(Post a new comment)

	tintin 2003-05-07 06:53 pm UTC (link)
	I'm a bad person for still being madly in love with Miss Windy, right? (Reply to this)(Thread)

	lasayla 2003-05-07 08:02 pm UTC (link)
	It depends. Are you in love with her when she's being rational or all the time? (Reply to this)(Parent)(Thread)

	tintin 2003-05-07 08:04 pm UTC (link)
	I think flame wars turn me on. (Reply to this)(Parent)(Thread)

	lasayla 2003-05-07 08:09 pm UTC (link)
	You kinky little pyrophiliac you! (Reply to this)(Parent)

	ymfaery 2003-05-07 09:28 pm UTC (link)
	"Bad" people always seem to be more attractive, yes? ^_- And good people have their bad days, so what's the big deal? (Reply to this)(Parent)

	misswindy 2003-05-08 07:32 am UTC (link)
	leers lasciviously So how you doin'? (Reply to this)(Parent)(Thread)

	tintin 2003-05-08 07:36 am UTC (link)
	swoons (Reply to this)(Parent)

	phosfate 2003-05-07 07:01 pm UTC (link)
	Imagine how much fun they'd all be at Thanksgiving dinner! (Reply to this)(Thread)

	ymfaery 2003-05-07 09:31 pm UTC (link)
	The food fight would be of epic proportions. (Reply to this)(Parent)(Thread)

	nita 2003-05-08 12:01 am UTC (link)
	You know, I'd pay to see that. ::considers her own family Thanksgivings:: Then again, maybe not. (Reply to this)(Parent)

	darkrose 2003-05-07 07:15 pm UTC (link)
	Hmm. Certain posters can brand people pedophiles, and say that they are "sucking [your] son's dick." And yet, by the standards of LJ Abuse, that's apparently not harrassment. Good to know. (Reply to this)(Thread)

	lexin 2003-05-08 12:17 am UTC (link)
	I noticed that. V. strange. (Reply to this)(Parent)

wizzard
2003-05-07 07:18 pm UTC (link)

I'm impressed, especially with the fact you kept very cool under what amounted to being the most random and vicious ad hominen attack I've seen outside of fandom_wank.

Does this mean we are losing are touch? Work harder at being an evil back stabbing cunt girls (and boy)!

Although I'm on debchan's side about the fact that attacking her parenting skills was low and ridiculous, I found this quote of hers kind of annoying. It's in reference to not saying anything about the main point of misswindy's original post-

That's why I didn't add anything else to my first post, because she did have a point and I didn't take issue with it. The rest of it, however? *shakes head*

I guess I don't get why she felt the need to comment on it at all if all she was going to do was latch onto the grey/gray thing. Certainly not at the wank levels of misswindy but it's a slight irritation I have with debchan on this whole kerfluffle.

(Reply to this)(Thread)

cimorene111
2003-05-07 07:48 pm UTC (link)

i don't think it's possible to say who is being wankier. i sympathize with windy about the grammar correction. all the wank stems from that. debchan's being a pretentious, obnoxious bitch at great length and refusing to admit it, etc etc. in fact, she's still seeking out this fight in every instance, and you see from the additional posts that they're continuing to bring up and then fasten onto side issues (like libel, legal action, etc).

but although deb STARTED the fight, nothing she has said has come close in wankiness to this whole parenting skills thing. it really blows my mind. plus, it's hard to take the fight seriously with You-Know-Who popping in and, well, debating [sic] in her usual manner.

(Reply to this)(Parent)

	hugsnkisses 2003-05-07 07:32 pm UTC (link)
	Wasn't Spike the one who insisted that we were an Abomination and must be protested against lest we take over the world, or something? wank wank wank. (Reply to this)(Thread)

	sagralisse 2003-05-07 09:52 pm UTC (link)
	Yes! Spike21 was a part of one of the campaigns to stamp out f_w. That was about the time darkrose's buddy whassername accused f_w of email flaming her and calling her house in the middle of the night. (Reply to this)(Parent)

deeablo
2003-05-07 10:02 pm UTC (link)

What she said (I'm all about the proof, y'all):

Fandom_wank is meanness. I have absolutely no objection to meanness and mockery and venting done in private, but done in a public forum that marginalizes response is just meanness and yeah, people can rationalize all they like, but if you're watching and giggling along, you're participating in meanness and, really, just own up to that.
spike
Posted by: spike on February 18, 2003 02:52 AM

(Reply to this)(Parent)(Thread)

	nevadafighter 2003-05-07 11:50 pm UTC (link)
	Like I've ever denied being mean. To "own up" to something means denying it in the first place. Sheesh. ;) (Reply to this)(Parent)(Thread)

	deeablo 2003-05-08 01:32 am UTC (link)
	No, no. Spike wants those who merely READ fandom_wank to own up to their meanness. After all, backstabbers are much better than people who choose to confront others openly. And Mike is the bestest Monkee of all. (Reply to this)(Parent)(Thread)

	nevadafighter 2003-05-08 05:25 am UTC (link)
	Darn right, shotgun. ;) (Reply to this)(Parent)

	cimorene111 2003-05-07 07:53 pm UTC (link)
	but really, appallingness/idiocy/bitchiness aside (or, well, not really ASIDE), this is hysterical! how can ultimatemother want everyone to get along? even if they're both friends of hers! and She Who Must Not Be Named is the funniest. <3! (Reply to this)

	snacky 2003-05-07 09:05 pm UTC (link)
	Wow, the wank level on both sides is going off the charts. Too bad Windy's original point is getting lost in the sea of wank. An administrative note: I thought "the wank that never ends" was Cassie Claire. Did I miss a memo? (Reply to this)

	dreamtoday 2003-05-07 09:06 pm UTC (link)
	I think they should all just have sex with one another. All that animosity, it has to be UST. Any self respecting fandom fen knows that. (Reply to this)(Thread)

	debchan 2003-05-07 09:21 pm UTC (link)
	LOL! If only I could overcome this pesky heterosexuality thing... (Reply to this)(Parent)(Thread)

	renjenri 2003-05-07 09:43 pm UTC (link)
	Hrm. Maybe we should get you drunk first. Think that would help? hops in handbasket and heads off to a firey demise (Reply to this)(Parent)(Thread)

	debchan 2003-05-07 09:44 pm UTC (link)
	snerk It never has in the past, sorry. (Reply to this)(Parent)(Thread)

	renjenri 2003-05-07 09:46 pm UTC (link)
	Hmph. No RST for you! :P (Reply to this)(Parent)(Thread)

	chaya 2003-05-08 11:03 pm UTC (link)
	swoons at your icon (Reply to this)(Parent)

	sagralisse 2003-05-07 09:49 pm UTC (link)
	We want rasslin', dammit. And we want it now. (Reply to this)(Parent)(Thread)

	debchan 2003-05-07 09:53 pm UTC (link)
	Provide the vat of jello and I'm there. (Reply to this)(Parent)(Thread)

	sagralisse 2003-05-07 10:16 pm UTC (link)
	As a matter of fact, we had some made up for MsA and Miru, but they declined. (Reply to this)(Parent)(Thread)

	snacky 2003-05-07 11:22 pm UTC (link)
	It was so disappointing! Debchan, don't let us down! (Reply to this)(Parent)(Thread)

	debchan 2003-05-08 12:05 am UTC (link)
	Okay. As long as the jello has no little bits of pineapple or these mini marshmallows in it, count me in. (Reply to this)(Parent)

dreamtoday
2003-05-07 09:49 pm UTC (link)

Exhibit A: Fox Mulder*

Exhibit B: Alex Krycek*

Now, they might think that they hate one another, and Mulder might think that he loves Scully, but please. Everyone knows they're just in denial and that poor Scully will spend the rest of her life pining until she wises up and moves in with Skinner.

It only hurts the first time.

Trust me on this one.

No, really.

*or insert pretty boy of choice here

(Reply to this)(Parent)(Thread)

	debchan 2003-05-07 09:52 pm UTC (link)
	The important question here is: Which one am I? And does it mean losing an arm before all is said and done? (Reply to this)(Parent)(Thread)

	dreamtoday 2003-05-08 05:30 am UTC (link)
	Depends. How much do you like that arm? Personally, I think you only need one. Plastic is cool, yo. (Reply to this)(Parent)

	wizzard 2003-05-07 11:04 pm UTC (link)
	Hmm, I guess you must not be in the LOTR fandom or else you would know that everybody is bisexual. Sorry, if you don't think you are attracted to girls you must be in denial. It's true cause MsA says so. (Reply to this)(Parent)(Thread)

mer1973
2003-05-07 11:56 pm UTC (link)

Or maybe, just maybe, the PR Devils have taken over Debchan's and MissWindy's computers and it's all just a plot by them. They've tied up Debchan and MissWindy and now brainwashing them.

:::eyes dart wildly:::

They've found us haven't they? They're after us, aren't they? We're next!!!!

:::runs screaming a la Kermit:::

Right, no more caffeine in the afternoons for me...

(Reply to this)(Parent)(Thread)

	debchan 2003-05-08 12:03 am UTC (link)
	::struggles to computer and manages to type "rusty...spork..." before being caught:: This is debchan. She's, I mean, I'm fine. Just fine. And straight. Or gay. Or possibly bi. I'm not sure anymore. (Reply to this)(Parent)(Thread)

	mer1973 2003-05-08 03:55 am UTC (link)
	Okay, it's official. We're screwed, and it's not the good kind. If it was the good kind, you know the type with sheets being ripped and sweat dripping, I wouldn't mind, but no, no, no, it's the "oh fuck, here come's the re-education camp" type. :::sobs quietly in a corner::: I'm too young to be brainwashed. (Reply to this)(Parent)

	wizzard 2003-05-08 12:42 am UTC (link)
	The PR Devils created this lovely wank to distract us from the tinhat wank. Evil geniuses indeed! (Reply to this)(Parent)(Thread)

	mer1973 2003-05-08 03:58 am UTC (link)
	They're just so cool and clever and pretty and smart and maybe they won't hurt me. Gotta lay off caffeine in the evenings too. (Reply to this)(Parent)

	cesare 2003-05-08 12:49 am UTC (link)
	Hey! And now it's turning into a plagiarism wank too! (It can't possibly be due to common source material-- Ralph Bakshi's complaints about Peter Jackson made that obvious!) (Reply to this)(Parent)(Thread)

	mer1973 2003-05-08 04:01 am UTC (link)
	Plagiarism? Meh? Okay, that's it. I give up. The PR Devils win. I'm gonna go watch Angel know and wait for them to come and collect me. (Reply to this)(Parent)

stalin
2003-05-08 12:15 am UTC (link)

Apart from the absolutely ridiculous exchange on parenting, where I clearly missed something, I thought misswindy had a point.

I mean, taking someone's story, changing a few minor details and presenting it as your own is one (very stupid) thing for which people deserve a good smacking, but borrowing someone's concept or idea (as fanfic authors have done for tens of years now) is something entirely different. There are shades of gray between these two extremes, obviously, but I've seen fanfic authors up in arms because someone's written a story which has the same basic plot as one of theirs.

There's one concept (people put on a play at Hogwarts) over which one particular writer is so touchy that nobody dares write anything even vaguely similar in case they get their name dragged through the mud. When things have come to such a pass, it seems to me they've gone a tad too far.

The "Grey Day" people don't seem to make any sort of distinction between legitimate borrowing (as fans have always done from each other) and out and out plagiarism.

(Reply to this)(Thread)

debchan
2003-05-08 02:12 am UTC (link)

Maybe I missed something, but I don't think that's what Access Denied is talking about. It started because people have been taking clips from vids and using them in their own creations, taking fan art and claiming it as their own, and in some cases, taking entire vids and hosting them against the express wishes of the vidder.

Using the same plot in a story? No biggie at all and not even mentioned (IIRC) at all.

(not affiliated with AD at all, BTW.)

(Reply to this)(Parent)(Thread)

stalin
2003-05-08 09:22 am UTC (link)

That's my problem: that it's not even mentioned. There's no attempt to have a sensible debate, or even point out the pitfalls in the logic of their argument (which

misswindy put at length) just a blanket statement to the effect that copying is a Bad Thing. Well, it is, if that's what the person's done.

But we've seen on fandom_wank arguments breaking out over who "stole" who's icon, when it's perfectly obvious both parties did, and stole it from the same place. That they then added a border or text to the picture does not make it any less morally questionable. Fandom, including fanfic, vids, making icons and all the rest are on morally ambiguous ground, and for fans to sit around trying to say that their morally ambiguous using of other people's work is OK, but someone else's morally ambiguous using of other people's (i.e. their) already morally ambiguous work is somehow worse than the original? It's an argument akin to angels dancing on the head of a pin, to my mind. And then to set up a campagin to try to get it stopped is just plain amusing. It's worthy a fandom wank in itself, since it is exactly what fandom wank likes to puncture: arrogant and pretentious.

IMO.

(Reply to this)(Parent)

misswindy
2003-05-08 07:28 am UTC (link)

There's one concept (people put on a play at Hogwarts) over which one particular writer is so touchy that nobody dares write anything even vaguely similar in case they get their name dragged through the mud. When things have come to such a pass, it seems to me they've gone a tad too far.

I really like when people write disclaimers that are like, "These characters are copyright blahblahblah. I don't own them, and I'm only borrowing them. No copyright infringement is intended. However, the story and the Mary Sue I've invented are MINE, MINE DAMN YOU, and if you steal them, I will hunt you down and kill you like the filthy dog you are." And they totally don't see the irony there. Hilarious!

(Reply to this)(Parent)(Thread)

	stalin 2003-05-08 09:24 am UTC (link)
	I know, and if you investigate the story it usually turns out that the characters the 'writer' is bothered about are the very last characters anybody would want to steal in any case: blatant self insertions or characters so weak and wimpy that the only reasonable fate for them is death in a hotel fire. (Reply to this)(Parent)