(Read comments) - (Post a new comment)

	Re: Using small words... darkrose 2004-11-09 12:53 am UTC (link)
	No. However, if you were to say that you're, say, Irish, no one would question the capitalization. The point is that "Black" is not simply a color reference. It's a cultural identity. I'd say that I was "African-American," but that's too long and awkward. (Reply to this)(Parent)(Thread)

	Re: Using small words... (Anonymous) 2004-11-09 01:04 am UTC (link)
	How can it be a cultural identity when more people than African American are dark skinned? You do not have the same culture as someone from the Caribbean or Africa. You are really being overly offened today. (Reply to this)(Parent)(Thread)

	Re: Using small words... darkrose 2004-11-09 01:09 am UTC (link)
	You are really being overly offened today. Try backing that up with a name and maybe I'll give a flying fuck what you think. (Reply to this)(Parent)(Thread)

	Re: Using small words... (Anonymous) 2004-11-09 01:13 am UTC (link)
	I was only pointing out how badly you are jumping down folks around here throats. (Reply to this)(Parent)(Thread)

	See previous post darkrose 2004-11-09 01:23 am UTC (link)
	I was only pointing out how badly you are jumping down folks around here throats. So if someone says they're "irritated" by the words I use to define myself, then I'm at fault for being easily offended. Again, your opinion might actually matter to me if you have the gonads to actually sign your name. (Reply to this)(Parent)(Thread)

	Re: See previous post dreamtoday 2004-11-09 01:47 am UTC (link)
	do you want some fries to go along with that splooge that you're spitting? i thought it was irritating too, but then again i think all capital letters are teh ev0l. and should be banned! except for when you're sreaming LIKE THIS to make a point. (Reply to this)(Parent)(Thread)

	Re: See previous post darkrose 2004-11-09 01:55 am UTC (link)
	Yes, in fact, I'm being wanky. So was the person I was responding to. What, exactly is your point? (Reply to this)(Parent)(Thread)

	Re: See previous post dreamtoday 2004-11-09 02:01 am UTC (link)
	we need a point in fandom_wank? sorry, i must've wandered into the wrong community once again. (Reply to this)(Parent)(Thread)

	Re: See previous post telesilla 2004-11-09 04:20 am UTC (link)
	Um you did. This is otf_wank. (Reply to this)(Parent)(Thread)

	Re: See previous post dreamtoday 2004-11-09 04:35 am UTC (link)
	well, so i am. whoops. i apologize for interrupting the serious discussion here. (Reply to this)(Parent)

	Re: See previous post dreamtoday 2004-11-09 04:50 am UTC (link)
	aaaannd, i meant "So I did." brain not working. too many layers of...schtuff. i'd say i'm not usually like this but it'd be a lie. (Reply to this)(Parent)

On culture, identity, and ignorance

xturtle
2004-11-09 01:55 am UTC (link)

Please quit being willfully ignorant in public. If you've been alive more than ten years you know that culture is not synonymous with national identity or attached to a particular continent. Africa has multitudinous cultures, as does the US. Hell, some of them even overlap. Depending on your definition of culture, those of us on the _wank communities have developed a culture. Black people in the US can certainly be said to share a cultural identity, as can gay or Gay people, lesbians or Lesbians, and bisexuals. They likely experience many of the same patterned interactions as those who claim a common cultural identity, and may even share parts of that identity across groups. And frankly, since you're not willing to claim any identity, I don't think you've got any business tossing your adolescent ignorance around like you're the next biggest thing since the world atlas.

darkrose isn't being overly offended. Last I heard, she gets to claim whatever identity she likes, and request that people respect that. You, however, are being extremely offensive. and This white, Bisexual, woman Dork with erraTic Capitalization practices thinks you need to get your whiskered nose out of others' identity practices.

Or, to put it succintly, bitch, PLEASE!

(Reply to this)(Parent)(Thread)

Re: On culture, identity, and ignorance

redjackcash
2004-11-09 04:58 am UTC (link)

hat I think the anaon was saying was that there are many cultures with dark skin, and not to pare one culture down as Black when there are many cultures within that..for example, those in the Carribean are dark-skinned, yet of a different culture, so defining the culture by color is flawed. Not saying I agree, just being the rranslator and Devil's Advocate.

...because the main problem with that argument is the fact that often, White is lumped together as one culture, too. It's not like this sort of thing is unheard of...though there are many cultures within White, we are still all considered White due to our shared identity. I am white. I am also Scottish, French, and English. Not mutually exclusive.

(Reply to this)(Parent)(Thread)

	Derail! Derail! glomobius 2004-11-09 06:02 pm UTC (link)
	White is lumped together as one culture, too Oh, but that's okay, because we ALL 'drive like this'! (Reply to this)(Parent)

	Re: On culture, identity, and ignorance puipui 2004-11-09 11:09 pm UTC (link)
	Black people in the US can certainly be said to share a cultural identity, as can gay or Gay people, lesbians or Lesbians, and bisexuals. What, so we don't merit a capital? Is that what you're saying? YOU BITCH!!!11! (Reply to this)(Parent)

kyuuketsukirui
2004-11-09 01:05 am UTC (link)

That's because it comes from the name of a country, just as African-American does.

It's easier to say I'm white than to say I'm of English/Swedish/German/Scottish/etc. descent. To my mind, black/African-American is the same thing. You capitalize the name of the country, but not the generic word. The same as if I said, I'm a UCLA student vs. I'm a university student.

Obviously you can do what you want and it's not hurting me if you capitalize it. I'm just saying why I wouldn't.

(Reply to this)(Parent)(Thread)

darkrose
2004-11-09 01:16 am UTC (link)

To my mind, black/African-American is the same thing. You capitalize the name of the country, but not the generic word. The same as if I said, I'm a UCLA student vs. I'm a university student.

On the other hand, someone from Central or South America is a Latino, not a latina.

Obviously you can do what you want and it's not hurting me if you capitalize it. I'm just saying why I wouldn't.

And that's fine. My response was specifically aimed at the person who was "irritated" by those of us who choose to define ourselves differently that sie would

(Reply to this)(Parent)(Thread)

tekanji
2004-11-09 02:28 am UTC (link)

Your post inspired me to look capitalization conventions up.

From this website:
Capitalize the proper names of nationalities, peoples, races, tribes and so on: African American, American Indians, Arab, Asian, Jewish, Latino, Muckleshoot, Tulalip, Puyallup. Lowercase black, white, red and so on.

Then there's Indiana University's Preferred Spelling/Capitalization Word List:
black (can be lowercase or uppercase when referring to race; okay to use, as is African American, though they're not always synonyms)

I think what it boils down to is personal preference. I personally don't capitalize black, white, yellow, what-have-you since they're generalizations that cover a wide range of nationalities. But that's just me ^^

As an OT sidenote: When I spellchecked "okay" was highlighted as a "misspelled" word. Strange, eh?

(Reply to this)(Parent)

	charabok 2004-11-09 02:21 am UTC (link)
	To my mind, black/African-American is the same thing. Eh. Black here, but neither African nor American in any way, thanks very much. (Reply to this)(Parent)(Thread)

	kyuuketsukirui 2004-11-09 02:32 am UTC (link)
	I was not saying that all blacks are African-Americans, just as not all whites as German/Swedish/English/Scottish/whatever else I am. (Reply to this)(Parent)

	(Anonymous) 2004-11-12 02:30 pm UTC (link)
	Africa is not a country. It is a continent made up of numerous countries. sigh (Reply to this)(Parent)

Re: Using small words...

glomobius
2004-11-09 05:58 pm UTC (link)

Ireland is a country, and thus capitalized. Black is not a country.

As for the 'Irish as an ethnicity'... very few people that say they're "Irish" really are; the VAST majority of the people in the States are plain ol' American, whether they like it or not (I can't say who "gets" to claim something more interesting, but my opinion is that if one is actually from another country, ie not born here, they're "Irish" or what have you).

That's all just opinion, though (besides the capitalization bit); telling people what to call themselves is wrong.

(Reply to this)(Parent)(Thread)

	Re: Using small words... (Anonymous) 2004-11-11 04:36 pm UTC (link)
	Whoo, does that one piss me off! I mean, I am English. I was born in England. It's quite a nice place, I'nm still living heer, I can identify as English. If you are born in, say, Ohio, but one of your grandparents was from England, guess what? You're not English! You're an Ohio-ian! I wish this was more eloquent, but this topic makes me ranty... (Reply to this)(Parent)

(Read comments) -