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What happened FF.Net wise: Detail clarification

purplepopple
2005-07-05 05:16 pm UTC (link)

She wasn't black listed for any quotes but the Pamela Dean ones. :/ Those were the ones that were reported.

And she was contacted no less than four times, once in reviews and three times via e-mail, before she was black listed. One of of those e-mails suggested she fix them or she'd be reported. Another told her that she was being investigated by FF.Net staff for plagiarism. Cassandra Claire never responded to any of these e-mails, nor the reviews. I don't know what that means in the context of what she said as Cassandra Claire said two different things: She never recieved any warning and she was on vacation and thus could not access her e-mail and could not have known.

Additionally, Cassandra Claire said she had permission at one point from Pamela Dean to use those passages. That is factually incorrect. She never had permission. In fact, by the time that Cassandra Claire finally got around to ASKING Pamela Dean, about a week after she'd been propogating that lie, the staff at FanFiction.Net, the person who lodged the original complaint and other paries had already been in contact with Pamela Dean who said nope, no permission, yes plagiarism.

Which, if you look at the posts from CC's list at that time, where the fan girls said if she had permission, FF.Net should let her stories go back and should have waited for CC to get back from vacation, make the whole thing laughable. They had over 5 pages of documentry evidence regarding CC's plagiarism from the PD books (It wasn't just a few lines. It was PASSAGES and PASSAGES) and she didn't have the permission she said she had. What could FF.Net's staff do or say in light of the rabid fangirlism and the spin to protect CC's interests and the fan girls own interests?

But those are some of the facts set straight.

Because I haven't really said anything for years about my involvement and I've been quiet. And the spinning rather annoys me. Heidi and Cassie might have their own version and fandom might have what amounts to their urban legend version... but for the most part, that other view of what actually went down has been quiet because the wank and the terror is kind of scarey.

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Cites! I've got cites and links!

heidi
2005-07-07 07:17 pm UTC (link)

Michela - did you post this multiple times just to make it difficult
for people to correct you?

I'm going to post this as a reply to the last post you made on July 5
and to the first post you made on July 5, but I ask the community mods
to please remove all the repeats of Michela's post, as well as mine.

Actually, it would be best if the mods removed *all* of your posts,
given they contain defamation, but I understand if they want to leave
them up for some reason or other.

Now, I get the feeling I'm going to go through this type of post in
whatever new niche of the internet you've decided to be defamatory in,
Michela - is there some cyclical purpose behind the timing?

Let's look at your continued claim that Cassie plagiarised, and let's
look at the dictinary first. M-W.com says that plagiarism is "an act
or instance of plagiarizing or something plagiarized." "Plagiarized"
means "to steal and pass off (the ideas or words of another) as one's
own : use (another's production) without crediting the source
intransitive senses : to commit literary theft : present as new and
original an idea or product derived from an existing source."

Let's all agree here that Cassie did not give a full and extensive
credit to Pamela Dean in her posting. Let's also agree that she did
posted this chapter, and all her other chapters, on a Yahoogroup to
which at least two of Pamela's friends were subscribed, and one's
reaction upon seeing Cassie's posting, and in response to "> And BTW,
The Secret Country is by Pamela Dean..." was "Hey, Pamela is a friend
of mine. ... Good taste, Cassie!"

While nobody has any clue what version of her story was on FFN,
because they deleted it, we can all look back at the chapter on
Paradigm of Uncertainty where it was posted in two parts (one
and two.
Look at the bottom of part two - "NB: Credit for the inspiration
for this conception of the wizarding afterlife goes to a book called The
Secret Country, alas, I no longer recall who wrote it."

One can say it's a skimpy credit. One can say it's a scanty one. One can
even say that it neglects the author's name and merely states the title
of the work. But it is there, dammit, and you cannot continue to
state that there was any plagiarism regarding Pamela Dean's work
because it was credited.

Above, you wrote, "She wasn't black listed for any quotes but the
Pamela Dean ones. :/ Those were the ones that were reported."

But in your post
to the Cassie & Rhysenn Yahoogroup on June 23, 2001 at 10:38 am, you
wrote, "Cassie was black listed last night from fanfiction.net for
plagairism in
answer to your question. I was told by a friend on staff. ... My
source said she also lifted dialogue from Buffy, Black Adder and Red
Dwarf." So which is it, Michela? Was she blacklisted for the Buffy,
Black Adder and Red Dwarf quotes, even though she stated in the fics
she posted to her Yahoogroups well before June of 2001 that her fics
included such quotes? Because you certainly tried to give that
impression back on June 23 of 2001, despite your claim above that
you've "been quiet."

Xing, as you may recall, sent an email to then-ffn-staffer Flourish,
who two weeks later became a founder of FictionAlley because she was
so disgusted by FFN's tactics - and here is what he said:

Cassandra Clair stole entire an entire scene, not just
quotables, from Pamela Dean's The Hidden Land book, very obvious and
she
just said she had been inspired by The Secret Country trilogy (which
The Hidden Land is part of) and that she couldn't remember the
author's name. The keyword was inspired. The parts she stole was not
annotated and adding the to the fact that she didn't even name the
author or the actual book in the series was more
appalling.