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Brucha ([info]mindset) wrote in [info]otf_wank,
@ 2007-10-11 16:19:00


Previous Entry  Add to memories!  Tell a Friend!  Next Entry
Entry tags:making light, plagiarism, publishing, sockpuppets

Sockpuppetry in the Publishing Industry... plus: Totally Unrelated Plagiarism!
Taken from a mousie on [info]wank_report, with some editing by me:

In August, Teresa & Patrick Nielsen Hayden's blog Making Light featured a story about an Australian book retailer whose management (one Charlie Rimmer -- insert Red Dwarf joke here) sent a ridiculously rude and potentially extortionate letter to a small Aussie publisher.

The small Aussie publisher responded with a whup-ass response and displayed both docs in a public forum. As the Nielsen Haydens are editors and a lot of their blog participants are writers, this created a lot of good and informative discussion about the book trade in general and the Rimmer's asshattery.

More than a month later, a "Chris Oliver" shows up in the comments to tl;dr defend and justify Rimmer's Ghengis Khan-style correspondence and management methods. When "Chris Oliver" is called on various asshatteries (sneering at the NH's "double-barrelled" name, for example) as well as his insistence that books are really no different than canned vegetables, he flounces and spawns sockpuppet #1. S1 doesn't fare well either, flounces, and sockpuppet #2 is spawned. By the end of the thread, "Chris Oliver" and sockpuppets are presumed to be Rimmer himself or someone very close to him. (And if he isn't, "Chris Oliver" is a prime example of making a side look more stupid than it did before.)

When Teresa posts an update here, "Chris Oliver" returns for a last pot-shot/flounce. Says Chris: "My cadding days with you are over but I shall possibly keep looking for chinks in some other mean-spirited site and post as TN-H to my heart's content." Oooh, he's going to pretend to be Teresa too! We'll have to keep our eyes open for that.

(I vaguely remember seeing something on the publishing extortion story somewhere on JF, but can't find it in the wank comms or in the lounges. Anyone know where it might be? ETA: found it, sort of. )


ETA: And speaking of Making Light, they've got a new story on a self-publishing plagiarist... only it seems like it's not the author's fault, but that of her scamming agent/ghost writer. More discussion in random_lounge...

ETA2: Good god, the mice on w_r are ridiculously bitchy.



(Post a new comment)


[info]wankaholic
2007-10-11 11:51 pm UTC (link)
. . . wow.

(Reply to this)


[info]mmanurere
2007-10-11 11:52 pm UTC (link)
Pfft. Charlie Rimmer is obviously an amateur if he expected to be able to be an ass to book people and not get snarked to hell and back.

(Reply to this)


[info]verpon
2007-10-12 12:00 am UTC (link)
The smack down response was good enough but the comments are just excellent.

This is just beautiful.

(Reply to this)


[info]meyerlemon
2007-10-12 12:02 am UTC (link)
That Rimmer guy is a prick of the particular variety who would do very, very well in certain parts of fandom.

(Reply to this)


[info]paladin
2007-10-12 12:22 am UTC (link)
Rimmer/Oliver should know to always throw in a "please, sir" when he asks for more.

I predict that his next tactic will be to send C&D orders to everyone involved, ourselves included, and demand that we apologize both to him and to random Australian actors.

(Reply to this)


[info]llama_treats
2007-10-12 12:23 am UTC (link)
Paraphrased for those with short attention spans:

Rimmer: "Pay us $20,000 or the books get it, and flog yourself as you pay us!"

Publisher: "Bite me."

I laughed so hard.

(Reply to this)(Thread)

(no subject) - [info]deliciouschaos, 2007-10-12 03:03 am UTC

[info]white_serpent
2007-10-12 12:31 am UTC (link)
I've never before seen a sockpuppet so accepting of its own existential status: usually, they're all "Oh, no, I'm a different person" or "How dare you make such insinuations!" But there's a certain amusement value to this absurd discussion that keeps drawing me back.

Heh.

So, let's recap: incompetent sockpuppeting, flounce, IT WAS A SOCIAL EXPERIMENT, internet lawyers... please, all we need is a pseuicide attempt to make my day complete.

(Reply to this)(Thread)

(no subject) - [info]missdaisy, 2007-10-12 03:03 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]evilsqueakers, 2007-10-12 03:07 am UTC
(no subject) - (Anonymous), 2007-10-12 04:27 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]evilsqueakers, 2007-10-12 04:30 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]kookaburra, 2007-10-12 05:47 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]evilsqueakers, 2007-10-12 05:56 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]brown_betty, 2007-10-12 06:07 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]cmdr_zoom, 2007-10-12 05:45 pm UTC
(no subject) - mirandafox, 2007-10-18 02:12 pm UTC

[info]verpon
2007-10-12 12:38 am UTC (link)
Incidentally, I can remember a publishing/bookshop story in a wank comm before but I'm not sure if I'm remembering two separate ones or just the one.

I certainly remember one in a wank over someone posting to bad service about a small independent bookshop not falling over themselves to accept credit cards which spawned discussion about large publishers using their size to be a bit dickish. I also remember something about the 7th HP book and stuff about lots of independent bookshops possibly not stocking it because it would lead to them losing money on sales but I'm not sure if they were one and and the same.

(Reply to this)(Thread)

(no subject) - [info]white_serpent, 2007-10-12 12:42 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]verpon, 2007-10-12 01:00 am UTC

flightstothesea
2007-10-12 01:41 am UTC (link)
One of many things I like about Making Light is how consistently and thoroughly the Nielsen Haydens pwn people.

Now if only the layout wasn't so ugly. ;_;

(Reply to this)


[info]mooncalf
2007-10-12 02:30 am UTC (link)
... David Gemmell died?! D:

(Why, yes, that's the only bit of information I'm taking away from all this, why?)

(Reply to this)(Thread)

(no subject) - [info]coffeebun, 2007-10-12 07:11 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]sockpuppeteer, 2007-10-13 10:53 pm UTC

[info]kaesa
2007-10-12 02:53 am UTC (link)
I LOVE ML WANK. This is the perfect start to my three-day weekend. Thank you!

(Reply to this)


[info]evilsqueakers
2007-10-12 03:34 am UTC (link)
I'm kinda in love with #301 on the first link. I'm just saying.

(Reply to this)(Thread)

(no subject) - [info]brown_betty, 2007-10-12 06:08 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]evilsqueakers, 2007-10-12 06:12 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]puipui, 2007-10-12 08:14 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]evilsqueakers, 2007-10-12 08:24 am UTC

[info]sneer
2007-10-12 04:35 am UTC (link)
Oh my god, that is the most beautiful smackdown I have ever seen. There is not a "PWNED" macro in all the Internets big enough to reflect the amount of pwnage dispensed in that reply.

(Reply to this)(Thread)

(no subject) - (Anonymous), 2007-10-12 11:59 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]shaysdays, 2007-10-13 12:02 am UTC
(no subject) - mirandafox, 2007-10-18 02:15 pm UTC

[info]lied_ohne_worte
2007-10-12 08:11 am UTC (link)
If you wish to discuss any of the contents hereof you may call my secretary for an appointment at my office in Frenchs Forest. I shall be marginally more generous than you and at least allow you to pick a convenient time.

*snorts* Beautiful. That whole letter is a thing of beauty.

(Reply to this)


[info]dragonfangirl
2007-10-12 11:35 am UTC (link)
It gives me such a warm feeling that a guy named "Rimmer" should turn out to be such an inveterate douchebag.

(Reply to this)(Thread)

(no subject) - [info]vito_excalibur, 2007-10-12 08:38 pm UTC
(no subject) - mirandafox, 2007-10-18 02:16 pm UTC

[info]jetamors
2007-10-12 01:15 pm UTC (link)
OT, but when did we get tags?!?! *_*

(Reply to this)(Thread)

(no subject) - [info]threegoldfish, 2007-10-12 02:31 pm UTC

[info]no_touching
2007-10-12 01:54 pm UTC (link)
Just like a road accident, I couldn't look away! Internet lawyers! Mean girls! My sock puppets and I were just testing! But all in full sentences with punctuation, except for:

IM IN UR THREADS
BEIN A SOCKPUPPIT
BUT NO I IZ ACTUALLY TESTIN YOU!!
I CAN HAZ EBOOKS??

Jesus Christ, I miss all the fun threads.


Good times!

Plus, I'm very glad that due to the appallingness of the A&R website that I failed to spend money with them just last week.

(Reply to this)


[info]seiberwing
2007-10-12 03:36 pm UTC (link)
For people who throw stones at glasses houses should be very cautious about speaking before they know the truth. Slander can cause a major lawsuit from the author and the publisher mentioned, because I will make sure they know about this and dear Jane will have nightmares in 10 fold. Yes, I'm Wicca.

Internet lawsuits AND spell threats. This is a new combo.

(Reply to this)(Thread)

(no subject) - [info]tofuknight, 2007-10-12 11:58 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]seiberwing, 2007-10-13 12:15 am UTC

[info]souris
2007-10-12 06:17 pm UTC (link)
Re: the original letter and resulting kerfluffle, could it be that you read about it on Smart Bitches, Trashy Books?

(Reply to this)(Thread)

(no subject) - [info]mindset, 2007-10-12 07:27 pm UTC

[info]daylightsparks
2007-10-12 06:19 pm UTC (link)
If you would like to discuss this with me in more detail, I am delighted to confirm an appointment with you at 1:00pm on Friday 17th August for 10 minutes at my offices at 379 Collins St, Melbourne.

LOL WHUT.

If I didn't know better, I would think this was a joke. The "10 minutes" bit is what really pushes it over the top.

(Reply to this)


[info]velvet_mace
2007-10-12 08:26 pm UTC (link)
... I don't know, I find it absurdly fitting that a chick who hired a ghostwriter in order to write a novel to be published on a vanity press, ended up getting caught for plagiarism. Even if all had worked out as she hoped, she would have been accepting fame (and presumably fortune) for writing that wasn't her own. She may not be a plagiarist in deed, but she certainly is one in spirit.

(Reply to this)(Thread)

(no subject) - [info]chvickers, 2007-10-15 01:18 pm UTC

[info]black_spot
2007-10-12 08:32 pm UTC (link)
A&R’s management doesn’t really understand the book reading public much. This is so sweet – who let the idiot dictate that? And the idiot design their website? Someone went a bit frame mad.

(Reply to this)(Thread)

(no subject) - [info]evilsqueakers, 2007-10-12 11:28 pm UTC

[info]frequentmouse
2007-10-13 01:08 am UTC (link)
Second eta: The [info]wankreportmice or possibly one random and profane mouse are like unto the bull shark lurking under the dock ready to bite off body parts if one ventures into the water. I used to check wank and mention if the OP was under-age or otherwise problematic, but nevermore; real life has sufficient unpleasantness.

(Reply to this)


[info]napalmnacey
2007-10-13 07:21 am UTC (link)
Holy wow. Okay - won't be buying books from A&R any time soon!

(Reply to this)


[info]knightrider
2007-10-21 09:55 am UTC (link)
I'm in Australia, and everything the guy said about A&R having a poor selection is absolutely true. They are the last stop on my list for bookshopping because I know that unless I am after Stephen King's very latest, I am unlikely to find what I am looking for on their shelves. Unfortunately, I live in a regional centre, not a big city and for a long time, they have been one of my only choices. We had a Dymocks, but it closed its doors years ago. I turned to Amazon and eBay about eight years ago and rarely buy a book in person.

However - Borders is due to open here on 4 December and I fully expect them to wipe the floor with A&R.

(Reply to this)(Thread)

(no subject) - (Anonymous), 2007-10-22 07:05 am UTC

 
   
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