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Die Potterdämmerung Gibich (smo) wrote in fandom_wank,
@ 2004-11-05 01:37:00

Current mood:

irked

Not Getting It R Us
Over in fanficrants on LJ, athenia45 is mightily displeased about the presence of rapefic within fandom, and says so.

The general reaction is one of, " Dude, haven't we already been over this one million bazillion times?"

Disclaimer: Rapefic is not my cup of tea, but if other people want to write and read it, no skin off my nose.

(Post a new comment)

panthea
2004-11-05 08:49 am UTC (link)

Rape is NOT going to immediately lead to your finding/or establishing a relationship with your one true love.

Ha. See, I write rape fic (in fact, just finished a piece of Sawyer rape fic for Lost), and I know that. I mean, maybe I'm just weird, but I've never written rape fic that turned into One Twu Wub.

I write rape (on occasion, mind; not frequently) because power dynamics are one of my kinks. Period. Not everyone who writes rapefic is, like, this teenybopper OTPer who thinks rape is so romantic! And I feel like a lot of rabidly anti-rape-in-fanfic people forget that.

As a plot device, I don't think rape is specialer than any other plot device; in the sense that there's a good way to do it, and a bad way to do it, but it ain't taboo. Or at least it shouldn't be.

...oh, lookit that, I made a mess. Don't worry, I'll clean up after myself.

(Reply to this)(Thread)

	aloysius 2004-11-05 09:10 am UTC (link)
	I mean, maybe I'm just weird, but I've never written rape fic that turned into One Twu Wub. In my experience you're (not weird but) in the minority. Every fandom needs more writers like you. ... well, in my twisted, rape-fic-lovin', repressed-fangirly opinion, at least. (Reply to this)(Parent)(Thread)

boadicea, 2004-11-05 04:07 pm UTC

panthea, 2004-11-05 05:04 pm UTC

(Anonymous)
2004-11-05 05:28 pm UTC (link)

Could also be that the "rabidly anti-rape" fan girls have been, say, *actually* raped IRL, and find the 99% of rapefics that handle the subject by suggesting that the subject of the rape gets over it in less than 1,000 words by the power of a good screw from his/her beloved rather offensive...

Not that I am suggesting that you write this way, but since you feel free to broadly typecast "anti-rape" fangirls, I thought I'd return the favor.

(Reply to this)(Parent)(Thread)

wankprophet, 2004-11-05 06:42 pm UTC

panthea, 2004-11-05 07:17 pm UTC

smo, 2004-11-05 07:26 pm UTC

wankprophet, 2004-11-05 07:44 pm UTC

panthea, 2004-11-05 07:45 pm UTC

smo, 2004-11-05 07:46 pm UTC

leto, 2004-11-06 01:23 am UTC

wankprophet, 2004-11-06 03:53 am UTC

mrbimble, 2004-11-06 04:45 am UTC

... -

wankprophet, 2004-11-06 07:27 pm UTC

leto, 2004-11-06 05:34 am UTC

... -

ecchaniz0r, 2004-11-06 08:35 pm UTC

smo, 2004-11-06 09:09 am UTC

sarajayechan, 2004-11-06 09:19 pm UTC

wankprophet, 2004-11-05 07:50 pm UTC

panthea, 2004-11-05 07:57 pm UTC

smo, 2004-11-05 08:09 pm UTC

panthea, 2004-11-05 08:35 pm UTC

smo, 2004-11-05 10:36 pm UTC

tianxiaode, 2004-11-06 10:57 am UTC

... -

smo, 2004-11-07 01:23 am UTC

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tianxiaode, 2004-11-07 02:43 am UTC

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smo, 2004-11-08 02:50 am UTC

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tianxiaode, 2004-11-08 05:03 am UTC

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smo, 2004-11-08 05:52 am UTC

... -

wrenlet, 2004-11-07 08:41 pm UTC

... -

tianxiaode, 2004-11-08 05:02 am UTC

sarajayechan, 2004-11-07 01:45 am UTC

smo, 2004-11-05 07:37 pm UTC

(no subject) - cicer, 2004-11-05 11:04 pm UTC

kinneas, 2004-11-06 01:09 am UTC

(no subject) - (Anonymous), 2004-11-06 01:26 am UTC

(no subject) - (Anonymous), 2004-11-06 06:47 am UTC

smo, 2004-11-06 08:26 am UTC

(no subject) - (Anonymous), 2004-11-06 07:31 pm UTC

panthea, 2004-11-05 07:44 pm UTC

ecchaniz0r, 2004-11-06 08:36 pm UTC

	smo 2004-11-05 08:06 pm UTC (link)
	I've never written rape fic that turned into One Twu Wub. And that's why I wub you. ~~Although Gojyo's still kind of scared.~~ (Reply to this)(Parent)(Thread)

panthea, 2004-11-05 08:15 pm UTC

smo, 2004-11-05 08:18 pm UTC

panthea, 2004-11-05 08:59 pm UTC

smo, 2004-11-05 10:31 pm UTC

	zannechaos 2004-11-05 10:02 am UTC (link)
	Will someone let that poor pony rest in peace and quit resurrecting it all the damn time? Hey, Fall of Rain? What say you after November, we go through the archives and pluck out links to all the Rape!Fic debate/bitch posts and link them in another post and then link THAT on the userinfo of the comm/memories? Along with some other dead pony topics, like yaoi. (Reply to this)(Thread)

	eljuno 2004-11-05 10:27 am UTC (link)
	And RPS. Please GOD the RPS. ...Question, by the way. Is an RPS rapefic the root of all evil? (Reply to this)(Parent)(Thread)

misswindy, 2004-11-05 10:35 am UTC

eljuno, 2004-11-05 10:38 am UTC

elgato_gamgins, 2004-11-05 03:45 pm UTC

(no subject) - (Anonymous), 2004-11-06 03:28 am UTC

goldberry, 2004-11-06 11:02 am UTC

(no subject) - (Anonymous), 2004-11-07 09:23 pm UTC

goldberry, 2004-11-07 09:48 pm UTC

xero_sky, 2004-11-05 10:58 am UTC

dwarfjen, 2004-11-05 11:49 am UTC

xero_sky, 2004-11-05 12:05 pm UTC

boadicea, 2004-11-05 04:14 pm UTC

smo, 2004-11-05 07:56 pm UTC

adora_spintriae, 2004-11-06 01:46 am UTC

(no subject) - (Anonymous), 2004-11-05 07:12 pm UTC

smo, 2004-11-05 07:33 pm UTC

(no subject) - (Anonymous), 2004-11-06 05:04 am UTC

smo, 2004-11-06 08:50 am UTC

(no subject) - (Anonymous), 2004-11-06 09:46 pm UTC

vixen, 2004-11-05 07:55 pm UTC

andsoyoudied, 2004-11-06 08:25 pm UTC

phosfate, 2004-11-05 06:48 pm UTC

smo, 2004-11-05 07:34 pm UTC

smo, 2004-11-05 08:01 pm UTC

xero_sky, 2004-11-05 08:39 pm UTC

smo, 2004-11-05 10:35 pm UTC

inquisition, 2004-11-06 02:23 pm UTC

blackhat, 2004-11-05 10:52 pm UTC

plazmah, 2004-11-07 06:15 am UTC

lykaios, 2004-11-09 06:54 pm UTC

msmanna, 2004-11-05 03:07 pm UTC

msmanna, 2004-11-05 03:08 pm UTC

smo, 2004-11-05 07:59 pm UTC

msmanna, 2004-11-05 08:08 pm UTC

smo, 2004-11-05 08:16 pm UTC

msmanna, 2004-11-05 09:44 pm UTC

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puipui, 2004-11-06 09:46 am UTC

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msmanna, 2004-11-06 12:45 pm UTC

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puipui, 2004-11-06 05:12 pm UTC

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msmanna, 2004-11-06 06:43 pm UTC

(no subject) - cicer, 2004-11-05 11:25 pm UTC

zannechaos, 2004-11-05 10:53 am UTC

bubosquared, 2004-11-05 04:20 pm UTC

smo, 2004-11-05 07:54 pm UTC

bubosquared, 2004-11-07 07:38 pm UTC

bitca, 2004-11-05 05:45 pm UTC

zannechaos, 2004-11-06 12:41 am UTC

sarajayechan, 2004-11-07 01:46 am UTC

eljuno, 2004-11-07 10:29 am UTC

smo, 2004-11-08 02:40 am UTC

	mouseybrown 2004-11-05 02:32 pm UTC (link)
	What if she's raped with a nine foot pole? grins Hey! Leave the vertically enabled Poles out of this! (Reply to this)(Thread)

	hellespont 2004-11-06 04:53 am UTC (link)
	As a tall Pole, I agree whole-heartedly. Pole-heartedly, even. (Reply to this)(Parent)(Thread)

(no subject) - cicer, 2004-11-06 06:15 am UTC

smo, 2004-11-06 08:47 am UTC

	*glee!* (Anonymous) 2004-11-08 09:29 pm UTC (link)
	I've been quoted! I feel so special now :) t (Reply to this)(Parent)

	(Anonymous) 2004-11-05 04:04 pm UTC (link)
	I've written a rape fic before... however not in a sexualised contex I.E for smut purposes, but to explore torture in all forms from a perpetrator's POV. TeaWithVoldy. (Reply to this)(Thread)

	smo 2004-11-05 07:58 pm UTC (link)
	I implied rape in one fic, but strictly for plot and background purposes. (Reply to this)(Parent)

	selene_avis 2004-11-06 06:56 am UTC (link)
	TeaWithVoldy made me think Téa Gardner x Voldemort in a Yu-Gi-Oh dub x Harry Potter crossover. Oi. The Happy Pills I'm on are very effective. (I had my wisdom teeth out this morning.) (Reply to this)(Parent)(Thread)

wakuchan, 2004-11-07 06:42 am UTC

selene_avis, 2004-11-07 06:46 pm UTC

	shun_mcdaddy 2004-11-05 04:16 pm UTC (link)
	Okay...... I think fanficrants should just quit being a community all together. Having over 200 members,of course your going to get the same old shit over and over again,then everybody's going to whine over and over again in in a "defensive,much?" way.XD (Reply to this)(Thread)

tiki
2004-11-05 07:50 pm UTC (link)

I tend to agree. Not necessarily about the community shutting down, but you have to figure there's a finite amount of subjects under the heading "fanfic" that people can rant about, so of course some of the more incendiary topics will get rehashed over and over again. Yes, the OP did generalize, and the OP didn't really say anything that hadn't been said a million times before, but you could say the same about the people making comments too. The word "rant" would also suggest that the person is merely venting and thus doesn't really merit a whole discussion.

(Reply to this)(Parent)(Thread)

shun_mcdaddy, 2004-11-05 07:55 pm UTC

smo, 2004-11-05 08:11 pm UTC

shun_mcdaddy, 2004-11-05 08:15 pm UTC

smo, 2004-11-05 08:18 pm UTC

smo, 2004-11-05 08:12 pm UTC

tiki, 2004-11-05 09:01 pm UTC

redwarrior
2004-11-05 04:54 pm UTC (link)

Well...you're free to write how you want, as long as it's not bad (guy rapes girl, she falls in love with him; guy rapes girl, girl goes lesbian; guy rapes guy/uke, guy/uke falls in love with him because the rapist has OMG TEH HEELING COCK!!!1!).

I personally am frustrated when someone reads my consensual BDSM fics (original and fanfic) and cries, "RAAAAPE!" in the reviews. (Whenever I try to do 'rape', it's not really rape per se. Considering the charas I work with, it's just on the borders of "consensual", threatening to spill over into "non-con"...or is it?)

(Reply to this)(Thread)

shun_mcdaddy, 2004-11-05 06:20 pm UTC

smo, 2004-11-05 07:38 pm UTC

msmanna, 2004-11-05 06:46 pm UTC

(no subject) - (Anonymous), 2004-11-05 07:15 pm UTC

smo, 2004-11-05 07:31 pm UTC

(no subject) - (Anonymous), 2004-11-06 03:41 am UTC

smo, 2004-11-06 08:59 am UTC

(no subject) - (Anonymous), 2004-11-06 09:49 pm UTC

smo, 2004-11-05 07:36 pm UTC

pyratejenni, 2004-11-05 08:49 pm UTC

(no subject) - (Anonymous), 2004-11-06 02:53 am UTC

greekhoop, 2004-11-06 12:14 am UTC

(no subject) - layne, 2004-11-07 09:45 am UTC

smo, 2004-11-08 02:41 am UTC

sluggirl, 2004-11-06 03:49 am UTC

(no subject) - cicer, 2004-11-06 06:21 am UTC

smo, 2004-11-06 08:35 am UTC

ecchaniz0r, 2004-11-06 08:38 pm UTC

smo, 2004-11-06 10:07 pm UTC

nevadafighter, 2004-11-06 05:12 am UTC

selene_avis, 2004-11-06 07:00 am UTC

smo, 2004-11-06 08:25 am UTC

selene_avis, 2004-11-06 06:43 pm UTC

smo, 2004-11-06 07:55 pm UTC

gal_montag, 2004-11-06 05:12 am UTC

smo, 2004-11-06 08:48 am UTC

pyratejenni
2004-11-05 05:06 pm UTC (link)

I always think of "rapefic" not as stuff written for one's personal fantasies or exploration of a theme/situation, but stories where the author intends to punish the strong female character for "getting in the way", "hurting" or otherwise not being the Compleat Stepford Wife to the male character of the author's choice. One of the previous incarnations of GAFF had a story where the author had Willow arrange to have Buffy raped by 50 men because "shes such a bitch to spike lol".

Then there's the holy-fuck-he's-not-serious-right?flatout misogynistic puke written by the Nick Bents of the world.

(Reply to this)(Thread)

panthea, 2004-11-05 05:08 pm UTC

pyratejenni, 2004-11-05 08:48 pm UTC

panthea, 2004-11-05 08:58 pm UTC

smo, 2004-11-05 10:33 pm UTC

mistressrenet, 2004-11-05 09:49 pm UTC

smo, 2004-11-05 10:27 pm UTC

mistressrenet, 2004-11-06 06:40 am UTC

smo, 2004-11-06 08:29 am UTC

ecchaniz0r, 2004-11-06 08:40 pm UTC

mistressrenet, 2004-11-06 10:00 pm UTC

smo, 2004-11-08 02:38 am UTC

schoenschoen, 2004-11-07 03:31 pm UTC

smo, 2004-11-08 02:37 am UTC

... -

schoenschoen, 2004-11-08 04:08 am UTC

... -

smo, 2004-11-08 05:57 am UTC

sarajayechan, 2004-11-07 01:51 am UTC

(no subject) - (Anonymous), 2004-11-07 09:36 pm UTC

smo, 2004-11-08 02:34 am UTC

	(Anonymous) 2004-11-05 07:17 pm UTC (link)
	I personally don't care for rapefic, and find it semi-offensive if it isn't written correctly, but I really don't care who reads it, who doesn't, and why. I mean, in the end, we all like cheese, right? Yours, The Anonymouse (Reply to this)(Thread)

smo, 2004-11-05 07:30 pm UTC

mistressrenet, 2004-11-05 09:50 pm UTC

smo, 2004-11-05 10:25 pm UTC

mistressrenet, 2004-11-06 06:33 am UTC

smo, 2004-11-06 08:33 am UTC

(no subject) - (Anonymous), 2004-11-06 02:52 am UTC

mistressrenet, 2004-11-06 05:20 am UTC

(no subject) - (Anonymous), 2004-11-06 09:50 pm UTC

(no subject) - (Anonymous), 2004-11-06 02:56 am UTC

smo, 2004-11-06 09:01 am UTC

(no subject) - (Anonymous), 2004-11-06 09:54 pm UTC

panthea, 2004-11-06 06:14 pm UTC

smo, 2004-11-06 06:34 pm UTC

(no subject) - (Anonymous), 2004-11-06 09:52 pm UTC

ecchaniz0r, 2004-11-06 08:42 pm UTC

(no subject) - ataniell93, 2004-11-08 05:36 am UTC

kraken_sleeps
2004-11-05 08:42 pm UTC (link)

I think that that the very idea of comparing fanfic rape to real rape trivializes the reality. They are so obviously not the same thing. Bitch please.

I hate when you've thought up a fabulous, well thought-out post with reference to current and historical psychological studies about sexual aggression, trends in media portrayals of the male/female dynamic and the role of fanfiction in a progressively feminist online culture and then someone condenses it into two sentences.

On the other hand.

*applauds*

(Reply to this)(Thread)

littlebitca, 2004-11-06 02:32 am UTC

selene_avis, 2004-11-06 07:08 am UTC

(no subject) - (Anonymous), 2004-11-06 06:46 pm UTC

smo, 2004-11-06 07:53 pm UTC

drworm
2004-11-05 09:30 pm UTC (link)

My favorite part of this is:

In fact, once (sorry, I no longer have the link) I ran into an author who liked to writer stories about Trowa raping Heero and how Trowa really didn't mean to, he just couldn't express his love in any other way.

Yeah, when I say I think that's me? I'm not kidding. I could probably find the email conversation from... oh, three or four years ago if I tried logging into my old address.

It was painfully, painfully hilarious to read this just on that note. How could it not be? An amateur Internet psychologist has diagnosed me as a rape victim! If that is referring to me, of course, and I pretty much think it is.

The crap writing in question is still up on my site, though I've been thinking of taking it down for years; it is, after all, crap... and crap that I wrote when I was fifteen, no less. The crap I write now is slightly less so, but funnily enough the subject matter hasn't changed too drastically. *shrugs* And Gundam Wing was like a magnet for bad fanfic, anyway. I don't think I ever tried to use rape between two characters as a springboard to romance; I may be wrong. I sure as hell haven't done it lately, though, as I'm pretty sure I'd remember.

Meh. Getting defensive on the Internet over fanfic is masturbatory in the extreme. I think I'll just quit now. The dead horse has been duly flogged and the dark master appeased!

(Reply to this)(Thread)

smo, 2004-11-05 10:30 pm UTC

drworm, 2004-11-05 10:42 pm UTC

smo, 2004-11-05 11:46 pm UTC

cie_anthy, 2004-11-06 12:33 am UTC

kinneas, 2004-11-06 01:24 am UTC

smo, 2004-11-06 09:08 am UTC

phosfate, 2004-11-06 04:45 am UTC

Pointless, pointless anecdote: -

virago, 2004-11-06 01:39 am UTC

Re: Pointless, pointless anecdote: -

smo, 2004-11-06 09:06 am UTC

Re: Pointless, pointless anecdote: -

virago, 2004-11-06 06:13 pm UTC

sarracenia, 2004-11-06 03:23 am UTC

ecchaniz0r, 2004-11-06 08:31 pm UTC

geegaw, 2004-11-06 03:27 am UTC

phosfate, 2004-11-06 04:41 am UTC

smo, 2004-11-06 08:53 am UTC

ecchaniz0r, 2004-11-06 08:32 pm UTC

mistressrenet, 2004-11-06 06:37 am UTC

smo, 2004-11-06 08:32 am UTC

iczer6, 2004-11-06 02:07 am UTC

drworm, 2004-11-06 04:00 am UTC

iczer6, 2004-11-06 04:04 am UTC

drworm, 2004-11-06 04:08 am UTC

smo, 2004-11-06 08:57 am UTC

(no subject) - winterfox, 2004-11-06 10:04 am UTC

ecchaniz0r, 2004-11-06 08:33 pm UTC

mistressrenet, 2004-11-06 10:59 pm UTC

... -

ecchaniz0r, 2004-11-07 04:21 am UTC

... -

mistressrenet, 2004-11-08 03:14 pm UTC

	kinneas 2004-11-06 01:21 am UTC (link)
	Hrmn, I read and fantasize about the whole m/m molestation-rape thing on occasion, though not for the sex but rather a hot guy getting the crap beaten out of him. Sex is just part of the package, really. I'm a bit of a sadist with fictional characters, I'm afraid. Come to think of it, it's really evolved to just getting off on fictional violence for me. (Reply to this)(Thread)

panthea, 2004-11-06 08:32 am UTC

	adora_spintriae 2004-11-06 01:49 am UTC (link)
	Now I know all you sexually repressed fangirls... She expects them to pay attention to her after this? toodles off to read fics about Harry getting jumped by members of the Weasley brood (Reply to this)(Thread)

kinneas, 2004-11-06 02:29 am UTC

smo, 2004-11-06 09:03 am UTC

wolfie_thu
2004-11-06 03:28 am UTC (link)

OH NOES!!111!! Someone gets off on something in fiction that they would never condone in real life! The HORROR! The horror...
Why do people find it so difficult to understand that liking something in fiction does not necessarily add up to liking it in real life? I mean, do they think that everyone out there who, say, roleplays as an assassin thinks murder for money is a good idea?

rape is about POWER and DOMINATION.

Speaking as a sadist: no, really? You don't say?
That's why I like rapefic. It allows me to play around with these themes in a way I'd never be able to do fully (or would ever permit myself to do) in real life. (Which is actually why I'd prefer less rapefic had things like "the victim really wanted it, and falls in love with the rapist latter".)
[/endwank]

(Reply to this)(Thread)

drworm, 2004-11-06 04:17 am UTC

selene_avis, 2004-11-06 07:13 am UTC

ecchaniz0r, 2004-11-06 08:47 pm UTC

drworm, 2004-11-07 06:44 am UTC

smo, 2004-11-08 02:44 am UTC

selene_avis, 2004-11-07 06:44 pm UTC

phosfate, 2004-11-06 04:36 am UTC

(no subject) - (Anonymous), 2004-11-06 08:00 am UTC

smo, 2004-11-06 08:55 am UTC

andsoyoudied, 2004-11-06 08:29 pm UTC

sarajayechan, 2004-11-07 01:53 am UTC

plazmah, 2004-11-07 06:29 am UTC

sarajayechan, 2004-11-07 06:31 am UTC

plazmah, 2004-11-07 06:57 am UTC

sarajayechan, 2004-11-07 07:00 am UTC

plazmah, 2004-11-07 07:03 am UTC

sarajayechan, 2004-11-07 07:06 am UTC

gal_montag
2004-11-06 05:11 am UTC (link)

See, now, my first exposure to rape fic was rape fic written by fangirls who were trying to cause teh ANGST! and OMG, I'M SO SHOCKING!?!?!!?!!!!!And so, it was poorly written and made no sense and I couldn't figure out why Heero was being raped by his gundam of all things.

And frankly, fanfiction that serves no other purpouse than to be shocking kinda bores me. I mean, write that if you want, I just won't read it.

Because, y'know, that matters to people...

(Reply to this)(Thread)

iczer6, 2004-11-06 07:27 am UTC

ilpalazzo, 2004-11-07 06:28 am UTC

gal_montag, 2004-11-08 05:08 am UTC

	oh, common wank number 4 dana 2004-11-06 02:32 pm UTC (link)
	sigh I've been in online fandom for about 8 years now, and this particular wank gets brought up at least once every six months. Doesn't it get a little...old? head to desk (Reply to this)

	sarajayechan 2004-11-07 10:27 pm UTC (link)
	read the original post Wow, athenia45, generalize much? :P (Reply to this)

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