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Gilraen ([info]ladyvorkosigan) wrote in [info]otf_wank,
@ 2006-09-15 21:56:00
Previous Entry  Add to memories!  Tell a Friend!  Next Entry
The Return of Feminist
Things have been quiet at [info]feminist lately, so naturally it's time for another display of petty bickering tinged with an ideological superiority complex. This is actually relatively small, but, to my mind, displays a shocking enough amount of cluelessness to be worth posting.

[info]lifeisacabaret posts a link to an article about Colombian women who are going on a sex strike until their boyfriends agree to give up gang activity.

We can only hope that those women weren't acting under the illusions that their actions were feminist, because [info]stratyllis is happy to jump right in and explain to them that they aren't.

Watch as she hammers that point home against all detractors, explains that race and national origin have nothing to do with it, and engages (or is engaged, depending on your point of view) in a pointless argument about what race she may or may not be.

On the side, [info]angelvomit thinks that they just shouldn't date gang members. Okay! Problem solved!

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[info]nevadafighter
2006-09-16 02:16 am UTC (link)
I'm so glad stratyllis and her floofy hair are there to tell me what's feminist. My poor little woman self gets so confused sometimes.

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[info]delcj
2006-09-16 03:52 am UTC (link)
i'm sort of dismayed because that floofy hair is Hermione's — the drawing is by [info]trickofthedark.

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[info]belafarinrod
2006-09-16 11:34 am UTC (link)
Yeah, I hate when her wonderful icons are used by stupid people. The icons always look so nice, shouldn't the poster be nice too? :(

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(Anonymous)
2006-09-19 04:30 am UTC (link)
Yes, and floofy hair is fun.

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[info]squib
2006-09-16 10:08 am UTC (link)
She can do that because she "graduated from collage", according to her LJ. I guess next week she's graduating from mosaic?

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[info]chibicurmudgeon
2006-09-17 11:18 pm UTC (link)
LOL.

I think it should be a law that your college degree is immediately invalidated if you spell "college," or for that matter, "degree" wrong.

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[info]anne_noonlight
2006-09-16 02:26 am UTC (link)
Nope.

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(Anonymous)
2006-09-16 08:05 am UTC (link)
Agh! Flashbacks to Emabressing History class and our teacher trying to explain without getting into trouble what the lion on the cheese grater position looked like.

-Roz

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[info]notjo
2006-09-16 04:21 pm UTC (link)
I never did get a straight answer... what is it?

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[info]semirecluse
2006-09-16 03:27 am UTC (link)
Tia Dalma! Eee!!! You know, I really want an icon of her, but there are NO good close-ups on the whole entire Internet.

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[info]anne_noonlight
2006-09-16 04:07 am UTC (link)
How's this? I can't find any other caps either, sorry.

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[info]semirecluse
2006-09-16 05:25 am UTC (link)
OMG thank you so much!

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[info]rikiki
2006-09-16 02:43 am UTC (link)
Well, she kind of has a point about the whole "not necessarily white just 'cos you look like a cracker" thing. I mean, Plessy probably wouldn't've been arrested if he hadn't been all "Btw you h0r I'm totally black, y'know. Now arrest me so I can take your ass to the Supreme Court and get shot down only to have it overturned in half a century by some schoolkids. Because you suck."

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[info]gal_montag
2006-09-16 03:18 am UTC (link)
Well, see, though that's the thing. Looking white, whether you are or not, means you are treated as a white person. My cousin, for example, has people say some colossally racist things to her because they think she's white (which sort of begs the question as to why they'd assume she'd be cool with it just because she's white, but I'll chalk that up to where I live). Now, people can't necessarily tell my race by looking at me, but they can be sure I'm probably not white and so when they talk about people using racial modifiers a lot of people will quickly glance in my direction and pause to gague my reaction before continuing with whatever they were talking about.

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[info]rikiki
2006-09-16 03:28 am UTC (link)
Exactly, and hopefully situations like that can make people think more often than what I gloomily suspect is the case. Which is to say, maybe they'd realize "hey, our DNA is arranged pretty much in the same way, why are we being so stupid again?" I think that's me being too damn optimistic though, to hope they'd realize it on their own. I don't know if I'm making any sense or not, I don't think I usually do.

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(Anonymous)
2006-09-16 02:48 pm UTC (link)
Slightly off topic, but over the internet I've been mistaken for being black because when people write racists stuff, I call them on it. Some people seem to make this assumption that racist slurs are only offensive to the targeted group of people. WRONG!

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[info]gal_montag
2006-09-17 09:05 pm UTC (link)
Yeah, that's kind of the flip side of the coin. Only gays, women and blacks are supposed to care about their respective issues or something. Like, bitch plz.

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(Anonymous)
2006-09-19 04:34 am UTC (link)
Yeah, me too. I think it's fun, though, because I'm so white it's pathetic and I love calling them on that.

Kitsune_no_mae

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[info]april_hurst
2006-09-16 03:55 pm UTC (link)
*nods* I'm mistaken for Hispanic or part Hispanic a lot of the time, and it's caused some minor issues. Mostly people being upset and confused by me not speaking Spanish - I'm trying to learn the basics for work, though - and being very surprised (and again, upset and confused) by me being a career woman with no spouse/boyfriend and no children. If I was a pale blonde, these wouldn't come up as much. It's stupid stereotyping, and the fact that I'm technically 100% "white" adds an extra layer of stupid to it.

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(Anonymous)
2006-09-16 05:52 am UTC (link)
What are the odds that a bunch of women in Colombia are not of Hispanic origin?

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[info]rikiki
2006-09-16 07:18 am UTC (link)
Oh, slim to nil, I know that. I mostly just had that mental translation of what started that case in my head and jumped at the chance to use it. Anyway, I thought she was talking about herself there? Though as misswong said, "how do you know I'm white?" was a giveaway.

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[info]jat_sapphire
2006-09-16 02:47 am UTC (link)
God, stratyllis is a wanky idiot. If you have to say "I didn't use the word notice" or "Did you use the word privelege before? No? So we can't be talking about white privelege," floofy-hair-chick, you lose.

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[info]somnambulicious
2006-09-16 02:47 am UTC (link)
misswong: Mainly you can tell someone's white when they say, "how do you know I'm white"

WIN.

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[info]kittikattie
2006-09-16 03:38 am UTC (link)
Hells yeah.

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[info]ravenscanary
2006-09-16 02:48 am UTC (link)
Goodness she's backpedaling like a champ.

But she's always a source of entertainment on that comm, because she makes a ton of short, judgemental statements about every damn thing and gets hugely offended and passive agressive when people dare to disagree.

Like now.

Good times.

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(Anonymous)
2006-09-16 05:58 am UTC (link)
She's good for LULZ!!11 in Booju Mooju as well. In short, she could use a nice, hot bowl of SHUT THE FUCK UP.

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[info]squib
2006-09-16 10:15 am UTC (link)
My first reaction to seeing her name was that she was the wanker who plain would not shut up about LJ ZOMGoppressing breastfeeding icons-- I can't be 100% sure it was her, but mentioning that she wanks in Booju Mooju makes it a bit more likely that my memory was in fact correct. Hmm.

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[info]squib
2006-09-16 10:16 am UTC (link)
would not shut up *in Pagan comms, was what that was supposed to say.

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(Anonymous)
2006-09-16 02:59 am UTC (link)
So, not having sex is antifeminist now?

And yet, I'm not surprised. That's the way things have been going for a while now.

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(Anonymous)
2006-09-16 03:12 am UTC (link)
Oh, jesus. A worker goes on strike to get a concession from a boss. That is what a strike is. Labor versus management. A "sex strike" is, therefore, a profoundly misogynist frame to put around the neutral non-act of not having sex, which is in itself neither feminist nor antifeminist. Okay? That clear it up for you?

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[info]somnambulicious
2006-09-16 04:01 am UTC (link)
Okay!

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[info]wrongly_amused
2006-09-16 08:15 am UTC (link)
Except that the wankers in question are claiming it to be symbolic of anit-feminism. There's stupidity and misogyny on both sides of the debate. The female just can't win. If she goes after sex aggressively, she's a slut. If she withholds, she's a frigid tease.

Nobody seems to be pointing out that these women are taking control of their sexuality - *their bodies* - and sacrificing intimacy with a partner because they feel a crime-free existence is more important for these relationships. The problem with the response to the situation is that there's too much focus on the issue of sex. It's not about the sex. It's about sacrifice. These women are giving up their own right AND their boyfriend/husband/etc.'s right to sexuality in order to bring levity to a situation that they otherwise cannot impact by controlling their most personal capability. To me, this makes a more disturbing statement about the socio-economic situation in Columbia more than anything about feminism. How bad is a situation where so much of the youth is directed toward criminal lifestyles that women and men are forced to take a stance that sacrifices basic human rights?

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[info]april_hurst
2006-09-16 03:57 pm UTC (link)
No.

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[info]nevadafighter
2006-09-16 04:52 pm UTC (link)
I'd reply, but wrongly_amused has done it so wonderfully for me.

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[info]exdee
2006-09-16 03:12 am UTC (link)
And you know what's AWESOME? We're reading Lysistrata in HIST001. Oh, this would be so much more fun if my discussion section TA wasn't so dreadfully dull.

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[info]gal_montag
2006-09-16 03:12 am UTC (link)
[info]misswong gets hearts forever.

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[info]khym_chanur
2006-09-16 04:39 am UTC (link)
On the side, angelvomit thinks that they just shouldn't date gang members. Okay! Problem solved!

I don't quite get it. Are women in Columbia targeted for violence and crime if they don't have a boyfriend to protect them? Or is the pay disparity between men and women in Columbia so large that a woman can't live decently unless she has a man to support her? Both?

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[info]ladyvorkosigan
2006-09-16 06:19 am UTC (link)
Well, my thoughts when I wrote that were more that in a country where, as Miss Wong points out, violence is so prevalent and gangs often provide the only decent economic opportunities around (or at least are percieved to do so), even filling in for the government in some deperate situations, it's not quite as simple as saying "Gang members, bad; upstanding citizens, good." I mean, I don't necessarily think it's as simple as that here either, but even more so.

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[info]wrongly_amused
2006-09-16 04:59 am UTC (link)
I want to know when expression or use of sexuality, in any manner, became anit-feminist. If it's a means of power, if it something that a woman has a right to control and *chooses* to control, isn't that her right to do as such? It's her right to use her sexuality as she pleases.

I can understand concerns about how it might encourage the idea of women being sexual objects, and there might be some validity to that claim, however...it's not as though this is an unequal transaction. These women are choosing to withold something that a man wants (and which they want to, I'm sure, sex isn't male-exclusive) for an exchange of something *they* want - crime-free living. It's actually rather...clever, I think. If it's your means of power and levity in a relationship, why *not* use it?

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[info]selene_avis
2006-09-16 05:05 am UTC (link)
I agree with your comment.

Also, misswong has a comment further down in the post where she points out that the women withholding sex challenges the idea that only "macho men" are sexually desirable.

In other words, stratyllis is a wanker.

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(Anonymous)
2006-09-16 11:00 am UTC (link)
Every time I see stratyllis commenting anywhere I lament that we still don't have the capacity to reach through the computer screen and punch people. She's always shooting her mouth off about something, and she never seems to engage her brain first. Stupid twat.

angriestgirl @ lj

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[info]onaga
2006-09-16 06:09 pm UTC (link)
GIP

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(Anonymous)
2006-09-19 04:40 am UTC (link)
She's Ginmar?

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[info]rachel_pi
2006-09-16 06:28 pm UTC (link)
[info]stratyllis: BTW, I must have not read the article that carefully, because until you said something I didn't know what race the women were.

[info]misswong: then you must be illiterate or have incredibly poor readding compreshension skills because they are COLOMBIAN

[info]stratyllis: It didn't register to me, I don't really care what someones race is. What I focus on is actions. I was reading about their actions, not looking for what part of the article said what race they were.


...is it wrong that I roffled at this exchange? OMG [info]stratyllis is Stephen Colbert! She doesn't SEE race!

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(Anonymous)
2006-09-17 07:17 am UTC (link)
I LOLed :D

- Sparkly Mouse

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[info]kelschuu
2006-09-16 10:50 pm UTC (link)
...Wow.

This is like the wost ironic case of "...I KNOW THAT PERSON."

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