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tenma ([info]tenma) wrote in [info]i_wank,
@ 2005-05-30 15:11:00


Previous Entry  Add to memories!  Tell a Friend!  Next Entry
Current mood:Elitist

Preference != Elitism.
It's the wank that's been wanked a million times! It's just a small one though.

In Anime, surreal_sorrow asks: What was the first subtitled anime you saw(OVA,series,movie, etc)? On top of that, before you became familiar with anime, did you have any prejudgments about it?
He also talks about his anime fandom background a bit and mentions that he doesn't like dubs.

Bring on the "OMG you don't like dubs you are an elitist" comments. This time brought to you by blackjackrocket. Watch in amazement as surreal_sorrow nicely tries to explain that although he doesn't like dubs, he doesn't have a problem with those who do. This doesn't work for blackjackrocket, she has to pick out parts of his sentences to prove he is elitist!

I couldn't help myself and posted a reply (my lj name is super_lucky), I haven't gotten a reply yet but I can't wait to yet again hear that because I prefer subtitles it makes me an elitist.

If anyone could point out an anime community/forum that just doesn't allow the dub vs. sub debates I would be very grateful. I've been in this fandom for 10 years now and I'm tired of seeing the same thing rehashed over and over.

Edited to add: I got my reply from blackjackrocket - "It's not that she hates them, it's that she was forcing us to reply within the confines of her hatred of dubs."

Wow, it seems surreal_sorrow has the power to force people to reply! I wish I had that ability!

Edited again to add: The original question before it was edited was: What was the first subtitled anime you saw(OVA,series,movie, but has to be subtitled)? On top of that, before you became familiar with anime, did you have any prejudgments about it?

The part surreal_sorrow edited is in bold.



(Post a new comment)


[info]sarajayechan
2005-05-30 08:36 pm UTC (link)
I remember the days when I was so enthralled by the anime community...ah, memories.

And I usually have a lot of respect for Blackjack Rocket, but she could've been nicer about the whole thing. Not all people who prefer subs are elitists.

(Reply to this)(Thread)


[info]megmurry
2005-05-30 10:29 pm UTC (link)
Agreement on that one. Usually BJR is a voice of... well, not quite reason, but something resembling logic. Here, not so much.

(Reply to this)(Parent)


[info]iczer6
2005-05-30 10:29 pm UTC (link)
And I usually have a lot of respect for Blackjack Rocket, but she could've been nicer about the whole thing. Not all people who prefer subs are elitists.

Yeah what got me was her whole 'OMG you are oppressing me with your question'.

Bitch please. You don't have to answer if you don't want to, he's not forcing you to do anything.

If I were to post a 'what condiments do you like on your hamburgers' poll to my LJ would that mean I'm somehow oppressing people who like hot dogs and vegetarians?

(Reply to this)(Parent)(Thread)

(no subject) - (Anonymous), 2005-05-31 01:00 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]sailorjpg, 2005-05-31 07:07 am UTC

[info]tenma
2005-05-30 10:29 pm UTC (link)
This isn't the first time I've seen her on the anime community calling people "elitist", in fact so many people use this term for people who prefer subtitles I wish there was a LJ filter so I could block it out!

I'm editing to add her reply. I'm trying to point out that there's no reason to fight about this but she seems to be looking for a fight or just oversensitive about this subject.

(Reply to this)(Parent)(Thread)

(Deleted post)
Re: Not scanning - [info]daromaius, 2005-06-05 12:50 am UTC

[info]ladybirdsleeps
2005-05-30 09:24 pm UTC (link)
<-- YOU ARE HERE.
LOGIC IS OVER THERE. -->

I prefer subtitles because I'm a language geek, and because the subtitle habit was ingrained in me back when dubs usually were pretty bad. But geez, that doesn't make me an elitist hoor.

(Reply to this)(Thread)


[info]tenma
2005-05-30 10:35 pm UTC (link)
When I first started watching, the only choices of anime on tv was Sailor Moon and Samurai Pizza Cats. I traded subbed vhs tapes, and so I'm used to subs. Somehow because of this, I'm part of the elitist group of sub lovers working hard to oppress the dub lovers!

(Reply to this)(Parent)(Thread)

(no subject) - [info]sepiamagpie, 2005-05-30 11:23 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]ladybirdsleeps, 2005-05-30 11:55 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]kannaophelia, 2005-05-31 01:40 am UTC

[info]chash
2005-05-31 12:51 am UTC (link)
Ditto on both counts. There are some terrible dubs. That said, there's some terrible anime. I still prefer subs because they improve my listening comprehension. Plus I'm geeky and enjoy getting "they just used the honorific passive XDXD" moments.

(Reply to this)(Parent)(Thread)

(no subject) - [info]mistressrenet, 2005-05-31 03:27 pm UTC

[info]miss_kitten
2005-05-30 09:40 pm UTC (link)
Now, wait a minute...Isn't it just a BIT elitist to assume that everybody on an anime comm is actually IN FAVOR of anime?

I was going to join on the basis that I like pretending I have a large friendslist, but if they're going to be all mean and shit, then I totally don't need their approval.

I hate dubs AND subtitles! And Japanese stuff! And--and--CARTOONS!

Take THAT, anime elitists. We could have been friends, but obviously the fact that I don't know shit about anime is just too much for you people to handle. Whatever. I'll just join a hangliding comm instead.

(Reply to this)


[info]dawnswalker
2005-05-30 10:16 pm UTC (link)
I think some of the confusion would be avoided if anime fen didn't use the word "dub" simply as a synonym for "edited for TV broadcast" so often.

(Reply to this)(Thread)


[info]sarajayechan
2005-05-31 01:01 am UTC (link)
Yeah, that's what I think.

(Reply to this)(Parent)


[info]blackjackrocket
2005-05-30 11:19 pm UTC (link)
Well, she *did* tell us to specify SUB ONLY...I don't see how that could imply anything else.

(Reply to this)(Thread)


[info]kannaophelia
2005-05-31 01:53 am UTC (link)
My dear, I ♥ you, but I think you misunderstood. Just because someone is curious about what people first saw subtitled doesn't mean they're elitist. There is a difference between seeing some Japanese cartoons in your Saturday morning mix as a kid and your first subtitled anime, if only because watching subtitled means for the first time you're actually seeking out or deliberately being exposed to anime as such.

And you know me. Lazy. Unless a dub is really bad, I prefer to watch in a format in which I can play with my gameboy at the same time.

(Reply to this)(Parent)(Thread)

(no subject) - [info]blackjackrocket, 2005-05-31 04:06 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]iczer6, 2005-05-31 05:56 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]isntitironic, 2005-05-31 05:58 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]blackjackrocket, 2005-05-31 06:08 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]iczer6, 2005-05-31 06:21 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]feenix, 2005-05-31 06:22 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]blackjackrocket, 2005-05-31 06:23 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]nevadafighter, 2005-05-31 07:54 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]blackjackrocket, 2005-05-31 08:12 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]nevadafighter, 2005-05-31 08:19 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]sarajayechan, 2005-05-31 02:19 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]blackjackrocket, 2005-05-31 08:30 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]nevadafighter, 2005-05-31 10:01 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]blackjackrocket, 2005-05-31 10:11 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]nevadafighter, 2005-06-01 02:25 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]nevadafighter, 2005-06-01 02:28 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]nevadafighter, 2005-05-31 10:03 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]loki, 2005-05-31 04:28 pm UTC

[info]eilan
2005-05-31 12:56 pm UTC (link)
So this guy asks what was the first subtitled anime everyone saw and then *gasps* says that that anime has to be a subtitles one?

That's what the whole fucking question was about! It wasn't about what anime everyone first saw, it was what was the first subtitled anime people on the community watched.

(Reply to this)(Parent)(Thread)

(no subject) - [info]blackjackrocket, 2005-05-31 08:29 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]memii, 2005-06-01 12:45 am UTC

[info]pokecheck
2005-05-31 02:23 am UTC (link)
Hee. The Naruto sub-dub grumblers are grumbling because CN just aired a short preview for their...whatever it is that they're previewing. At least they aren't pronouncing it in True NayRooToe Style (although that would be pretty damn funny. WHO WANTS SOME BEEF JERKY??)

Hee. God. My first anime (although I didn't know it was anime) was Star Blazers, which is now so ungodly expensive. It was dubbed and edited and all I really remember was a red and white ship that looked like to hot dogs smashed together in an artistic fashion.

Jump ahead 20+ years and the first subbed anime I ever saw? The bootleg Japanese-Chnese-WTF!English Naruto DVDs. When Zabuza busted out his "We ninjas is tools" I laughed like a cokehead.

(Reply to this)(Thread)


[info]rogue
2005-05-31 03:01 am UTC (link)
STARBLAZERS. Jebus, I know, I wanted to get the DVD collection, but damn, I'd have to get a second job.

*sits and waits for SOMEONE to release 999 on DVD*

(Reply to this)(Parent)(Thread)

(no subject) - [info]iczer6, 2005-05-31 05:58 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]rogue, 2005-05-31 06:08 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]firebad, 2005-05-31 07:29 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]rogue, 2005-05-31 09:29 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]firebad, 2005-06-01 04:29 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]pyratejenni, 2005-06-01 02:53 am UTC
Captain of the good ship off-topic
(Anonymous)
2005-06-02 08:59 am UTC (link)
Oh god! Nothing beats the Japanese/Chinese/Engrish Bebop DVDs. Especially when French gets thrown in there and "Pierrot Le Fou" becomes "Ghost Dream of Mad Pierrot". Not to mention Policeman Babu...

(Reply to this)(Parent)

(no subject) - [info]rikoshi, 2005-06-22 12:30 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]pokecheck, 2005-06-22 10:53 pm UTC

[info]rogue
2005-05-31 03:00 am UTC (link)
Wow, overreact much? I prefer subs because I'm used to them. I started watching anime before dubs were readily available, and now that I don't really buy new anime, about 90% of my collection is subtitled only. I'm an elitist because I haven't gone out, bought the new dvds, watched the dubs, and decided to like them? Riiiight.

(Reply to this)


[info]ladysorka
2005-05-31 03:44 am UTC (link)
...I like subs because I like getting the original audio, so I watch it in whatever language it was first released. Japanese, German, French, Swahili, English, whatever. If was originally filmed in that language, I want to see in it that language, damnit.

Even if I don't understand it and am still getting a bad translation, I least I get the original acting.

If that makes me elitest, so be it.

(Reply to this)


[info]nevadafighter
2005-05-31 03:52 am UTC (link)
Dear Blackjackrocket,

Personal preference =/= telling others what they can and cannot like. I've read the wank; you misread and misunderstood her and got unnecessarily worked up about it.

Yeesh.

P.S. "And now I just can't stand dubbed anime" means she doesn't like dubbed anime. Not that she doesn't like and now NO ONE SHOULD! *cackle of doom*

Get a grip.

(Reply to this)(Thread)

(no subject) - [info]blackjackrocket, 2005-05-31 04:11 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]rogue, 2005-05-31 04:30 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]blackjackrocket, 2005-05-31 04:32 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]rogue, 2005-05-31 05:05 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]blackjackrocket, 2005-05-31 05:07 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]rogue, 2005-05-31 05:40 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]blackjackrocket, 2005-05-31 05:54 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]rogue, 2005-05-31 06:10 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]blackjackrocket, 2005-05-31 06:12 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]senor_pinata, 2005-05-31 06:11 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]tenma, 2005-05-31 06:02 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]isntitironic, 2005-05-31 06:05 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]senor_pinata, 2005-05-31 05:06 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]blackjackrocket, 2005-05-31 05:07 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]senor_pinata, 2005-05-31 05:46 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]nevadafighter, 2005-05-31 05:29 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]monkeywrench, 2005-06-01 01:30 pm UTC

[info]tiki
2005-05-31 04:48 am UTC (link)
I prefer subtitles and couldn't care less if someone wants to call me "elitist". To paraphrase, I do not think that word means what you think it means.
Not getting what the fuss is about.

(Reply to this)


[info]c_chan
2005-05-31 05:00 am UTC (link)
I like subs because - as dumb as it sounds - it helps me with learning Japanese. Actually being able to hear how things are said is a lot easier then reading the pronunciations out of a book.

I like dubs too because they're always hiliarious, no matter how angsty the anime is. I get a kick out of the random accents they give characters.

I remember someone joking that Enishi from Rurouni Kenshin would get a british accent in the dub when the OVAs came out, and what did he get? A british accent. Classic. ♥.

(Reply to this)


[info]isntitironic
2005-05-31 05:42 am UTC (link)
You know what's fun? Raw anime. Watch raw episodes of a show you're not familiar with, and try to guess what's going on. Not only can you claim to be the purist of purists, but it makes a great party game. Especially when drunk. Or on IM, where you can give your chat buddies running commentary like:

"Okay, the ghost girl is about to be eaten by what appears to be the unnatural offspring of No-Face and that crab thing from Attack of the Clones."

"The androgynous kid is back. I think it's a girl... she's wearing a skirt. Then again, this is anime, so that doesn't guarentee anything."

"Where can you see lions? Only in Kenya!"

"Now the Kyou-clone is spazzing out 'cause the androgynous kid is camping out in his closet in incredibly ugly pajamas."

Then when you're done, you can find somebody to explain what was really happening and see how close you were.

(Reply to this)(Thread)

(no subject) - [info]loopywafflehead, 2005-05-31 09:30 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]impendingdoom, 2005-05-31 09:38 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]coffee_mug, 2005-05-31 12:28 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]selenis, 2005-05-31 05:43 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]coffee_mug, 2005-05-31 05:47 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]shinigami_co, 2005-05-31 04:53 pm UTC

[info]twocorpses
2005-05-31 06:08 am UTC (link)
In all honesty, I think BJR's first question was fine because what if it wasn't a subtitled show that got the person hooked on anime?

(Reply to this)(Thread)

(no subject) - [info]eilan, 2005-05-31 01:12 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]toxictattoo, 2005-05-31 02:23 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]mistressrenet, 2005-05-31 03:36 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]toxictattoo, 2005-06-01 01:54 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]ymfaery, 2005-05-31 10:44 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]toxictattoo, 2005-06-01 01:55 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]twocorpses, 2005-05-31 04:28 pm UTC

[info]shinigami_co
2005-05-31 05:05 pm UTC (link)
I can sort of sympathize with BJR. Just like subbies are sick of hearing about how they're "elitist omg," dubbies are sick of hearing how dubs are a perversion of anime and suck and anyone who likes them has an IQ of a doorstop.

Do I think BJR reacted badly and took things way outta proportion? Sha, fo sho. Do I think the question pre-edit was worded badly as well? You betcha. Regardless of that tasty little phrase, though, I see mostly everyone replied with "_____ dubbed was the first anime I saw, and it totally got me into it, and then I saw ______ subbed and started giving subtitles a shot."

Am I allowed to point and laugh at the person who hated anime until they saw Inuyasha subbed and now they omg luff anime, though? Cause...I really feel the need...

{Personal note: gold award goes to [info]mineka_c for understanding why dubs sometimes make no sense, but boo hiss award goes to [info]surreal_sorrow for chattering another stereotypical dub bash. Yes, I know, it's true in a frightfully large amount, but there's bad actors on both sides of the ocean.)

(Reply to this)(Thread)

(no subject) - [info]tenma, 2005-05-31 05:58 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]toxictattoo, 2005-05-31 07:35 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]tiki, 2005-05-31 07:59 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]toxictattoo, 2005-05-31 08:13 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]ymfaery, 2005-06-01 02:23 am UTC

[info]ymfaery
2005-06-01 02:35 am UTC (link)
Am I the only one amused at the fact that, even after the poster corrected BJR regarding his gender, BJR *still* refers to the guy as a "she" in some of the comments over here? I didn't wade through all of the comments to see if that changed though. Lazy-R-Us.

As to my excuse for avoiding dubs: trauma induced by listening to southern accents on the Blue Seed dub, reinforced by the DiC(ked) up version of Sailor Moon. *shudder*

(Reply to this)


 
   
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