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Jon "Bad Wasabi" Wood ([info]mcity) wrote in [info]fandom_wank,
@ 2006-03-03 15:24:00


Previous Entry  Add to memories!  Tell a Friend!  Next Entry
Entry tags:my pretension let me show you it, webcomics

Webcomics wank.
There's a new book coming out; "The History of Webcomics", by the self-styled webcomics expert T. Campbell. The cover features unauthourized likenesses of PA's Gabe, Scott McCloud, Piro, and several others. Several people are pissed, including Pvp's Scott Kurtz. In short, he claims the book is self-important, poorly-written crap.

Permission vs. Forgiveness
Posted on Wednesday, March 1, 2006

It's been a long time since I really got into a good rant. So roll up your pant legs because it's about to get knee deep in here.

The first thing I need you all to do is take a good look at this ad for the upcoming Antarctic Press book "The History of Webcomics", written by T. Campbell.

This ad has my blood boiling. Discussing it with T. Campbell himself and reading his blog about our discussion didn't help matters at all.

Allow me to let you guys in on a little secret about T. Campbell. He is most certainly NOT a "World-reknown webcomics historian." He knows it, you know it and Antarctic Press knows it. To print that is a false statement. If T. Campbell is a "world-reknown webcomics historian" then I'm a "world-reknown fitness expert." They knew they were lying. They printed it anyway.

Neither T. Campbell, nor Antarctic Press bothered to get permission from Scott McCloud, Penny-Arcade, Inc, Fred Gallagher, Suck.com or Charley Parker to use the names of their strips and likenesses of their characters on the cover of the book or for the purposes of promoting it. Both of them knew the proper way to go about doing things. They printed it anyway.

When I asked T, who's idea it was to use the names and likenesses of popular webcomics to promote the book, he found the answer "hard to pin down." Although he didn't specifically ASK his editors to do so, he did mention that using popular webcomics mentioned in the book to promote it could appeal to those popular webcomics established audiences.

So let me just cut through the bullshit for everybody. They knew exactly what they were doing. They decided that it would be easier to ask forgiveness than permission. They printed it anyway. The book doesn't come out for a couple months. Plenty of time for apologies, cover alterations and maintaining ones innocence on blogs. But none of that will undo the fact that Antarctic and T. Campbell have already printed that ad in the PREVIEWS catalog and used the names of popular webcomics to promote their book without permission.

Antarctic Press has been around for years as a publisher. They know the proper way to do stuff. Don't think differently.

Don't judge a book by it's cover



Beyond the cover, I've only skimmed this book. I have it here to read, but have only bothered with chapter three in detail as it was the chapter Mr. T. asked me to create an illustration for. After hearing T's perspective on this chapter, I refused to do so because I didn't want to endorse his words with my art. The chapter is entitled "The Seven Horsemen" and it details the seven people who were the big guns in the inception of the webcomics community.

The seven horsemen, according to our "world-reknown webcomics historian" are:

Scott McCloud
Pete Abrams
J.D. Frazier
Jerry Holkins and Mike Krahaulik
Scott Kurtz
and Fred Gallagher.

Chris Crosby is not listed. I don't think Keenspot is even mentioned. Scott McCloud, on the other hand, has EIGHT pages dedicated to him. Scott's a friend and I respect and love the man. But was he more influential on the early formations of webcomics than Chris Crosby?

Rodney Caston, who co-created Megatokyo, is also not listed as a horseman. When I called T on this, he told me that he didn't feel it was needed to include Rodney. Not only that, but Rodney informs that the book contains a quote from Fred on the reason they duo split that is completely false. Of course, Rodney never had a chance to dispute it, because he was never contacted about the book.

I contributed strips and interview time to T. Campbell for this book despite disliking the idea of it. Why? Because at least this way I have some say over what is documented about me in this history of webcomics. At least I have a say. I could have ended up like Rodney.

How I would do it.



In my opinion....

This book is nothing more than another self-masturbatory project of the new webcomics cognoscenti crowd. Rather than try to make a name for himself by actually CREATING something, Mr. T. has to piggy-back himself on the webcomics creators out there giving it their all.

I love what I do. I love talking to other cartoonists who are doing the same thing. It's exciting to watch it all unfold. The experiments, successes, failures, accomplishments...all of this should be documented in case one day someone, besides ourselves, DOES care to learn about our history. But right now, nobody outside of our own circle even gives a shit.

If I were in charge of putting a book like this together, I think I would just let everyone tell their own story, even if they overlap and contradict each other. The contradictions would at least be compelling. It would be like listening to your grandparents retell the same story differently. Sure the recollection isn't as accurate, but at least it's compelling and the perspectives are genuine. Maybe it's something that should be more open-source and wiki-like than something that reads like a term paper.

A project like that would benefit the community on a whole.

Of course, it doesn't do much in the way of making "world reknown" experts, does it?

Great Teacher Largo w31gh5 in.
Recently published "The History of Webcomics" ... has my blood boiling.

After seeing the section on the history of MegaTokyo, I think I may need to have a few words with the fine folks over at Antartic Press... or five minutes alone in a room with Bonzo the Wonder Chimp in their fact checking department...

The author, T. Campbell, is a self-professed "world-renowned web comic historian" ... Now I'm not entirely sure how a person goes about obtaining that title, but I'm sure there is a very real institute out there which awards it in order to ensure that only the finest candidates are selected.

For this reason I am deeply troubled that the institute's golden child has failed to do the most basic of research. It reasons if someone would want to know the history of something, they ought to say - ask the source, and since I was not contacted I do not see how that was done in this case.

Though the book is not due out for several months, I was given a heads up about a few excerpts of pure fantasy that will be published.

Update:


After originally posting this entry, world-renowned T. Campbell decided to post on my forums with the following:

"If the section you quote really does strike you as pure fantasy, then you need to talk to Fred, because it's been on his site for more than a year"


He is correct in that it has been there for a year; however that does not in any way excuse him from my criticism of his writing a chronicle of me or my work without attempting to consult with me first. At the very least Campbell should instead name his book " The Hearsay of Webcomics." ...

It speaks volumes that his book is nothing more then googled blog entries.

Though, I think industry poobah Steve Fellows said it best:
"Any journalist or researcher knows that you don't take one source as valid, especially when there could be reasons for that source to alter the truth. Any "well renowned" anybody would corroborate his evidence with other sources; otherwise, he is following in the footsteps of James Frey (Million Little Pieces) and Jason Blair (New York Times scandal) and we all know what happened to them.

Mr. T Campbell should definitely send this essay to Barbara Walters and the news crew of 60 Minutes; because they clearly don't know what they are doing.

And it's true that the written word is way more "truthful"; just ask Lenin, Stalin, and those old publishers of Pravda. I suppose Mr. T Campbell has not heard of "spin" albeit it comes in both verbal and written form; but at least in written form you have time to craft ("lie") more carefully; as opposed to verbal, which means you have cover voice nuances, and think on your feet.

Let's hope that Antarctic Press follows in those publisher's footsteps and takes the proper steps to promote truth."


The comments, of course, explode with PiroBashing. There is a comparison to Michael Jackson. In the first comment.

Campbell himself comments. He basically laughs at being under the spotlight of, um, the Internet, claims the artists approved the use of their characters, and one more that I don't understand at all. Some Asian dude weighs in (actually how I found out about the drama). MT's down, so I can't check up on the forums there.
EDIT: Found this checking PVP's referrers; LOL.
EDIT the second: Websnark weighs in. (Thanks [info]soleta!)Among the commenters is Kris Straub (Checkerboard Nightmare), Melonpool's Steve Troop, Ubersoft's Chris Wright, Sam and Fuzzy's Sam Logan, and probably more!


(Post a new comment)


[info]eljuno
2006-03-03 11:20 pm UTC (link)
God Bless Indietits.

(Reply to this)


[info]mister_terrific
2006-03-03 11:22 pm UTC (link)
Yeah, I've been watching this one evolve. For some reason Kurtz has a major hardon about the Megatokyo kerfluffle, and I swear he goes looking for reasons to rant about it.

Of course, the fact that you don't see the name "Scott Kurtz" amid the "horsemen" might also explain a few things.

Campbell conceded that he'd neglected to get permissions for the cover art, then went out and got them. The rest of the kerfluffle is pretty much bullcrap, IMHO.

As for Caston...my feeling is that once he accepted the buyout terms and more importantly the cash, he immediately lost any right to whine. Not that this has stopped him, mind you.

I think Piro's just going to pretend it's not happening and move along, which is probably the sanest act among them.

Mister Terrific
Defender of Fair Play

(Reply to this)(Thread)


[info]amxjm
2006-03-04 12:01 am UTC (link)
Of course, the fact that you don't see the name "Scott Kurtz" amid the "horsemen" might also explain a few things.

Huh?

The seven horsemen, according to our "world-reknown webcomics historian" are:

Scott McCloud
Pete Abrams
J.D. Frazier
Jerry Holkins and Mike Krahaulik
Scott Kurtz
and Fred Gallagher.

(Reply to this)(Parent)(Thread)


[info]mister_terrific
2006-03-04 12:17 am UTC (link)
I missed that one. Somehow. Blame it on Friday.

Mister Terrific
Will Someday Learn To Read More Carefully

(Reply to this)(Parent)


[info]gloria_mundi
2006-03-04 05:57 am UTC (link)
Okay, the way I heard it was Caston lost interest in MT so Fred bought him out and kept going. The buyout was mutual and Caston is happy as a clam for Fred. They stayed friends.

No?

(Reply to this)(Parent)(Thread)


[info]blakey
2006-03-04 11:30 am UTC (link)
That's what Fred says. Caston says that Fred told him he had to sell or he'd just quit altogether just before the books were published.

Caston wanted the books to be published and to make at least some money off his work, so he sold out for a flat rate.

To me it sounds like two sides of the same story being told by people with two very different views on the subject.

(Reply to this)(Parent)(Thread)


[info]gloria_mundi
2006-03-06 05:36 am UTC (link)
Aint that always the way?

(Reply to this)(Parent)


[info]slackerbitch
2006-03-03 11:32 pm UTC (link)
Hasn't Scott Kurtz been wanked here before? I seem to remember him being the drama type.

(Reply to this)(Thread)


[info]ktnb
2006-03-03 11:44 pm UTC (link)
The man is a wank machine. All of his time spent not working on comics is spent whining and bitching about how he's basically god's gift to webcomics and no one appreciates him. I'm willing to bet even money that half of his whining on this book stems from the fact that none of his characters are on the cover.

</rant>

(Reply to this)(Parent)(Thread)


[info]soleta
2006-03-04 01:11 am UTC (link)
*cackles*

I just said to a channel full of comic fen "wtf Scott Kurtz is wanking again?"

they said: "you say that like he ever stops."

(Reply to this)(Parent)(Thread)


[info]ktnb
2006-03-04 01:54 am UTC (link)
That's why his comics have been deteriorating! He's doing it all with one hand!

(Reply to this)(Parent)


[info]moonpigeon
2006-03-04 03:58 am UTC (link)
The man is a wank machine.

Truer words have never been said.

(Reply to this)(Parent)


[info]mcity
2006-03-04 06:21 pm UTC (link)
I'm trying to make an icon, but my arm is screwed up. I'll have it later today.

(Reply to this)(Parent)


[info]notjo
2006-03-04 12:32 am UTC (link)
Was he the one that was wanking over that last-man-standing prize over daily comics?

(Reply to this)(Parent)(Thread)


[info]ilpalazzo
2006-03-04 01:30 am UTC (link)
Yes. Eventually, hip-deep in his own semen, he withdrew from the competition.

(Reply to this)(Parent)


[info]littleshebear
2006-03-03 11:55 pm UTC (link)
I know nothing about webcomics but I just had to comment to inform you that your icon pwns all.

(Reply to this)


[info]darkstarrie
2006-03-03 11:57 pm UTC (link)
T. Campbell? Oh, you mean WORLD-RENOWED WEBCOMICS EXPERT T. Campbell.

He wrote a comic about search engines once. I like the first panel the best.

(Reply to this)


[info]nlb_muffin
2006-03-04 12:17 am UTC (link)
Er, I thought the whole "world-reknowned webcomics expert" thing was a joke. You know, tongue-in-cheek? Funny? Webcomics are funny, aren't they?

(Reply to this)(Thread)


[info]mister_terrific
2006-03-04 12:20 am UTC (link)
Oh no. They're FUCKING SERIOUS BUSINESS.

Mister Terrific
Defender of Fair Play

(Reply to this)(Parent)


[info]seiberwing
2006-03-04 07:09 am UTC (link)
Webcomic historian...this reminds me of when I did a high school project on the 1990s.

(Reply to this)(Parent)


[info]notjo
2006-03-04 12:33 am UTC (link)
Is this the T. Campbell who works with Gisele whatever on Penny & Aggie?

(Reply to this)(Thread)


[info]mister_terrific
2006-03-04 12:38 am UTC (link)
Yup. Fun strip.

Mister Terrific
Etc.

(Reply to this)(Parent)


[info]nebbieq
2006-03-04 12:49 am UTC (link)
Huh! I was wondering where I saw Campbell's name before.

(Reply to this)(Parent)


[info]nlb_muffin
2006-03-04 12:53 am UTC (link)
I love you, 'cause I came across that comic a while ago, lost the link, and couldn't remember what it was called for the life of me.

(Reply to this)(Parent)


[info]jetwolf
2006-03-04 01:07 am UTC (link)
I only know of that strip because my best friend did a guest artist spot for a week or so.

And yes, this reply is nothing but a thinly veiled plug for her awesomeness, thanks for asking.

(Reply to this)(Parent)(Thread)


[info]penguinfaery
2006-03-04 03:58 am UTC (link)
You can tell your friend I only read Penny and Aggie because of her spot. Hadn't been for her, I wouldn't have give it a second glance. She wrocks my socks.

-Iwanttobeasleep@LJ borrowing her friend's journal to comment

(Reply to this)(Parent)


[info]moonpigeon
2006-03-04 04:01 am UTC (link)
I heard of T. Campbell back when he wrote a story arc for Cool Cat Studio. I didn't know Gisele was doing comics again.

(Reply to this)(Parent)


[info]greenling
2006-03-04 10:43 pm UTC (link)
He also does (did? I haven't checked it in a while) "FANS", which is cute. :3

(Reply to this)(Parent)


[info]notjo
2006-03-04 12:42 am UTC (link)
This book is nothing more than another self-masturbatory project of the new webcomics cognoscenti crowd.

I read a quote recently on the Anita Blake fanboard mentioned in the previous wank. It was something like "Gee, I hope they don't make a movie, because then we'll end up with a bunch of new fans, and they won't have been with us since the beginning, and it won't be cool, like we are."

This sounds an awful lot like that same attitude. "Where were *you* when it wasn't COOL to like webcomics, huh?"

Makes me want to say, "Yeah, well, I was playing D&D *long* before it was cool."

And the sad thing is this:
I bet if they'd shut up... less people who know about the damned book.

(Reply to this)


[info]soleta
2006-03-04 01:19 am UTC (link)
websnark weighs in.

(Reply to this)


[info]supertetris
2006-03-04 01:27 am UTC (link)
Blahblah, webcomic drama etc.
I just like the guy who does IndieTits and Questionable Content. Because I have a crush on Marten D:

(Reply to this)(Thread)


[info]heddychaa
2006-03-04 01:43 am UTC (link)
who DOESN'T have a crush on Marten. Unf unf.

(Reply to this)(Parent)(Thread)


[info]firebad
2006-03-04 02:08 am UTC (link)
Me. I like Dora. NURR.

(Reply to this)(Parent)(Thread)


[info]sepiamagpie
2006-03-04 02:29 am UTC (link)
I hold to the belief that they're the same person, or at least long lost twins. Questionable Content. Not afraid to take on the touchy subject of accidental incest.

(Reply to this)(Parent)(Thread)


[info]firebad
2006-03-05 01:40 am UTC (link)
I'm kinda in agreemenet with you. Did you see that strip last week where they were out on their "date", dressed identically with the same hair cuts? I shuddered. :)

(Reply to this)(Parent)


[info]supertetris
2006-03-04 08:31 pm UTC (link)
Your icon is the best icon. The end. It beats all the other icons, I don't care. The end.

(Reply to this)(Parent)(Thread)


[info]firebad
2006-03-05 01:40 am UTC (link)
Oh, thank you! Gotta say, it's far and away my favourite. Feel free to gank. :)

(Reply to this)(Parent)


[info]sheep
2006-03-04 01:33 am UTC (link)
In the link to your edit,

yeah, defriending feed

Yeah, I'm sure they care.

(Reply to this)


[info]sairobi
2006-03-04 01:55 am UTC (link)
I love how invoking McCloud is becoming the golden ticket to academic legitimacy among comics literati. McCloud is well and good, but I think there are a people more responsible for creating the culture of webcomics today than a guy who is primarily known for his work on comics theory.

(Or maybe I'm just bitter at the growing number of pretentious fuckwads slinging around words like 'iconic' because they're too cool to draw cartoons.)

(Reply to this)(Thread)

I think McCloud had a point-
[info]mcity
2006-03-04 06:30 pm UTC (link)
-in that the web was easier than print comics-but the fact that every other webcomic tries 'infinite canvas', absurdist comedy* and self-referential humour bugs me. That and the thousands of them who have no idea how to properly use a filter.

*[/selfpimp]

(Reply to this)(Parent)


[info]narcissam
2006-03-04 03:08 am UTC (link)
What the heck is a "world-reknown" expert anyway? We all forgot about him but lately we've started to rediscover him?

(Reply to this)


[info]penguinfaery
2006-03-04 04:02 am UTC (link)
Mad love to your icon. Yay, Dune.

(Reply to this)


[info]bangoskank
2006-03-04 06:40 am UTC (link)
This book is nothing more than another self-masturbatory project

Erm, is there a definition of "masturbatory" that I'm not aware of?

(Reply to this)(Thread)


[info]amxjm
2006-03-04 07:36 am UTC (link)
What, you've never heard of mutual masturbation?

(Reply to this)(Parent)


[info]hooverdam
2006-03-04 04:36 pm UTC (link)
another self-masturbatory project

In webcomics? The devil you say!

(Reply to this)


[info]meatfight
2006-03-05 06:59 am UTC (link)
Oh my god. You didn't mention he drew a comic about the thing. LAAAAAAME.

(Reply to this)


 
   
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