09:19 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]amand_r, 2003-12-09 09:21 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]crickets, 2003-12-09 09:33 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]maryavatar, 2003-12-09 03:22 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]crickets, 2003-12-09 08:45 am UTC
Re: - [info]amand_r, 2003-12-09 08:51 am UTC
Jams? - (Anonymous), 2003-12-09 08:20 pm UTC
Re: Jams? - [info]iczer6, 2003-12-09 09:04 pm UTC
Re: Jams? - [info]cairea, 2003-12-09 09:14 pm UTC
Re: Jams? - [info]amand_r, 2003-12-09 09:05 pm UTC
Re: Jams? - (Anonymous), 2003-12-09 09:23 pm UTC
Re: Jams? - [info]sagralisse, 2003-12-10 05:01 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]jfpbookworm, 2003-12-09 08:24 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]lizardlaugh, 2003-12-10 01:39 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]smo, 2003-12-09 07:57 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]calluna, 2003-12-09 08:53 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]amand_r, 2003-12-09 08:56 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]smo, 2003-12-09 04:47 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]cleolinda, 2003-12-09 08:17 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]musette, 2003-12-09 10:20 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]pradaloz, 2003-12-09 08:47 pm UTC
Re: - [info]musette, 2003-12-09 10:20 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]amasaglajax, 2003-12-10 05:18 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]setsunastar, 2003-12-09 03:32 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]amand_r, 2003-12-09 06:55 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]setsunastar, 2003-12-09 07:21 pm UTC
Re: - [info]amand_r, 2003-12-09 07:46 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]mariagoner, 2003-12-11 05:35 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]schuldig, 2003-12-10 06:37 pm UTC

[info]faultypremise
2003-12-09 08:00 am UTC (link)
Totally in agreement here. *applauds*

(Reply to this)(Parent)


[info]panthea
2003-12-09 08:10 am UTC (link)
Aw, I like kinneas and her Schu icons. Maybe she does need to chill... but she's right.

^-- That "all molecular movement ceasing" thing though? Funny as HELL.

(Reply to this)(Thread)


[info]smo
2003-12-09 08:33 am UTC (link)
But with a name like Kinneas, shouldn't she have a picture of Irvine?

[/end anime wank... for now, anyway]

(Reply to this)(Parent)(Thread)

(no subject) - [info]panthea, 2003-12-09 08:37 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]dae, 2003-12-10 12:20 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]smo, 2003-12-10 12:45 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]unoriginality, 2003-12-10 01:15 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]dae, 2003-12-10 07:58 pm UTC
Re: - [info]unoriginality, 2003-12-10 08:49 pm UTC

[info]shoiryu
2003-12-09 08:10 am UTC (link)
I agreed with the sentiment. Didn't really read the post that closely. *L* The Hermione thing annoyed the piss out of me, though.

(Reply to this)(Thread)


[info]faultypremise
2003-12-09 08:15 am UTC (link)
Some folks see Sues in everything, Kinneas was right about that.

(Reply to this)(Parent)


[info]photosinensis
2003-12-09 08:45 am UTC (link)
Addressing the scientific law:

Actually, that isn't so much wanky as it is funny. She makes a point: by the laws of thermodynamics, anything that attains perfection ceases to exist, as it is impossible to reach absolute zero. Therefore, in theory, Mary Sues should have vanished a long time ago. Therefore, the laws of thermodynamics have been disproven, and Sueists have a lot of explaining to do.

Of course, that leaves out the Bitchiwitch brand of Sue, but those are the type that you know when you see them. And given their psychiatric profiles, most of them, given their lack of thearpy, should have committed suicide years ago. God only knows why they haven't.

True, some people will call any female character a Sue. Especially heroines. However, the whole thing about Mary Sue is that she is a cliched character, really. Not that everybody likes her, but that she fills so many non-architypical cliches extant primarily in the fanfiction world that she is annoying by her very existance. Hermione doesn't actually fall into much of the cliche catagory, though she displays many architypical traits common in heroines and strong female sidekicks.

How's that for a definition of a Sue? Anyone? Anyone? Bueller?

(Reply to this)(Thread)


[info]amand_r
2003-12-09 08:59 am UTC (link)
*head explodes*

You took me to a whole new level, man...like...Frogger.

(Reply to this)(Parent)(Thread)

Re: - [info]photosinensis, 2003-12-09 12:00 pm UTC
Re: - [info]amand_r, 2003-12-09 06:37 pm UTC

[info]calluna
2003-12-09 09:00 am UTC (link)
About the Bitchiwitches, you could still consider them Sues because 1) the other major indicator of a Sue - self insertion (maybe the author is a tortured goth?) or 2) The character doesn't have to be perfect in everyone's opinion to be a Sue, just in the author's. (And it's usually pretty easy to tell if the author thinks the character can do no wrong, even if the readers think otherwise...)

Eh, I'm not sure if that made any sense. And I probably should post it there instead of here. Oh well...

(Reply to this)(Parent)(Thread)

(no subject) - [info]crickets, 2003-12-09 10:15 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]virago, 2003-12-09 04:40 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]calluna, 2003-12-09 05:04 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]livii, 2003-12-09 10:20 pm UTC

[info]quinctia
2003-12-09 09:01 am UTC (link)
I don't see any wank! *whines*

(Reply to this)


[info]pradaloz
2003-12-09 03:00 pm UTC (link)
Actually, my favorite response to meepalicious's original post comes from [info]qanonreip:

"I wrote a full-length screenplay, and I'm starting filming on Sunday. Tell me if there's anything that really pisses you off, and I will try to work it in and mock it until we feel satisfied! Email me, send me a review, IM me, I just want to make sure every angry canon-fiend is avenged!"

Fans taking matters into their own hands! O, sweet fandom, I love you so.

(Reply to this)

Jesus wept.
[info]snacky
2003-12-09 07:23 pm UTC (link)
qanonreip?

Now *that's* wanky. Wankily wanktastic.

(Reply to this)(Thread)

Re: Jesus wept. - [info]redpanda, 2003-12-09 07:39 pm UTC
Re: Jesus wept. - [info]snacky, 2003-12-09 08:57 pm UTC
Re: Jesus wept. - [info]dontgiveahoot, 2003-12-10 05:15 pm UTC

[info]norabombay
2003-12-09 07:40 pm UTC (link)
I just want to let you know that "the unbuttoned-jeans-and-lube phase"

Is my new favorate phrase.

(Reply to this)


[info]limyaael
2003-12-09 10:18 pm UTC (link)
Dude.

Yeah, so people disagree about Sues, and I don't think Hermione is one. But I have never, ever understood the people who act as though calling canon characters (or characters the author insists are OC's) Sues is the worst thing ever, ever, ever, and all Sue-mocking should stop because one mistake happens.

*whisper* You do know they characters are fictional, right, and don't have feelings to be hurt by someone calling them Sues?

(Reply to this)(Thread)

(no subject) - [info]gaisce, 2003-12-09 11:37 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]mariagoner, 2003-12-11 05:38 am UTC

[info]ironymaiden
2003-12-10 12:28 am UTC (link)
i was 10 in 1993, and therefore at the mercy of my mother. it was bad. it was The Fashion That Dare Not Speak Its Name.

My sister, however (the lucky bitch) was in 10th grade, and therefore had normal clothes. I remember jeans, tshirts, sweatshirts, flannel (lots of flannel), print shorts... However, this was California, so I'm not sure its relevant to 1993 Britain. But somehow, the logic of Pink Hoodie = Mary Sue is not Earth Logic.

(Reply to this)(Thread)

(no subject) - [info]iczer6, 2003-12-10 02:07 am UTC

[info]dontgiveahoot
2003-12-10 05:07 pm UTC (link)
Well, having had a rotten day, I wasn't feeling very nice - so I wandered over there and responded to the original post - possibly rather wankily. I'm not sure. I'm very tired and I can't judge if I'm being wanky or just cranky but with arguments that are essentially fair.

http://www.livejournal.com/community/marysues/1031332.html?view=10046628#t10046628

Read and judge - have I sinned wanked?

Jen / Quoth the Raven

(Reply to this)


 
   
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