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Pyrate Jenni ([info]pyratejenni) wrote in [info]fandom_wank,
@ 2006-08-03 11:01:00


Previous Entry  Add to memories!  Tell a Friend!  Next Entry
Entry tags:cult of nice, entitlement

The Fragile Flowers Strike Back
Over on LJ [info]moonlight_tryst writes a long, admittedly wibbly, post about [info]furiosity's reviews and how she's scared of them:


I'm not sure how to start, really.

Do I dress the issue that's bothering me up in such a way that only I know what I'm talking about, but at least I've expressed my opinion?

Do I keep my mouth shut because I'm not one of the people who think it's a cool thing to do, because it's about freedom of expression and be dammed hurt feelings?

Or do I say what I think or feel & if fandom comes crashing down on my head - then so be it, it's been a great 2 years?

Okay, so here goes.



Let's start with the disclaimer first

I am not against free speech. Neither am I saying people cannot say or write what they want on their Lj, of course they can. But, I reserve the right to be concerned about something that may affect me without having the piss taken out of me, or being classed as one of those 'one to many drama queens' because I don't agree with someone when I express my opinion. This is not a [info]furiosity bashing post. This is me getting something off my chest as it affects me.

The Issue

The issue is two-fold, I suppose and both parts are connected. The first part is my self confidence, maybe even my personality and what I get out of fandom. The second part is the latest trend of posting subjective fic reviews, positive or negative, on Lj for others to see. It's the negative reviews that concern me, because some people may see them as indicators of poor fic, which is not their purpose.The first part affects my reaction to the second part, making me unhappy with this development.

Setting the scene.

I've met terrific people - some of whom are now real life friends. I've read fic that ranges from truly appalling to breathtakingly brilliant. I've laughed, cried, chewed my nails with the tension or suspense, and squirmed in delight at the erotica. I've commented on most of the fics I've read, although sometimes it's hard to be positive, and I've been encouraged, rightly or wrongly depending on your POV, to write. I have found writing to be fun and frustrating. Sometimes the words flow, sometimes the process is agonisingly slow. Above all, I've enjoyed flexing my imagination.

Yeah, yeah, very nice, but what's this got to do with 'the issue'?

If fandom were a classroom, then I would be on the average table, working away quietly and occasionally turning out above average work. Not enough to move me into the ‘above average’ group on a permanent basis & nowhere near good enough for the gifted & talented group. And that's fine – really, it is, because I’m not suffering from delusions of grandeur. Neither, by the way, am I suggesting that anyone I know is.

So quit whining, bitch, and get on with it!

In a classroom good work is rewarded (or should be) and in the fandom classroom that reward comes in the form of recs. Now, before I go any further, let me make it clear that I do understand that one person's rec is another person's poison. Got that? Good.

Imagine, dear reader, how thrilled I was to discover I had been put on the [info]hd_prophet's watcher Lj & that two of my fics had been recc'd. Thrilled? I was over the moon because it’s a form of recognition for that occasional ‘above average’ work. And please, all you successful authors out there rolling your eyes & muttering It’s all about writing for yourself & not readership, if that’s the case – why post at all? I’m being honest. This is how it affects me.

Now imagine knowing that, should any of my fic ever get recc’d again, it’s going to be subjected to a no holds barred review by one of the sharpest brains in fandom and that review will be posted where others can read it. And this, at last, is the crux of the matter.

I am not one of those confident suck it up bitches or go to hell in a hand cart types. If I were I could shrug this off. But I’m not and it saddens me. It saddens me because it will affect my confidence, and the confidence of others like me. Those of us just brave enough to finally take our feet off the bottom of the pond and swim.

I have contemplated asking the [info]hd_prophet to take me off their watcher Lj, because I know, rightly or wrongly, that a bad review would knock my confidence for six. It’s taken the shine off being recc’d somewhat.

To the “Well that’s your problem” brigade - remember where I said that part of the issue was my reaction? Well, this is my reaction.

To the “Tough shit!” brigade - yes, I’m well aware that it is, because really, who gives a fuck?

Now, who knows the name of a good dragon hide outfitter?


Okay. Whiney, but give her an A for honesty, right?

[info]furiosity replies. The discussion goes back and forth for a bit, with [info]furiosity trying to figure out exactly what [info]moonlight_tryst wants.

Then in comes [info]mordryn4 with the WTF:

You do know you're part of the silent majority, yes? Similar to how the overwhelming majority of Americans feel about Bush..."

[info]furiosity responds, and it turns out it was just a chance to go "nyah-nyah, I defriended yoooou! And you ARE scaring other people, you big meanie!"

Oh, fandom. Don't ever change.

ETA: Eeyore continues to be Unclear on the Concept: Day 8

ETA II: Bahleeted! But there's saves. Lots of saves.

The OP is in each link. Sorry for the constant re-read.

Original Post

mordryn4

But their opinions are OK!

More comments

Irony


furiosity

Odd comments

issues

Reviewing is fun

Why can't we be friends?


ETA 3:

One

Two

Three

Four

Thanks to [info]fandom_plank for supplying these.

ETA: The "furiosity" screencap has been taken down, to help save the website owner's webspace; others may or may not follow. They'll return when the webspace is stabilzed.

Mother of all ETAs: Furiosity is back! Many thanks to [info]princessdot for walking me through the ftp set up.




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[info]smo
2006-08-03 05:24 pm UTC (link)
Christ, what is it that people find so terrifying about direct confrontation? It's not the end of the fucking world.

(Reply to this)(Thread)

(no subject) - [info]llama_treats, 2006-08-03 05:27 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]limyaael, 2006-08-03 05:36 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]herdivineshadow, 2006-08-03 07:44 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]pyratejenni, 2006-08-03 07:52 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]missdaisy, 2006-08-03 08:20 pm UTC
Belated Icon Worship - [info]freezer, 2006-08-04 03:19 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]smo, 2006-08-05 01:46 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]sarajayechan, 2006-08-03 08:46 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]puipui, 2006-08-03 09:50 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]sarajayechan, 2006-08-03 09:52 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]missdaisy, 2006-08-03 09:59 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]puipui, 2006-08-03 11:16 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]drakyndra, 2006-08-04 10:03 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]smo, 2006-08-05 01:44 am UTC
(no subject) - flightstothesea, 2006-08-03 10:25 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]smo, 2006-08-05 01:44 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]ravenclaw_devi, 2006-08-04 12:31 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]smo, 2006-08-05 01:43 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]judyhazeleyes, 2006-08-04 03:14 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]smo, 2006-08-05 01:43 am UTC

[info]furiosity
2006-08-03 05:36 pm UTC (link)
I am still trying to figure out why exactly I'm supposed to be so damn scary. Is it because I can say 'twat' without giggling?

Wow, I got all whiny towards the end there. "Onoz, you people are forcing me to spend time away from my other pointless internets hobby!!1"

*votes [info]oulangi*

>.>

(Reply to this)(Thread)

(no subject) - [info]llama_treats, 2006-08-03 05:40 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]furiosity, 2006-08-03 05:43 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]cat_mcdougall, 2006-08-03 05:58 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]pyratejenni, 2006-08-03 06:05 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]arabwel, 2006-08-03 06:12 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]arielchan, 2006-08-03 06:10 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]misswindy, 2006-08-03 06:31 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]pyratejenni, 2006-08-03 06:37 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]misswindy, 2006-08-03 06:44 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]pyratejenni, 2006-08-03 06:52 pm UTC
... - [info]misswindy, 2006-08-03 06:57 pm UTC
... - [info]pyratejenni, 2006-08-03 07:00 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]lottelita, 2006-08-03 07:24 pm UTC
... - [info]misswindy, 2006-08-03 07:30 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]furiosity, 2006-08-03 06:41 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]carlanime, 2006-08-03 06:49 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]llama_treats, 2006-08-03 06:53 pm UTC
... - [info]freezer, 2006-08-03 08:04 pm UTC
(no subject) - (Anonymous), 2006-08-03 07:07 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]platypus, 2006-08-05 06:02 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]misswindy, 2006-08-03 06:51 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]furiosity, 2006-08-03 07:01 pm UTC
... - [info]misswindy, 2006-08-03 07:17 pm UTC
... - [info]furiosity, 2006-08-03 07:36 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]missdaisy, 2006-08-03 08:24 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]fandom_plank, 2006-08-03 06:46 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]pyratejenni, 2006-08-03 06:49 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]misswindy, 2006-08-03 07:01 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]pyratejenni, 2006-08-03 07:06 pm UTC
... - [info]misswindy, 2006-08-03 07:20 pm UTC
... - [info]loony666, 2006-08-04 01:01 am UTC
... - [info]misswindy, 2006-08-03 07:23 pm UTC
... - [info]pyratejenni, 2006-08-03 07:40 pm UTC
... - (Anonymous), 2006-08-03 07:45 pm UTC
... - [info]misswindy, 2006-08-03 09:12 pm UTC
Public v friends only - (Anonymous), 2006-08-04 04:49 am UTC
Re: Public v friends only - [info]big_bad_wolf, 2006-08-04 05:40 pm UTC
Re: Public v friends only - (Anonymous), 2006-08-06 07:46 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]polemic, 2006-08-03 08:12 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]furiosity, 2006-08-03 08:14 pm UTC

(Screened Post)
(no subject) - [info]furiosity, 2006-08-04 01:50 am UTC
... - [info]drakyndra, 2006-08-04 10:07 am UTC
... - [info]furiosity, 2006-08-04 10:09 am UTC
... - [info]drakyndra, 2006-08-04 10:10 am UTC

[info]ashenmote
2006-08-03 05:37 pm UTC (link)
Mind you, I haven't read it completely...*is cautious* ...but from what I seen [info]moonlight_tryst is a wonderful exception in so far as she seems to be a delicate flower without entitlement issues. And those are really rare and unique snowflakes in fandom.

The other commenters who are arguing with [info]furiosity need killing with fire though.

(Reply to this)(Thread)

(no subject) - [info]furiosity, 2006-08-03 05:42 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]pyratejenni, 2006-08-03 05:48 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]ashenmote, 2006-08-03 05:55 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]pyratejenni, 2006-08-03 06:02 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]ashenmote, 2006-08-04 01:17 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]fandom_plank, 2006-08-03 06:08 pm UTC
(no subject) - (Anonymous), 2006-08-03 06:15 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]pyratejenni, 2006-08-03 06:25 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]mookie, 2006-08-03 06:31 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]castellated, 2006-08-05 09:24 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]limyaael, 2006-08-03 06:29 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]misswindy, 2006-08-03 06:34 pm UTC
(no subject) - (Anonymous), 2006-08-03 06:56 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]mookie, 2006-08-03 07:06 pm UTC
... - (Anonymous), 2006-08-03 07:21 pm UTC
... - [info]mookie, 2006-08-03 07:38 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]oulangi, 2006-08-03 08:30 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]misswindy, 2006-08-03 08:51 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]furiosity, 2006-08-03 06:50 pm UTC

[info]limyaael
2006-08-03 05:40 pm UTC (link)
Those of us just brave enough to finally take our feet off the bottom of the pond and swim.

You know what? I'm afraid of water. This would be why I don't often go in pools, or to the ocean, or to lakes, or... you get the picture. But I fail to see how someone criticizing my swimming technique when I do go is equivalent to someone hating on me.

If [info]moonlight_tryst really is that nervous about her writing, there are things she can do. Like post under friends-lock, or avoid negative reviews entirely, or screen anonymous comments in case they might be a flame. I also fail to see why it's other people's responsibilty to temper any and all comment on her fic in case she takes it personally.

(Reply to this)(Thread)

(no subject) - [info]castellated, 2006-08-03 07:55 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]limyaael, 2006-08-03 08:12 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]castellated, 2006-08-03 08:41 pm UTC

[info]life_on_mars
2006-08-03 05:44 pm UTC (link)
Learning to evaluate criticism and make a decision about whether or not it's valid is one of the most important of all life skills. Whether or not 'furiosity' is the most vicious bitch on the planet (I honestly wouldn't know one way or the other but I reckon I've met the MVBOTP and it wasn't her), what she or anyone else has to say shouldn't be shaking 'moonlight_tryst's' confidence to the roots and it shouldn't be prompting this kind of emotional over-exposure. A writer should be capable of taking whatever shit is thrown at her; it's part of the process. You can either learn from it or ignore it completely, but if you put a story out in public where it can be seen by other people you have no right to ask not to be criticised. You just have to get used to it.

(Reply to this)(Thread)

(no subject) - [info]rosehiptea, 2006-08-03 06:04 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]toxictattoo, 2006-08-03 06:50 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]missdaisy, 2006-08-03 10:19 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]misswindy, 2006-08-03 06:36 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]pyratejenni, 2006-08-03 06:42 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]misswindy, 2006-08-03 06:55 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]pyratejenni, 2006-08-03 06:58 pm UTC
... - [info]misswindy, 2006-08-03 07:03 pm UTC
... - [info]castellated, 2006-08-03 08:01 pm UTC
... - [info]misswindy, 2006-08-03 08:59 pm UTC
... - [info]rosehiptea, 2006-08-03 09:23 pm UTC
... - [info]castellated, 2006-08-03 09:26 pm UTC
... - [info]misswindy, 2006-08-03 09:30 pm UTC
... - [info]darkrose, 2006-08-03 11:02 pm UTC
... - [info]misswindy, 2006-08-04 05:23 pm UTC
... - [info]castellated, 2006-08-04 07:09 am UTC
... - [info]misswindy, 2006-08-04 05:29 pm UTC
... - [info]castellated, 2006-08-05 01:18 am UTC
... - [info]castellated, 2006-08-05 01:19 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]kosaginolegion, 2006-08-03 07:46 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]pyratejenni, 2006-08-03 07:54 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]castellated, 2006-08-03 07:58 pm UTC
... - [info]pyratejenni, 2006-08-03 08:00 pm UTC
... - [info]castellated, 2006-08-03 08:04 pm UTC
... - [info]darkrose, 2006-08-03 08:22 pm UTC
... - [info]kosaginolegion, 2006-08-03 08:10 pm UTC
... - [info]castellated, 2006-08-03 08:43 pm UTC
... - [info]rosehiptea, 2006-08-04 04:47 am UTC
... - [info]kosaginolegion, 2006-08-04 05:39 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]mouseybrown, 2006-08-03 07:59 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]misswindy, 2006-08-03 09:07 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]mouseybrown, 2006-08-04 01:16 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]naienko, 2006-08-03 09:42 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]misswindy, 2006-08-03 10:00 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]naienko, 2006-08-03 10:06 pm UTC
... - [info]misswindy, 2006-08-03 10:30 pm UTC
... - [info]toxictattoo, 2006-08-03 11:01 pm UTC
... - (Anonymous), 2006-08-04 02:07 am UTC
... - [info]darkrose, 2006-08-03 11:03 pm UTC
... - (Anonymous), 2006-08-04 05:27 pm UTC
... - [info]misswindy, 2006-08-04 05:36 pm UTC
... - (Anonymous), 2006-08-04 06:50 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]big_bad_wolf, 2006-08-04 05:51 pm UTC
... - [info]misswindy, 2006-08-04 06:05 pm UTC
... - [info]big_bad_wolf, 2006-08-04 06:08 pm UTC
... - (Anonymous), 2006-08-06 02:23 pm UTC
... - [info]big_bad_wolf, 2006-08-07 12:19 am UTC
... - (Anonymous), 2006-08-07 02:12 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]life_on_mars, 2006-08-04 07:36 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]misswindy, 2006-08-04 07:56 am UTC
(no subject) - flightstothesea, 2006-08-03 10:26 pm UTC

[info]itsirtou
2006-08-03 05:55 pm UTC (link)
After reading all those comments, I have to admit that I now have a deep-seated internet crush on furiosity.

(Reply to this)(Thread)

Meh. Damn codes. - [info]pyratejenni, 2006-08-03 06:04 pm UTC
Re: Meh. Damn codes. - [info]itsirtou, 2006-08-03 06:04 pm UTC

(Anonymous)
2006-08-03 05:55 pm UTC (link)
[info]furiosity has a hell of a lot more patience than I ever would. Jesus!

(Reply to this)


(Anonymous)
2006-08-03 06:08 pm UTC (link)
Is it wrong that I really want to link [info]usermoonlight_tryst to GAFF? Not that she'll be able to get in.

(Reply to this)(Thread)

(no subject) - [info]esclaramonde, 2006-08-03 06:23 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]mookie, 2006-08-03 06:30 pm UTC
Totally not contributing to the commentary - [info]toxictattoo, 2006-08-03 06:53 pm UTC
Re: Totally not contributing to the commentary - [info]mookie, 2006-08-03 07:00 pm UTC
Re: Totally not contributing to the commentary - [info]toxictattoo, 2006-08-03 11:02 pm UTC
Re: Totally not contributing to the commentary - [info]hallidae, 2006-08-04 04:53 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]ymfaery, 2006-08-06 08:31 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]mookie, 2006-08-06 10:00 am UTC

(Anonymous)
2006-08-03 06:16 pm UTC (link)
Yanno, [info]furiosity's argument is that people shouldn't be afraid to tell her their opinions because nothing is going to happen to them. That doesn't hold up when we see people who did tell her what their opinion get wanked, and [info]furiosity happily participates in it.

Obviously I am interrogating this wank from the wrong perspective. *eyeroll*

(Reply to this)(Thread)

(no subject) - [info]esclaramonde, 2006-08-03 06:23 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]furiosity, 2006-08-03 06:33 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]missdaisy, 2006-08-03 08:39 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]furiosity, 2006-08-03 08:45 pm UTC
... - [info]missdaisy, 2006-08-03 10:26 pm UTC
... - [info]furiosity, 2006-08-03 10:28 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]figgy, 2006-08-03 06:36 pm UTC
(no subject) - (Anonymous), 2006-08-03 06:43 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]figgy, 2006-08-03 06:43 pm UTC
... - [info]furiosity, 2006-08-03 07:11 pm UTC
... - [info]figgy, 2006-08-03 07:13 pm UTC
... - (Anonymous), 2006-08-03 11:14 pm UTC
... - [info]furiosity, 2006-08-03 11:16 pm UTC
... - (Anonymous), 2006-08-03 11:29 pm UTC
... - [info]furiosity, 2006-08-03 11:31 pm UTC
... - (Anonymous), 2006-08-04 05:46 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]furiosity, 2006-08-03 06:44 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]figgy, 2006-08-03 06:48 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]pyratejenni, 2006-08-03 06:54 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]castellated, 2006-08-03 07:49 pm UTC
Mouse # 2, here - (Anonymous), 2006-08-04 08:42 pm UTC
Re: Mouse # 2, here - [info]castellated, 2006-08-05 01:09 am UTC
Re: Mouse # 2, here - [info]castellated, 2006-08-05 01:10 am UTC

[info]prettyveela
2006-08-03 06:21 pm UTC (link)
I know some people don't want concrit at all and that's their deal but for the rest of you writers I don't get it, what's the big deal? I see writers moan and groan all the time about not getting honest concrit and now people are stepping up to do so. I mean damn how do some of these people deal with real life situations if a review of their work on the internet is so hard for them to deal with?

My fandom is the biggest bunch of pansies, jeez.

(Reply to this)(Thread)

(no subject) - [info]toxictattoo, 2006-08-03 07:13 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]ecchaniz0r, 2006-08-03 11:14 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]castellated, 2006-08-03 07:48 pm UTC

[info]esclaramonde
2006-08-03 06:22 pm UTC (link)
The level of dumb in this whole "OMG dun review my fics :(" thing is utterly astounding. Every day I spend on F_W is another day that I realize I'm not as thin-skinned as I think I am.

(Reply to this)(Thread)

(no subject) - [info]figgy, 2006-08-03 06:31 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]seraphtrevs, 2006-08-04 05:05 am UTC

[info]crysiana
2006-08-03 06:22 pm UTC (link)
I feel for [info]moonlight_tryst. I avoid trying to see if there are reviews of my fic anywhere because it would give me a gut-twisty feeling if someone slammed it, albeit my being someone who tends to write something, shove it out into the world, and not bother with revisions. And bravo to her for saying something while admitting (as I do) that it's something that one shouldn't get broken up over.

That said, some of the other people on that thread are damned wanky and need to get over it.

(Reply to this)


[info]mookie
2006-08-03 06:26 pm UTC (link)
This whole things makes the new online seminar on how to write recs even funnier.

(Reply to this)


[info]queencallipygos
2006-08-03 06:32 pm UTC (link)
I'll admit I just skimmed it, but I got the sense that the OP's wibble was just venting, personally. Yes, she said she was tempted to take her story down off this site with more exposure, but -- I didn't get the sense that she was actually going to follow through. I got more a read that she was going to feel the fear but still go ahead and put her work out there anyway. And if that's the route you're going to take, sometimes you do end up having to take a time out and stepping into a side room and just freaking for a minute so the fear doesn't overwhelm you when you're trying to go ahead and do what it is you're doing.

So I got the sense her wibble was her way of stepping into a private room for a minute and saying "OMIGOD I AM ABSOLUTELY TERRIFIED AAAAAAAAAHHHH" and then when she hit post, that was the equivalent of taking a deep breath and coming back out and getting back into the game.

...It's what I do when I'm freaked out about something. Maybe I just spot a comrade.

(Reply to this)(Thread)

(no subject) - [info]mookie, 2006-08-03 06:36 pm UTC

[info]mouseybrown
2006-08-03 06:33 pm UTC (link)
So Furiosity writes respected reviews and moonlight_tryst likes the publicity from the recs but doesn't want any negative mojo to come her way because of a bad review? moonlight_tryst needs to suck it up and accept that bad reviews happen. You either learn from them or you give up.

It's kinda lame to be happy about getting a good reccommendation and the publicity from it, but wail that someone's affecting your self-confidence because they didn't like something else. You take the rough with the smooth and if you don't like it, make all your writing Flocked to the people who like you and can give you the GO YOUS! you need to get through the day.

(Reply to this)


[info]toxictattoo
2006-08-03 06:59 pm UTC (link)
Am I the only one who goes to amazon.com and looks at the 1 and 2 star reviews first?

Most of the time, if there's a negative review, it's what encourages me to give the item a go.

You know...this whole anti-rec thing kind of confuses me because sometimes, I will read something that someone said was badly executed and found that I still liked it (for whatever flaky reasons I might have, including just not agreeing with the reviewer).

Dude. If I listened to every negative review out there, I'd have no books, go see no movies, listen to no music...

(Reply to this)(Thread)

(no subject) - [info]limyaael, 2006-08-03 07:03 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]mookie, 2006-08-03 07:14 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]misswindy, 2006-08-03 07:21 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]toxictattoo, 2006-08-03 07:25 pm UTC
(no subject) - (Anonymous), 2006-08-03 07:31 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]seiberwing, 2006-08-04 06:22 am UTC
(no subject) - dracothelizard, 2006-08-03 09:01 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]khym_chanur, 2006-08-03 09:24 pm UTC
(no subject) - dracothelizard, 2006-08-03 09:30 pm UTC
... - (Anonymous), 2006-08-03 10:52 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]eilisliana, 2006-08-04 12:46 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]ruby_tuesday, 2006-08-04 01:32 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]toxictattoo, 2006-08-04 01:42 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]toxictattoo, 2006-08-04 01:41 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]eilisliana, 2006-08-04 01:45 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]sesana, 2006-08-04 06:50 am UTC

[info]willywanka
2006-08-03 07:09 pm UTC (link)
ATTN Furiosity, Emerson, and other well-known fen:

You are no longer allowed to have opinions, you might influence others.

(Reply to this)(Thread)

(no subject) - [info]platypus, 2006-08-03 08:15 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]willywanka, 2006-08-04 04:18 am UTC

[info]castellated
2006-08-03 07:15 pm UTC (link)
God, here we go again. We will not child-proof the world to protect your delicate ego. For fuck's sake. If you can't handle public response, keep your fic private. Why is this so difficult to understand? Why do these people keep asking that the entire fucking planet be padded and made over into their own personal cushy, ass-kissy little playground so their ickle feewwings won't get hurt? And pretending that anyone who doesn't kiss their ass is the bad guy? No - you are the bad guy for saying "Free speech is OK as long as it's free speech I want to hear." If you don't want meanies seeing your fic, keep it to yourself, your mommy, and your friends. It's done like this: Don't. Post.

Arrrrghghgh. Better now.

(Reply to this)(Thread)

(no subject) - (Anonymous), 2006-08-03 08:16 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]pyratejenni, 2006-08-03 08:19 pm UTC
(no subject) - (Anonymous), 2006-08-03 08:28 pm UTC
... - [info]pyratejenni, 2006-08-03 08:38 pm UTC
... - [info]furiosity, 2006-08-03 08:44 pm UTC
... - (Anonymous), 2006-08-03 09:52 pm UTC
... - [info]furiosity, 2006-08-03 10:17 pm UTC
... - (Anonymous), 2006-08-04 08:35 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]castellated, 2006-08-03 08:36 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]esclaramonde, 2006-08-03 09:37 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]platypus, 2006-08-04 12:02 am UTC
(no subject) - (Anonymous), 2006-08-04 08:32 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]life_on_mars, 2006-08-04 07:46 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]castellated, 2006-08-04 08:54 am UTC
(no subject) - (Anonymous), 2006-08-04 08:04 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]castellated, 2006-08-05 01:10 am UTC
Mouse #2 yet again - (Anonymous), 2006-08-04 08:48 pm UTC
Re: Mouse #2 yet again - [info]toxictattoo, 2006-08-04 10:26 pm UTC
Re: Mouse #2 yet again - [info]pyratejenni, 2006-08-04 10:35 pm UTC
Re: Mouse #2 yet again - [info]castellated, 2006-08-05 01:03 am UTC
Re: Mouse #2 yet again - (Anonymous), 2006-08-05 08:59 pm UTC
... - [info]castellated, 2006-08-05 10:41 pm UTC
... - [info]castellated, 2006-08-05 10:45 pm UTC
... - [info]pyratejenni, 2006-08-05 11:01 pm UTC
... - [info]toxictattoo, 2006-08-06 03:04 pm UTC
... - [info]pyratejenni, 2006-08-06 04:39 pm UTC

[info]quinctia
2006-08-03 07:19 pm UTC (link)
Review all you want, but it seems silly to point to a poll on your LJ as proof that people who are afraid to respond like your ideas...you can see who voted what in polls like that!

(Reply to this)(Thread)

(no subject) - [info]platypus, 2006-08-03 07:35 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]quinctia, 2006-08-03 07:38 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]platypus, 2006-08-03 07:41 pm UTC
... - [info]quinctia, 2006-08-03 07:45 pm UTC
... - [info]platypus, 2006-08-03 07:49 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]furiosity, 2006-08-03 07:47 pm UTC

[info]esclaramonde
2006-08-03 07:20 pm UTC (link)
Pointing and laughing should be reserved for the playground, and not brought into the adult world.

WTF now? Fandom is "the adult world"? Knock me over with an f. Could have sworn that fandom is usually characterized in the media as college-age boys or what-have-you.

(Reply to this)(Thread)

(no subject) - [info]azazello, 2006-08-03 07:23 pm UTC

[info]azazello
2006-08-03 07:23 pm UTC (link)
*Votes for [info]furiosity and [info]oulangi*

(Reply to this)(Thread)

(no subject) - [info]ehann, 2006-08-03 10:56 pm UTC
No no no -- THERE CAN BE ONLY ONE!! - [info]lottelita, 2006-08-03 10:59 pm UTC
Re: No no no -- THERE CAN BE ONLY ONE!! - [info]puipui, 2006-08-03 11:30 pm UTC
Re: No no no -- THERE CAN BE ONLY ONE!! - [info]rotten_fish, 2006-08-04 03:36 am UTC
... - [info]puipui, 2006-08-04 07:50 pm UTC
Re: No no no -- THERE CAN BE ONLY ONE!! - [info]furiosity, 2006-08-04 02:04 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]seiberwing, 2006-08-04 04:42 am UTC

[info]lottelita
2006-08-03 07:30 pm UTC (link)
A gem from the comments:

Fandom doesn't need "wank," it needs fic.

Fandom without wank? The horror!!

(Reply to this)(Thread)

(no subject) - [info]misswindy, 2006-08-03 07:35 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]annabelle_lee, 2006-08-03 08:15 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]luthe, 2006-08-04 05:22 am UTC
... - [info]annabelle_lee, 2006-08-04 05:33 am UTC
... - [info]jetamors, 2006-08-04 05:45 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]platypus, 2006-08-03 07:44 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]lottelita, 2006-08-03 07:45 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]platypus, 2006-08-03 07:51 pm UTC
... - [info]polemic, 2006-08-03 08:35 pm UTC
... - [info]staroverthebay, 2006-08-04 05:03 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]azazello, 2006-08-03 10:04 pm UTC
(no subject) - (Anonymous), 2006-08-04 12:33 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]aerobot, 2006-08-04 08:54 am UTC
Having read further...
[info]castellated
2006-08-03 07:39 pm UTC (link)
...and now someone's suggested an "opt-out" for writers who want the benefit of widespread posting without the tiny little inconvenience that someone might voice an honest and less than glowing opinion of their work?
Title: Story
Author: DelicateSnowflake
Summary: !!!I suk @ summeries!!11
I want every1 to read this ficcy plz and tell me how much u lik it but I'd lik to click on the opt-out option for anything that isn't asskissery, por favor.

Dang. I'm all irritated now.

(Reply to this)(Thread)

Re: Having read further... - [info]puipui, 2006-08-03 09:13 pm UTC
Re: Having read further... - [info]ravenclaw_devi, 2006-08-04 12:27 am UTC
Re: Having read further... - [info]lottelita, 2006-08-03 10:51 pm UTC

(Anonymous)
2006-08-03 07:51 pm UTC (link)
I don't even know what fandom this is in (I assume Harry Potter?), but it sort of seems like writing reviews is more loserly than writing fic. Can't we all just write porn and get along?

(Reply to this)(Thread)

(no subject) - [info]pyratejenni, 2006-08-03 07:56 pm UTC
(no subject) - (Anonymous), 2006-08-03 08:04 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]platypus, 2006-08-03 08:01 pm UTC
(no subject) - (Anonymous), 2006-08-03 08:07 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]platypus, 2006-08-03 08:08 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]puipui, 2006-08-03 09:15 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]rotten_fish, 2006-08-03 09:47 pm UTC
... - [info]cyndra_falin, 2006-08-06 10:43 am UTC
... - [info]rotten_fish, 2006-08-06 06:53 pm UTC
(no subject) - (Anonymous), 2006-08-03 08:09 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]platypus, 2006-08-03 08:13 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]puipui, 2006-08-03 09:16 pm UTC
Gah!
(Anonymous)
2006-08-03 08:18 pm UTC (link)
I discovered this (http://www.penny-arcade.com/comic/2004/03/24) very recently; I feel that it's vaguely appropriate. :)

It pisses me off that we have developed a culture where giving someone honest criticism, or disagreeing with someone, is scary and mean. We're not allowed to correct schoolchildren's awful spelling and grammar, because it damages their fragile self-esteem. We're not allowed to fail them no matter how badly they do. We have to mark their work in green pen, because red pen is too aggressive and negative. And now I know grown people who are non-confrontational to such a degree that they seriously believe that anyone who firmly disagrees with them about something is personally attacking them.

It pisses me off when people do this in fandom, because it makes it more difficult to find good, honest fanfiction recommendations. So many people recommend stories that they genuinely think are excellent, but also recommend their friends' stories, even if they are of much poorer quality, because they don't want to make their friends feel bad. There are very few honest, critical reviews -- just vague rave reviews, which may or may not be biased.

It's irritating, because a lot of these people whose writing isn't very good could improve if they stopped making certain common errors (bad spelling and grammar, fear of the word "said", embellishment of every line of dialogue with a description of what the speaker is doing) -- but how will they ever know what the problem is, if nobody has the guts to tell them?

-- confluence

(Reply to this)(Thread)

Re: Gah! - [info]southerngaelic, 2006-08-03 08:50 pm UTC
Re: Gah! - (Anonymous), 2006-08-03 09:50 pm UTC
Re: Gah! - [info]puipui, 2006-08-03 10:00 pm UTC
Re: Gah! - (Anonymous), 2006-08-04 12:09 am UTC
Re: Gah! - [info]khym_chanur, 2006-08-03 09:34 pm UTC
Re: Gah! - [info]sarajayechan, 2006-08-03 10:33 pm UTC
Re: Gah! - [info]karmakaze, 2006-08-03 11:48 pm UTC
Re: Gah! - [info]lottelita, 2006-08-03 10:56 pm UTC
Re: Gah! - (Anonymous), 2006-08-03 11:27 pm UTC
Re: Gah! - [info]tronella, 2006-08-04 01:56 am UTC
Re: Gah! - [info]mookie, 2006-08-04 10:43 am UTC
Re: Gah! - [info]walruswalrus, 2006-08-04 04:35 am UTC
Re: Gah! - [info]gun, 2006-08-04 06:20 am UTC
Re: Gah! - [info]bishounenhideto, 2006-08-04 09:16 am UTC



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