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Dan Fogelberg's ([info]llama_treats) wrote in [info]otf_wank,
@ 2004-11-08 12:42:00
Previous Entry  Add to memories!  Tell a Friend!  Next Entry
Current mood:Irredeemable

Gay. It's the new black. Except not so much.
An anonymous commenter pointed the following out to me. Enjoy.

Msscribe makes a post stating "It's time to get black, gays!"

There's a lot of "Yeah! You go, sister!"

But of course there are those that disagree...

And those who get wanky and tell Msscribe "Basically, you look like a white chick so what the fuck do you know?" (since Msscribe explains in her first post that she's passed for white before)...

And the obligatory "It's a choice to be gay!" post.

Five pages and counting.


(Read comments) - (Post a new comment)

*whips out internet!cock*
[info]mael
2004-11-08 10:34 pm UTC (link)
Personal opinion here, but I don't like Msscribe's attitude one. little. bit.

Bisexuality is about as defining to my identity as my unholy passion for my mom's lasagna is. People don't need to know that up front, do they?

Things would go much smoother if we stopped arguing about "choice" and "lifestyle" between ourselves and just realised that it does not fucking matter. We should be allowed to live our lives however we see fit on principle alone. "It harms no one and I *want* to" should be enough.

At this point in time, people will only see the badge and not the person. You need to change that before anything else, IMHO.

*tucks internet!self back in, wipes splooge, offers tissues*

(Reply to this)(Thread)

Re: *whips out internet!cock*
[info]darkrose
2004-11-09 12:04 am UTC (link)
We should be allowed to live our lives however we see fit on principle alone. "It harms no one and I *want* to" should be enough.

That would be lovely. Unfortunately, the people in the 11 states who voted to amend their state constitutions to ban gay marriage think that for two people of the same gender to marry *is* harmful.

I interpreted msscribes post as saying that if you want equal rights, you can't just whisper about it from the safety of the closet--you have to stand up and say, "You know what? When you're bitching about the fags and the dykes, you're talking about people like me."

(Reply to this)(Parent)(Thread)

Re: *whips out internet!cock*
[info]mael
2004-11-09 12:33 am UTC (link)
Of course, the whole scenario is pretty much Utopia. That doesn't mean I should automatically strive for less. Emphasising our differences does not equality bring.

I interpreted msscribes post as saying that if you want equal rights, you can't just whisper about it from the safety of the closet--you have to stand up and say, "You know what? When you're bitching about the fags and the dykes, you're talking about people like me."

That? I actively encourage.

A shiny sticker on my shirt? Not so much.

I don't want to be my sexuality.

(Reply to this)(Parent)(Thread)

Re: *whips out internet!cock*
[info]darkrose
2004-11-09 12:49 am UTC (link)
Of course, the whole scenario is pretty much Utopia. That doesn't mean I should automatically strive for less. Emphasising our differences does not equality bring.

I disagree. Change doesn't come from being silent. Change comes from being noisy and in-your-face, and refusing to be invisible, from saying, "No, I'm tired, and I'm not going to go quietly and sit in the back of the bus." It's not about emphasizing your differences, but it is about being visible, and taking a vocal stand.

(Reply to this)(Parent)(Thread)

Re: *whips out internet!cock*
[info]mael
2004-11-09 01:08 am UTC (link)
You know what? I agree with you. And I've been *saying* that. I don't want to be a second class citizen. I don't want to read about senators who feel they can call gays "fags" because it has a literary origin. I'm out to my family and to my friends. If it is appropriate, I am willing and eager to discuss gay rights and the pig-headedness of today's society with any John Smith sitting beside me on the bus.

What I *don't* want, and you seem to be ignoring this, is a sticker. A label. A silly, stupid, neon sign that I should apparently carry with me at all times, to advertise the fact that I am Bisexual.

I think it's counterproductive. I agree with the first anon in msscribe's post. Strangers would see the little "hello, I'm gay! how may I help you?" sign and allow it to colour their perceptions of me accordingly. It puts a wall right between this hypothetic stranger and myself before he or she even knows my name.

It shouldn't, but it would.

Being bisexual is not something that defines me, I said it before and I'll say it again. Putting a BISEXUAL tag on my lapel would make it the most relevant aspect of my being, at least for the random guy who's serving me coffee. And I don't want that.

(Reply to this)(Parent)(Thread)

Re: *whips out internet!cock*
[info]darkrose
2004-11-09 01:44 am UTC (link)
What I *don't* want, and you seem to be ignoring this, is a sticker. A label. A silly, stupid, neon sign that I should apparently carry with me at all times, to advertise the fact that I am Bisexual.

I'm not ignoring that, but I think we're focusing on different aspects of the post. I think you're focusing on the idea of a sticker or a button. I was focusing on the idea of visibility in general. I don't think the way that you chose to be visible matters as much as that you do it at all.

(Reply to this)(Parent)(Thread)

Re: *whips out internet!cock*
[info]mael
2004-11-09 02:28 am UTC (link)
I think it does matter.

I'm focusing on the idea *behind* a sticker or a button. And that is that you should carry a constant reminder of your sexuality on your sleeve if you want to improve the current situation.

And I figure that it's not such a good idea. The random crowd of people walking to their jobs on monday morning does *not* need to identify you as gay at twenty paces. What's the use?

It's the idea of such an external and passive symbol that bothers me. People make such a big fuss out of the "gay identity" of homosexuals that I'd rather not give them the excuse to make it worse.

You want to talk to people? Great! Bring all your friends and start illuminating the ignorant masses. Walk around town with a button on your shirt? You'll look like a chicken man advertising KFC.

YMMV, of course. But that's my gut reaction.

(Reply to this)(Parent)(Thread)

Re: *whips out internet!cock*
[info]puipui
2004-11-09 11:16 pm UTC (link)
The random crowd of people walking to their jobs on monday morning does *not* need to identify you as gay at twenty paces. What's the use?

Plus, if some random guy in the crowd is already someone who doesn't like OMG QUEERS then having a button on your shirt isn't going to make him think he should re-evaluate his position on that. It's just going to make him not like you without even knowing you. So if you really want to change people's perceptions, then you need to be sneaky and get to know them and then drop it casually in the conversation, because that would shake them up way more than a button ever would.

(Reply to this)(Parent)(Thread)

Re: *whips out internet!cock*
[info]mael
2004-11-10 03:23 pm UTC (link)
Exactly.

A button ain't going to change their mind. All it might accomplish is to make them feel threatened and we *really* don't want that.

So if you really want to change people's perceptions, then you need to be sneaky and get to know them and then drop it casually in the conversation, because that would shake them up way more than a button ever would.

Bingo! *smile* Make them question their values by presenting positive examples.

Quality, people, not quantity!

(Reply to this)(Parent)

Re: *whips out internet!cock*
[info]gaisce
2004-11-09 03:14 am UTC (link)
Thank you. That's what pisses me off about the whole debate. There are people who see their sexuality as the primary definition of their identity, others who see it on par with race or, like me, have it dangling below the information that I'm double-jointed.

It sucks to be discriminated against, no matter how trivial you apply it to yourself, but the best way to get people to listen is to prove you're a person instead of a "insert visible difference of the week here."

As a side note, I'm glad to know you're bisexual because I will now attempt seducing you for putting it so nicely.

(Reply to this)(Parent)(Thread)

Re: *whips out internet!cock*
[info]mael
2004-11-09 12:42 pm UTC (link)
Word PIE. Exactly.

Also, I'm really glad to know you're going to seduce me. *looks coy and paws at you*

(Reply to this)(Parent)(Thread)


[info]gaisce
2004-11-09 08:21 pm UTC (link)
How could I not when you flash your playful Dick icon. *purrs*

(Reply to this)(Parent)(Thread)


[info]mael
2004-11-10 11:04 am UTC (link)
Gay Dick. Works every time. *pounces*

(Reply to this)(Parent)

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