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Re: Might get some negative feedback on this, but...

sandglass
2009-08-03 10:56 pm UTC (link)

No shit. I can control what I eat, but controlling how my body responds to it? No. We don't actually have control of our bodies, I might get lucky and have my body start consuming fat to make up the lost calories, but it might also kill my immune system, my energy levels, my metabolism, start consuming muscle to depress my need for calories, or make me into an insufferable grump.

And when I exercise on lines with diets (hour daily at a moderate pace), my hunger levels about triple. Pretty hard to lose weight when you start shaking if you don't get at least 3500 calories a day.

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Re: Might get some negative feedback on this, but...

sneer
2009-08-03 11:35 pm UTC (link)

God, no kidding.

I know almost exactly how many calories it took to keep me at 135 pounds when I was 22: 850 a day plus five days a week at the gym.

I know this because I got put on the "weight management" program in the military, for being one pound over the max. This meant I had to write down everything I ate and every second I exercised and hand it in once a week.

That's a little over half of what's recommended for a sedentary 160-pound person.

So, um, yeah, anyone who thinks "oh, well, you're in control of your body and if you're overweight you're just not trying hard enough to lose it!" can kiss my chunky ass.

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	Re: Might get some negative feedback on this, but... lyppy 2009-08-06 06:58 pm UTC (link)
	Wait--seriously? 136 was too heavy? What kind of logic is that? (Reply to this)(Parent)(Thread)

Re: Might get some negative feedback on this, but...

sneer
2009-08-06 07:21 pm UTC (link)

It was actually 138 for my height IIRC and give or take a pound, but I'd just wanted to be absolutely damn sure I wouldn't flunk another weighin once I got off the actual program and on probation.

Another fun fact: they measured BMI by measuring hips/waist/neck/maybe something else I don't remember, which is what, the second least accurate way to do it next to straight-up height/weight? And you had to wear baggy shorts or pants and a loose shirt, and they would not allow for the extra inch or so the baggy shit might have added.

The military is almost as bad as the fashion industry about this shit, seriously, or at least it was when I was there. >_<

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	Re: Might get some negative feedback on this, but... sneer 2009-08-06 07:37 pm UTC (link)
	...actually, I have to take that last part back--they seem to have gotten better about this now that I check. Sort of. Someone still needs to slap the Air Force upside the head--they want a BMI under 25% and don't seem to distinguish between males and females for that. For them at least, my >_< stands. (Reply to this)(Parent)

Re: Might get some negative feedback on this, but...

zaliesiren
2009-08-04 01:58 am UTC (link)

This reminds me of a girl I knew who kept whining about her weight (and she was on the morbidly obese side) and claim genetics and then go down an entire pizza, a pint of Ben and Jerry's, and a two liter of coke.

Yeah sure, you can eat what you like, but if you do that and then whine about being overweight? I am, in fact, going to roll my eyes - and then move on with my life.

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	Re: Might get some negative feedback on this, but... sandglass 2009-08-04 02:10 am UTC (link)
	One person!=all fat people. One person's actions around you!=how they always behave. (Reply to this)(Parent)(Thread)

	Re: Might get some negative feedback on this, but... zaliesiren 2009-08-04 02:12 am UTC (link)
	Okay! (Reply to this)(Parent)(Thread)

	Re: Might get some negative feedback on this, but... sorchar 2009-08-04 03:24 am UTC (link)
	You're an ass and you have no idea what you're talking about. Until you've monitored the diet and lifestyle of every fat person ever for a good length of time, shut the hell up. (Reply to this)(Parent)(Thread)

Re: Might get some negative feedback on this, but...

zaliesiren
2009-08-04 03:32 am UTC (link)

*sigh* Okay, okay I give. She's been my friend for years, so that "monitored the diet and lifestyle of every fat person ever for a good length of time," got it. What I don't like and didn't feel necessary to add was that she claimed low metabolism due to genetics, which I also have. The difference is that my chubby self doesn't scarf half of what she does and, yeah, that does bother me a bit. I don't whine about my weight - I'm fat, and there's only so much I can do about it, but I am doing it. To say there's nothing that can be done because of x-y-or z is insane.

Whenever she goes on - at length - about how she's fat and needs to diet and doesn't listen to anyone. First it was "No, you're not fat," then it was "Try this food instead of ice cream/cake/pizza/etc, you might like it," and then it was *rolls eyes* and moving on.

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Re: Might get some negative feedback on this, but... -

sorchar, 2009-08-04 03:41 am UTC

Re: Might get some negative feedback on this, but... -

zaliesiren, 2009-08-04 04:25 am UTC

Re: Might get some negative feedback on this, but... -

sorchar, 2009-08-04 04:37 am UTC

Re: Might get some negative feedback on this, but... -

risha, 2009-08-04 05:24 am UTC

Re: Might get some negative feedback on this, but... -

alya1989262, 2009-08-04 10:48 am UTC

	Re: Might get some negative feedback on this, but... puipui 2009-08-04 02:35 am UTC (link)
	And you remind me of all those judgemental fatphobic assholes who say pretty much this exact same thing every single time anyone mentions even tangentially that being heavy may not always be completely dependent on behavior nor completely unhealthy. Perhaps it's because you are one of them! (Reply to this)(Parent)(Thread)

Re: Might get some negative feedback on this, but...

silrana
2009-08-04 12:25 pm UTC (link)

I don't think saying that someone who eats a very large amount of high calorie food then complains about not being able to loose weight is ignoring their own contribution to the situation is being an asshole.

I have to take a big handful of pills every morning, and one of them causes my body to fight losing weight tooth and nail. My doctor hates having to give it to me, since I'm about eighty pounds overweight, but the other medicines in that same classification make you *gain* weight, so that's the best he can do.

So do I throw up my hands and declare it impossible? No, I've just been trying to make small changes. My salt cravings won't let me pass up potato chips, but I *can* pass up the dip. I can walk up stairs instead of taking the elevator one floor at work. I can have broiled chicken instead of barbecue. And I've been losing about, oh, a pound a month. But that's good enough, because slow changes will work a lot better in the long run than diets, which have never worked in the past. I just spend the whole diet fantasizing about the foods I can't eat and then go nuts after I get off of it. I think a lot of the problem with the issue is that when people say, "I can't lose weight," they mean they can't lose weight fast. I used to have that mindset, too.

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	Re: Might get some negative feedback on this, but... puipui 2009-08-04 04:27 pm UTC (link)
	Thank you for sharing. Also, "lose" has one 'O'. (Reply to this)(Parent)(Thread)

	Re: Might get some negative feedback on this, but... silrana 2009-08-04 05:50 pm UTC (link)
	Yeah, I shouldn't post first thing in the morning. Typos always slip in. (Reply to this)(Parent)

	Re: Might get some negative feedback on this, but... ariadne484 2009-08-04 04:37 pm UTC (link)
	Clearly, that makes you morally superior to every other fat person, who could be a size 4 if we'd just try hard enough. Never mind what else we might want to do with our time and energy. Enjoy your virtue and wonderfulness! It's its own prize. (Reply to this)(Parent)(Thread)

Re: Might get some negative feedback on this, but...

silrana
2009-08-04 05:49 pm UTC (link)

See, there's what I was talking about in another post. "Lose weight" somehow automatically gets translated as "Set impossible goal to become model thin."

I think the first thing that needs defining is what kind of weight level are we talking? If someone just looks a little chunky in a swimsuit and sees no reason to change, then it's no big deal. But I think a lot of harm is done by repeating mantras that encourage people who have weight levels that pose a health risk to them to think that they can do nothing to change.

You want to know what my goal is? To lose twenty pounds a year. At that rate I just might have a good shot at living long enough to see my kids get out of college. Fuck models, I'm interested in survival.

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Re: Might get some negative feedback on this, but... -

risha, 2009-08-04 06:01 pm UTC

Re: Might get some negative feedback on this, but... -

silrana, 2009-08-04 07:05 pm UTC

Re: Might get some negative feedback on this, but... -

risha, 2009-08-04 07:18 pm UTC

Re: Might get some negative feedback on this, but... - ariadne484, 2009-08-04 06:05 pm UTC

Re: Might get some negative feedback on this, but... -

silrana, 2009-08-04 06:37 pm UTC

Re: Might get some negative feedback on this, but... -

mindset, 2009-08-05 01:39 am UTC

Re: Might get some negative feedback on this, but...

risha
2009-08-04 04:47 pm UTC (link)

Accompanying protip: "lifestyle changes" = "diet and exercise" for 99% of people. (That 99% number is the only one I pulled out of my ass.)

Seriously, I think that I'm starting to come off as an obsessive whackjob in this post. I just hate to see people deliberately set themselves up to hurt themselves down the line. Eating well on average and getting regular moderate exercise equals a reduction of all sorts of risk factors for the so-called obesity related diseases down the line. But far too many people, after they gain the weight back, decide not to do those things anymore because they "failed", with a bonus side of crushingly low self esteem.

Another protip: being fat or not is not a moral issue. Access, time, and inclination to exercise, eat food that is good for you, and get adequate medical care can be political, economic, and social issues, but are also not personal moral issues.

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	Re: Might get some negative feedback on this, but... sneer 2009-08-04 06:19 pm UTC (link)
	My salt cravings won't let me pass up potato chips Do you need a minute to figure out why saying this makes you a hypocrite? (Reply to this)(Parent)(Thread)

	Re: Might get some negative feedback on this, but... silrana 2009-08-04 06:42 pm UTC (link)
	How is it hypocritical for me to say how hard it is for me? What would be hypocritical would be for me to act like it's as easy as skipping through daisies when I know full well how much I struggle and fail. But falling down doesn't make the goal not worth working for. It just means I have to dust myself off and get back to trying. (Reply to this)(Parent)(Thread)

Re: Might get some negative feedback on this, but... -

sneer, 2009-08-04 07:49 pm UTC

Re: Might get some negative feedback on this, but... -

silrana, 2009-08-04 09:33 pm UTC

	Re: Might get some negative feedback on this, but... sandglass 2009-08-04 03:59 am UTC (link)
	Also, did you miss that's how much I eat when I exercise because if I don't, I get sick? Unless you think that I should be shaking and ill to not be a whiny fatty. Sometimes when fat people eat, it's actually because our bodies need fuel, fancy that! (Reply to this)(Parent)(Thread)

Re: Might get some negative feedback on this, but...

zaliesiren
2009-08-04 04:29 am UTC (link)

Actually with her I'm not really concerned with the amount so much as *what* she's eating and I apologize for not being clearer there - it really is scary to watch. Me? I've been known to down that much in the past and I went KABOOM up the scale. Nowadays my amount hasn't really decreased but what I put into my body has changed, if that makes sense? I lost a shitton of weight. My energy is about the same, because there's nothing I can do about that. It upsets me that the same girl who will scarf down an entire thing of strawberry icecream turns up her nose at a bowl of actual strawberries. I hope that makes more sense. I know she's an isolated incident, but it's painful to watch.

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	Re: Might get some negative feedback on this, but... zaliesiren 2009-08-04 04:31 am UTC (link)
	ETA to clarify: I've been known to eat that much doesn't mean I do it daily. I don't eat the same amount as her on a daily basis. About half probably - I still eat a lot. (Reply to this)(Parent)

	Re: Might get some negative feedback on this, but... sisterelwood 2009-08-04 06:02 am UTC (link)
	. (Reply to this)(Parent)

	phosfate 2009-08-04 02:41 pm UTC (link)
	I think her real problem is that she hangs out with jerks. (Reply to this)(Parent)(Thread)

	ashenmote 2009-08-04 08:46 pm UTC (link)
	♥ (Reply to this)(Parent)

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