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dracothelizard
2007-11-30 12:05 pm UTC (link)

I can't quite believe all the people going 'it's not my job! It's the PARENTS job!'

Yes, parents should take responsibility and should keep an eye on what their children do on the internet, and in the real world. But seriously, according to those people, we should just not use a rating system for movies (Hey, it's the parents' responsibility to stop kids from seeing an adult movie!) or asking for ID when they want buy cigarettes or alcohol (because the parents are responsible for making sure their children don't buy illegal substances at their age) and not bother to show adult movies or TV shows only in the late evening.

Seriously, the ideal human community according to these 'it's the parents job to watch the children, not everyone else's! people has less fitness than that of a pack of lions.

*sighs*

I knew this obligatory Behaviour course would be bad for me.

I'll go back to finishing Nano now.

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shaggydogstail
2007-11-30 02:24 pm UTC (link)

No, no, no, parents must watch their children EVERY SINGLE MOMENT OF THE DAY until they are old enough to see, well, everything. No responsible parent would ever, say, lay down ground rules about 'no adult sites' and then let their young 'uns on the computer without hovering over their shoulder constantly, or let them go to the movies unsupervised on the promise that they're going to see something suitable.

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	rosehiptea 2007-12-01 05:46 am UTC (link)
	No responsible parent would ever, say, lay down ground rules about 'no adult sites' and then let their young 'uns on the computer without hovering over their shoulder constantly That's the part that lets me know these people actually have no kids. That and the assumption that all parents are rabid porn-haters who expect the entire world to make itself kids-safe. (Reply to this)(Parent)

karmakaze
2007-11-30 03:15 pm UTC (link)

Granted, I'm sure some people are taking the whole "If you're not surgically attached to your kid, anything objectionable your child comes across is your fault and your fault only" thing a bit far.

The thing is, it's actually pretty hard to stumble across really objectionable content online. (Just like it's hard to accidentally stumble into a liquor store and bring a beer to the counter.) So, in the vast majority of these cases, the children are seeking out whatever it is the parents don't like. That is what I expect parents to try to control - they can do it by watching the children, by talking to their kids about what's out there, by teaching their kids judgment, whatever.

As an adult, I don't mind moderating my behavior in spaces reserved for children, nor even keeping my conversations in public spaces at the "PG/worksafe" level. What I resent is the idea that anyplace a child could find their way must be considered a children's space.

People are pulling out the "raise your own kids" argument because there is a loud countermeme that is demanding that everyone in the outside world police their every activity on the off chance a child might decide to come along. A lot of the net nannies are taking the view that providers of content are solely responsible and that neither the parents nor children involved have any responsibilities whatsoever.

Even before this labeling decision, if your kid was reading porny fanfiction (or looking at boobies, or whatever) on livejournal, it's because your kid went looking for it. If your kid can't be trusted not to sneak into R rated movies, then don't drop your kid off at the theater unescorted. If your kid can't be trusted to respect your limits on browsing, don't let them online unsupervised. If your teen is getting wasted in your basement, then maybe its time to have a chat about responsible alcohol use. If some idiot is handing out beer to teens in the parking lot, then, yeah, go after the idiot.

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	narcissam 2007-11-30 05:25 pm UTC (link)
	The thing is, it's actually pretty hard to stumble across really objectionable content online. Not in my experience! I remember trying to find information on marriage taboos in non-Western cultures as a newbie teenager... Ok, maybe I was just asking for trouble there. (Reply to this)(Parent)

izzygal
2007-11-30 05:46 pm UTC (link)

The thing is, it's actually pretty hard to stumble across really objectionable content online.

Yeah - not in my experience either. I've typed some pretty innocuous things into Google and seen shit I'd rather not see, even as an almost 40 year-old. I typed in the name of my hometown as an image search for a meme once and half the first page was some topless woman - and I don't live in Tits, TX.

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	arielchan 2007-11-30 10:00 pm UTC (link)
	XD Stuff like that is why I skipped the meme that involved putting the name of your university in a YouTube search. (Reply to this)(Parent)(Thread)

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shaysdays, 2007-12-01 10:17 am UTC

	rosehiptea 2007-12-01 05:53 am UTC (link)
	There have been huge periods of time where I honestly haven't stumbled across anything except in my spam folder, and other periods of time when simple google searches about anime or something gave me ads for barnyard porn. So maybe some people really don't run across it very often. (Reply to this)(Parent)

	kosaginolegion 2007-12-02 06:58 pm UTC (link)
	The site with all the animated gifs of women being fucked was a real winner. I don't think I - at 44 - was old enough for that. Almost enough to put me off sex entirely. I have a door to my office and can close and lock it if I run across such sites but sometimes I forget to watch out for the pitter patter of little feet. (And they're sneaky little feet, too.) (Reply to this)(Parent)

	snacky 2007-11-30 06:26 pm UTC (link)
	The thing is, it's actually pretty hard to stumble across really objectionable content online. It...what? I'm sorry, I'm going to need to see that again. The thing is, it's actually pretty hard to stumble across really objectionable content online. No, still not working for me. Please explain to me how this works. (Reply to this)(Parent)(Thread)

	agent_hyatt 2007-11-30 11:45 pm UTC (link)
	Please explain to me how this works. See, when I open my browser, objectionable material doesn't immediately appear without me doing anything. I have to go through all the work of checking my email and even emptying my spam folder before running into said material. (Reply to this)(Parent)

	karmakaze 2007-12-01 03:44 pm UTC (link)
	Seriously? Boobies are everywhere. You stumble across them online, but they're also all over TV and billboards. Foul language? Also all over the real world as well as the internet. Hot explicit donkey sex? Usually requires a clickthrough. (not so much because they're protecting our delicate sensibilities, but because they make more money that way.) (Reply to this)(Parent)(Thread)

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snacky, 2007-12-01 03:55 pm UTC

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karmakaze, 2007-12-02 04:55 am UTC

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snacky, 2007-12-02 05:37 am UTC

	ingrid 2007-11-30 06:35 pm UTC (link)
	(Just like it's hard to accidentally stumble into a liquor store and bring a beer to the counter.) That'sh notsh that harrd. hic (Reply to this)(Parent)(Thread)

	trollprincess 2007-12-01 07:21 am UTC (link)
	Is, too. Some of us HAAAAAATE beer. swills more Smirnoff (Reply to this)(Parent)

	ladybirdsleeps 2007-11-30 06:35 pm UTC (link)
	What do you think about children who get wasted and then read explicit fanfiction based on R-rated movies? What are the parents' responsibilities if their kid is a raging cokehead sex-fiend? Please make your response at least five paragraphs long. (Reply to this)(Parent)(Thread)

	puipui 2007-12-01 12:16 am UTC (link)
	Are they yaoi movies? I need to know her thoughts on yaoi. (Reply to this)(Parent)(Thread)

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karmakaze, 2007-12-01 01:34 am UTC

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chibikaijuu, 2007-12-01 02:18 am UTC

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karmakaze, 2007-12-01 03:30 pm UTC

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churri, 2007-12-02 07:37 am UTC

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jaseroque, 2007-12-03 09:20 am UTC

	sarajayechan 2007-11-30 07:15 pm UTC (link)
	IAWTC. (Reply to this)(Parent)

	airborne_rodent 2007-11-30 09:14 pm UTC (link)
	I've rarely stumbled across objectionable content online. I must be doing something wrong. :( (Reply to this)(Parent)

	dragonfangirl 2007-12-01 07:46 am UTC (link)
	[anecdote about traumatic unexpected internet porn encounter here] (Reply to this)(Parent)

	eilan 2007-11-30 07:56 pm UTC (link)
	Is your Nano project by any chance 50.000 words on yaoi? Because I'd love to hear both yours and shaggydogstail's thoughts on that. Preferably in four languages. (Reply to this)(Parent)(Thread)

	dracothelizard 2007-11-30 07:57 pm UTC (link)
	Sorry, I only know two languages :(. (Reply to this)(Parent)

blackjackrocket
2007-12-01 01:32 am UTC (link)

See, if I had my way, things would have ratings on them, but those wouldn't be means of excluding anyone. Once you provide the consumer with the necessary warnings, they ought to be allowed to make their own decisions about whether or not to continue. Ergo, if you tell the parent that the game they're getting for Little Suzie is rated M, they should still be able to buy it, knowing full well what they're getting into. And a group of 14-year-olds should be allowed into an R-rated movie provided they know what it contains.

And, because they would be provided with that knowledge up front, any lawsuits resulting from it would be laughed out of court. It would be akin to being allergic to carrots, asking if something had carrots, being told it did, and ordering it anyway.

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	heddychaa 2007-12-01 04:30 am UTC (link)
	Because children are totally able to make educated and informed decisions on their own. ~~Goddamnit I hate watching movies with fucking teenagers~~ (Reply to this)(Parent)(Thread)

	blackjackrocket 2007-12-01 04:40 am UTC (link)
	A lot more so than adults give them credit for. And if they find they're over their heads, they can always leave the theater. (Reply to this)(Parent)(Thread)

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heddychaa, 2007-12-01 04:44 am UTC

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rosehiptea, 2007-12-01 06:07 am UTC

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blackjackrocket, 2007-12-01 06:18 am UTC

rosehiptea
2007-12-01 06:02 am UTC (link)

Ergo, if you tell the parent that the game they're getting for Little Suzie is rated M, they should still be able to buy it, knowing full well what they're getting into.

Well, the parent can still buy the game for their kid as things stand now. They can't let their kid attend an R-rated movie in a theater unless they also attend... but they could buy the DVD for their kid. (I'm not trying to speak for or against the rules as they stand, just trying to parse this out.)

I guess the parent could also try to sue later, but as a parent I'd pretty much laugh my ass off at that one.

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