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	sagralisse 2003-06-28 06:21 pm UTC (link)
	Not rape, but sexual harrassment in the workplace. I think our common tater forgot that those girls made lots 'o money from the geek boys men who tuned into their show ever week to get off on the lesbian vibes. (Reply to this)(Thread)

	slippery_fish 2003-06-28 08:54 pm UTC (link)
	But...but...it's not about the money. It's about RESPECT! (Reply to this)(Parent)

	iczer6 2003-06-28 07:01 pm UTC (link)
	I think this person kinda missed an important fact. These authors aren't writinga bout Renee O'Connor and Lucy Lawless, they're writing about Xena and Gabrielle who are FICTIONAL CHARACTERS. See it's the whole seperating fiction from reality thing again. Icz (Reply to this)(Thread)

	slippery_fish 2003-06-28 08:52 pm UTC (link)
	See it's the whole seperating fiction from reality thing again. Well, living in fiction is better anyway...;) (Reply to this)(Parent)

	rhi_silverflame 2003-06-29 12:44 am UTC (link)
	Well, there is a tiny bit of LL/ROC RPS out there . . . most people in the Xenaverse don't seem to be really keen on it though. Which is fine by me, as RPS is definitely not my bag. (Reply to this)(Parent)

	rann 2003-06-29 12:54 am UTC (link)
	"But Xena can't fly!" "I told you, I'm not Xena, I'm Lucy Lawless." "... Oh." o.o (Reply to this)(Parent)(Thread)

	iczer6 2003-06-29 12:57 am UTC (link)
	Ya know I was waiting for someone to say that... Icz (Reply to this)(Parent)(Thread)

	Re: rann 2003-06-29 12:59 am UTC (link)
	So glad I could help. ^.^ An-tis-ih-pay-shun o/` (Reply to this)(Parent)

	phosfate 2003-06-30 05:53 pm UTC (link)
	This year's Simpsons Halloween toy set is based on that episode, including a Lucy Lawless figure. This makes me happy in so many ways it's not even funny. (Reply to this)(Parent)

	virago 2003-06-28 07:15 pm UTC (link)
	Of course it's the same! I know I'd do everything I've written about in fanfic. Like give birth to a megalomaniacal supervillain who will grow up to destroy the world. I've got that scheduled for next Tuesday. (Reply to this)(Thread)

	littlekitsch 2003-06-28 07:19 pm UTC (link)
	You're doing that TOO?! Dammit, I need to think of something even more outrageous now... weeps I was going to call him Alan... (Reply to this)(Parent)(Thread)

	slippery_fish 2003-06-28 08:51 pm UTC (link)
	Well, they could fight for who is allowed to destroy the world... (Reply to this)(Parent)

	moonjaguar 2003-06-28 09:45 pm UTC (link)
	She thinks Missy Good is Gawd. I couldn't read any further. twitch (Reply to this)

	uniquesnowflake 2003-06-28 11:02 pm UTC (link)
	I can't make fun of her. She's BLIND. Damn. Wait... If she's blind, what is she doing reading fanfiction? Does she have one of those kewl new computers that reads everything to her, or something? Does somebody ELSE read her the fanfiction? baffled (Reply to this)(Thread)

	sharkwithfeet 2003-06-29 02:27 am UTC (link)
	Actually, the technology that allows blind people to access the web and email is not particularly new. I know the text-to-audio stuff and braille keyboards have been around for at least five years or so, because I've had blind and vision-impaired friends, both online and IRL, who've been using them at least that long. (Reply to this)(Parent)(Thread)

	moonjaguar 2003-06-29 03:30 am UTC (link)
	Oh yeah, my ex boyfriend was totally blind (as in no eyes) as was his cousin (inherited the same tumors that are now correctable by laser surgery rather than by removing the entire eyeball). They both had what they called "talking computers" in the early '90s (I imagine they've grown more sophisticated since then). (Reply to this)(Parent)

uniquesnowflake
2003-06-29 03:40 am UTC (link)

Well, I know they've been around since the 90s and a bit earlier (though not all of them then could work with The Interweb), and have since advanced, but the thing that got me was WHY is she using this technology to read and complain about BUFFY FANFIC?

I've got a blind Aunt, so I'm certainly not knocking the visually impaired, or anything, but Hellen Keller she is NOT.

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	uniquesnowflake 2003-06-29 03:41 am UTC (link)
	Er. Xena, even. DAMN YOU, TELEVISION SITCOMS AND FANDOM WANK! YOU ARE ROTTING MY BRAIN! DAMN YOU! DAMN YOU ALL TO HELL! (Reply to this)(Parent)

	croupier 2003-06-29 04:47 am UTC (link)
	Nope. She certainly does not seem like a socialist activist to me. Helen Keller is not her. Crisis averted! You are right, though--it does seem kind of strange for a blind person to read fanfiction based in a visual medium, but whatever wanks her boat, I guess. (Reply to this)(Parent)(Thread)

	phosfate 2003-06-30 05:55 pm UTC (link)
	Well, that is kind of the point of accessibility. Does Xena include a DV audio track? (Reply to this)(Parent)

moonjaguar
2003-06-28 11:53 pm UTC (link)

All righty, I got past my anti-Merpupness (Missy Good actually seems like a reasonably sane person but the Merwolfpack makes me twitch and MG was held up as a yardstick for all fanfic writers to measure up to in the past and I. Was. An. Evilbad. Because. I thought it was bullshit).

Xena and Gabrielle + sex toys/BDSM in fanfic = ROC/LL being raped? I don't get it.

That and I love how she turns it into All About Me! Me! Me with fries and a shake! though she uses the "you" pronoun in this little gem: You are in the workplace, in school, or busy doing whatever it is that you spend the majority of your time doing. There are straight men that eye you, maybe even leer at you. Then they decide, under the guise of being a "bard" that they will write sex stories about you, and place them on the Internet for all to see. In these stories, they have you performing oral sex on them, and even on their buddies. In their stories, they take you anally, share you, and have you performing every kinky sex act they can think of.

Um... while there are quite a large amount of male subtext/slash writers in Xena fan fiction (as well as male writers of genfic and het), I've counted most of the writers to be female. She's overpersonalizing. And I'll repeat what's been said again and again: she's mixing up the characters and the actors. I could maybe understand her getting twitched if she was reading RPS but she's not even mentioning it.

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	uniquesnowflake 2003-06-29 12:39 am UTC (link)
	I don't think I'd mind at all if one of my co-workers decided it would be fun to anally take me fictionally. As long as it keeps them from grabbing my ass... Besides, 90% of the Xena fic I've seen has been not only female-produced, as you said, but between two men or two women. Mmmm, Aries. (Reply to this)(Parent)(Thread)

moonjaguar
2003-06-29 03:20 am UTC (link)

Over the years I've had a co-worker or two...er, never mind.

Or else a lot of Xena fic written by men or women (or men and women collaborations in some cases) tends to be more adventure or hurt/comfort focus than sexual. I always trot out the Xenaverse when anyone claims that slash is exclusively female though. Though I haven't been active in it since I crossed over Hornblower with Xena in... er... '98? '99? (no men got pregnant though.

Mmm, Hercules. Ares. Draco. Ulysses. Iolaus....

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	bohicamouse 2003-06-29 10:48 am UTC (link)
	Ares . . . sniffle Poor Kevin Smith. Now he dead from gravity. (Reply to this)(Parent)(Thread)

	phosfate 2003-06-30 05:56 pm UTC (link)
	*AHAHAHAHAHAHHAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA--choke* Um, I mean, that was really tasteless and shame on you. (Reply to this)(Parent)

iczer6
2003-06-29 01:00 am UTC (link)

>>I could maybe understand her getting twitched if she was reading RPS but she's not even mentioning it.>>

Well RPS is a whole nother ball O' wank that I don't really want to get into right now.

But like you said Xena and Gabrielle are just characters. I'd like to think that Ms. Lawless and Ms. O'Connor are intelligent enough to know the difference and not be offended by it.

Icz

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moonjaguar
2003-06-29 03:25 am UTC (link)

It's well known that RPS is not my slice of pizza but I wouldn't go so far as to call it a violation of the living persons portrayed.

TPTB (and the actors) know about fanfic. I don't know if the "do not read" applied to the actors but it did to the writers/producers/directors. They broke their own directive by having Missy Good write a couple screenplays for them. When I first heard of it all I could think of was "What the shit is this?" but figure now, looking back, that it's great they were okay with the concept of fanfic since I later found out some authors/rights holders/companies in various fandoms aren't.

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	phosfate 2003-06-30 06:01 pm UTC (link)
	My literary guilty pleasure is MG's Dar and Kerry books, even though they have slowly crept from Teh Camp to Teh Suck. Melissa! ::hits with stick:: It's called conflict! It's what makes plots! ::hits again:: Remember? ::hits harder:: I can't stop reading them. I hate myself. (Reply to this)(Parent)

	beandelphiki 2003-06-28 11:57 pm UTC (link)
	"Bards"? (Reply to this)(Thread)

	uniquesnowflake 2003-06-29 12:40 am UTC (link)
	Don't look at me! I always thought that bards wrote (and more specifically, sang) epic poetry, and not fanfiction... (Reply to this)(Parent)(Thread)

	moonjaguar 2003-06-29 03:27 am UTC (link)
	(puts on Gabrielle costume) "I sing the song of Perdicus...!" (Reply to this)(Parent)(Thread)

	phosfate 2003-06-30 05:57 pm UTC (link)
	"He married me. We shagged once. Now he dead from Callisto." (Reply to this)(Parent)(Thread)

	Re: moonjaguar 2003-06-30 11:08 pm UTC (link)
	giggle sounds like an icon idea... (Reply to this)(Parent)

	kannaophelia 2003-07-01 04:59 am UTC (link)
	Oh dear. I'm all nostalgic now for the Campaign To Give Gabrielle Back her Virginity. (Reply to this)(Parent)(Thread)

	slippery_fish 2003-07-06 11:44 pm UTC (link)
	The what ? (Reply to this)(Parent)(Thread)

kannaophelia
2003-07-07 05:13 am UTC (link)

I hope it was mostly a joke. I really do. This subtext list I was involved on way, way back, got really really upset about the whole Perdicus thing, and said Gabrielle had lost all that was truly special about her by being with a man, and were trying to start a campaign for the writers to write some kind of magical intervention to restore her virginity.

It's was probably meant in jest, and only didn't feel that way because I have too little sense of humour... or because I've read too many stories in which for one reason or another Gabrielle was lying when she said she'd consummated her marriage.

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	slippery_fish 2003-07-07 08:33 pm UTC (link)
	The Xena fandom is strange... (Reply to this)(Parent)

	sidewinder 2003-06-29 07:32 am UTC (link)
	"Bards" Eh, it's just the pretentious way Xenaverse fan-fic authors like to refer to themselves, modelling after Gabrielle. You don't really want to know. I am just somewhat boggling that Whoosh! is still going... (Reply to this)(Parent)(Thread)

	croupier 2003-06-30 02:33 am UTC (link)
	::snickers at your icon:: (Reply to this)(Parent)

	I think we've all learned an important lesson here. glasshouses 2003-06-29 08:11 pm UTC (link)
	PG rated fanfic is Great & Respectful, PG-13 rated fanfic is not-quite-great, R-rated fanfic is not-so-hot and NC-17 fanfic is sexual harrassment of real people. When I've digested and understood that, I'll take on Bush's foreign policy. P.S. - I've really got to get myself an icon! (Reply to this)