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dottiness ([info]dottiness) wrote in [info]unfunny_fandom,
@ 2011-04-19 22:12:00


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Right, so, Ginia Bellafante did a terrible, sexist, uninformed review of HBO's adaptation of Game of Thrones including statements about how it was boy fiction, the sex and intrigue was only in there as a bone thrown to women viewers, and she'd never met a woman who would rather read "The Hobbit" than a piece of literary fiction.

Apparently she got hundreds of angry emails, hundreds of angry tweets, and "three supportive notes from people she is personally considering adopting." So what lesson does she take from all of this?

"Pull up a throne and let's talk" includes such well-written responses as this:

"As I wrote in the review, I realize that there are women who love fantasy, but I don’t know any and that is the truth: I don’t know any."

"But they have also sent long and vitriolic attacks claiming that, in my negativity, I made it clear that I had no idea what I was talking about. I appreciate the economy of those readers who began and ended their comments: “You are a complete idiot.” Phrases like that constituted a whole subgenre of the online response."


Lots of comments on both sides of the issue, but, unsurprisingly, a tremendously large number calling her out on her excuse for saying no woman would ever want to read fantasy.

I didn't know where this should go, so I stuck with the old "if you aren't sure, put it in UFB!" rule. The last post about this was in [info]fandom_lounge, but I think her continuing to dig the hole deeper probably belongs elsewhere.


(Post a new comment)


[info]the__ivorytower
2011-04-20 01:13 am UTC (link)
The F-L post was full of fun stories about our book collections, this makes me sad.

(Also, what if she's an incomplete idiot?)

(Reply to this)(Thread)


[info]dottiness
2011-04-20 01:21 am UTC (link)
It does make me a little sad. The FL post made me finally go put my collection into stacks so it's no longer lying in random places around my apartment. Sweet christ, I need a bookshelf.

(Reply to this)(Parent)(Thread)

(no subject) - [info]the__ivorytower, 2011-04-20 01:22 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]kosaginolegion, 2011-04-20 01:07 pm UTC

[info]lady7jane
2011-04-20 01:25 am UTC (link)
It was a stupid review, but I dislike the SOIAF fandom and its smugness so much I can't even find enjoyment in their incredible wrath, even if it's directed at a proper target for once.

(Reply to this)(Thread)


[info]dottiness
2011-04-20 01:33 am UTC (link)
I can sympathize with hating the fandom just because it's two extremes ("I'll wait forever for the book!" vs. "WHY HASN'T HE WRITTEN THE BOOK YESTERDAY WARGH") with very little room for people somewhere in between.

(Reply to this)(Parent)


[info]sgaana
2011-04-20 01:42 am UTC (link)
I dunno, it seemed like she was getting wrath from way beyond just that one fandom. I don't know anyone in the fandom, but I saw a LOT of wrath about that from all over the place. I felt pretty painfully-sarcastically wrathy about it myself.

(Reply to this)(Parent)(Thread)

(no subject) - [info]evilsqueakers, 2011-04-20 03:20 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]blackflag, 2011-04-20 07:49 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]evilsqueakers, 2011-04-21 02:52 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]blackflag, 2011-04-21 04:19 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]evilsqueakers, 2011-04-21 04:33 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]blackflag, 2011-04-21 04:49 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]evilsqueakers, 2011-04-21 04:58 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]blackflag, 2011-04-21 05:26 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]evilsqueakers, 2011-04-21 07:45 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]blackflag, 2011-04-21 07:51 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]evilsqueakers, 2011-04-21 07:54 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]blackflag, 2011-04-21 08:04 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]evilsqueakers, 2011-04-21 08:07 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]blackflag, 2011-04-21 08:32 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]evilsqueakers, 2011-04-21 08:34 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]dottiness, 2011-04-21 04:47 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]blackflag, 2011-04-21 04:50 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]dottiness, 2011-04-21 05:14 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]blackflag, 2011-04-21 05:19 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]chibikaijuu, 2011-04-20 04:02 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]ekaterinv, 2011-04-20 04:04 am UTC

[info]ashinae
2011-04-20 05:47 am UTC (link)
I'm not a fan of SOIAF--I haven't even been able to finish Game of Thrones because it's just too. damn. dark.

My wrath is entirely for professional writers who forget that "the plural of anecdote is not data", as that wonderful phrase goes, and I even told Ms Bellafante such in my own e-mail. Generalisations make me make frowny faces.

(Reply to this)(Parent)(Thread)

(no subject) - [info]dottiness, 2011-04-20 05:48 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]ashinae, 2011-04-20 05:51 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]chikane, 2011-04-20 07:43 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]dottiness, 2011-04-20 07:54 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]chikane, 2011-04-20 06:42 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]sandglass, 2011-04-20 09:34 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]dottiness, 2011-04-21 12:13 am UTC

[info]bienegold
2011-04-20 02:22 pm UTC (link)
I'm so sick of hearing about the books and the show and I really resent her for making me be on their side, dammit.

(Reply to this)(Parent)


[info]oddplaces
2011-04-20 01:59 am UTC (link)
That is just... wow. I mean, I don't personally know any female fans of Country music, but I don't blithely assume that means there aren't any! Entire genres of entertainment that have been around for ages are not going to be gender-exclusive, even if they're gender-biased! That goes for books, music, television, and anything else. Even if there are more boys than girls, or vice-versa, there aren't going to be only boys -- even as a kid I knew girls who liked Transformers and boys who like My Little Pony, so if I can grasp this concept at the age of seven there's no excuse for a grown woman making it in a public review.

Really, it's reminding me of the time I was perusing a Discworld-fandom post and someone said that, essentially, "the Guards subseries only appeals to teenage boys"/"it's only there to appeal to teenage boys" -- I have never forgotten how that person's rudeness made me feel, since it's my favourite Disc subseries, and I'm a female over the age of 25! (So... I have the taste of a "teenage boy", which is implied to be unsophisticated and violent? Or I just don't exist? Or I am actually wrong about what my favourite series is?)

(Reply to this)(Thread)


[info]rosehiptea
2011-04-20 02:53 am UTC (link)
the Guards subseries only appeals to teenage boys

Well, the Guards subseries does have a canon romance in it, and everybody knows teenage boys... um... yeah, never mind.

(Reply to this)(Parent)(Thread)

(no subject) - [info]rosehiptea, 2011-04-20 02:55 am UTC

[info]seiberwing
2011-04-20 03:29 am UTC (link)
Exactly what about the Guards set screams 'teenage boys'? If it's geared at anyone it's geared at older men (especially fathers) who find something of themselves in Vimes.

(Reply to this)(Parent)(Thread)

(no subject) - [info]kosaginolegion, 2011-04-20 01:10 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]cmdr_zoom, 2011-04-20 04:45 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]kosaginolegion, 2011-04-20 04:56 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]frequentmouse, 2011-04-20 08:46 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]seiberwing, 2011-04-21 12:53 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]cmdr_zoom, 2011-04-21 02:04 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]seiberwing, 2011-04-21 02:48 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]cmdr_zoom, 2011-04-21 04:56 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]seiberwing, 2011-04-21 04:58 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]frequentmouse, 2011-04-22 10:09 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]kumquat_of_doom, 2011-04-23 12:54 am UTC

[info]ekaterinv
2011-04-20 04:02 am UTC (link)
Huh, I don't think I've ever known any male fans of Country music.

It's funny how nearly everything in the world that isn't specifically geared toward women is supposed to only appeal to teenage boys. And how nothing geared toward women could ever possibly appeal to men -- pfft, men don't like romance at all of course! They just want to stick their dicks in something really quick and get off on blowing shit up, they don't have or care about relationships or emotions or hot sex scenes at all!

(Reply to this)(Parent)(Thread)

(no subject) - [info]jaythenerdkid, 2011-04-20 08:08 am UTC

[info]mirhanda
2011-04-20 08:00 pm UTC (link)
*sputter*

I am also a woman over the age of 25 (WAY over) and the Guards subseries is absolutely my favorite. I boggle that people think that way!

(Reply to this)(Parent)(Thread)

(no subject) - [info]littleshebear, 2011-04-20 08:17 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]athersgeo, 2011-04-20 09:02 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]rosehiptea, 2011-04-21 01:28 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]kumquat_of_doom, 2011-04-23 12:52 am UTC

[info]rosehiptea
2011-04-20 02:55 am UTC (link)
Phrases like that constituted a whole subgenre of the online response.

People are calling someone a complete idiot over the internet? You must have really struck a nerve with some sensitive people!

Or maybe you just said something on the internet.

(Reply to this)(Thread)


[info]the__ivorytower
2011-04-20 03:11 am UTC (link)

(Reply to this)(Parent)


[info]agent_hyatt
2011-04-20 03:22 am UTC (link)
"As I wrote in the review, I realize that there are women who love fantasy, but I don’t know any and that is the truth: I don’t know any."

And I don't know anyone who actually likes the Twilight series, so therefore all its commercial success must be due to people who buy it only to mock it.

(Reply to this)


[info]sailorlum
2011-04-20 03:23 am UTC (link)
Wow, so that Ginia Bellafante is a wanky ignoramus. And seems most determined to continue to be so. How sad. -_-

(Reply to this)


[info]cleolinda
2011-04-20 05:30 am UTC (link)
"As I wrote in the review, I realize that there are women who love fantasy, but I don’t know any and that is the truth: I don’t know any."

I just read over this again. She actually admits that, IN THE ORIGINAL ARTICLE, she DID KNOW that women who love fantasy EXIST SOMEWHERE. But she doesn't know them. So they don't exist. Except that she knows that they do. But they don't read Lorrie Moore in the book club with her. Help me, I'm lost.

(Reply to this)(Thread)


[info]dottiness
2011-04-20 05:35 am UTC (link)
I can't quite figure out that one, either.

(Reply to this)(Parent)


[info]the__ivorytower
2011-04-20 05:46 am UTC (link)
She's like one of the people I've gamed with that, when confronted with the fact they've done something wrong, they say, "I know", and I can't help but ask myself (and sometimes, them): "If you know what you did was wrong, WHY DID YOU DO IT ANYWAY?!"

In other words, some people.

(Reply to this)(Parent)


[info]ekaterinv
2011-04-20 06:12 am UTC (link)
There are quite a few people who write stuff for the internet who seem to think using qualifiers is a sign of weakness. I didn't notice it until recently, but I have oh so many examples. Did you know that all men love porn and this hurts the self-esteem of all women, for instance?

(Reply to this)(Parent)(Thread)

(no subject) - [info]rosehiptea, 2011-04-20 08:09 am UTC
(no subject) - ealusaid, 2011-04-20 09:08 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]rosehiptea, 2011-04-20 11:14 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]phosfate, 2011-04-20 03:57 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]bubosquared, 2011-04-20 08:18 am UTC

[info]lyrangalia
2011-04-20 04:44 pm UTC (link)
I read that review, and seriously wondered if it was supposed to be a poorly written pisstake at the whole skeeviness of ASoIaF.

But no, she's just incredibly ignorant.

(Reply to this)


[info]littleshebear
2011-04-20 08:34 pm UTC (link)
It's good that there are a few comments pointing out that she wasn't just sexist in her review, she was ablist as well. "This is a fantasy series. There's a dwarf in it, therefore he must be from a fantastical race of doughty miners!" It never crossed her mind that he might be a human being.

(Reply to this)(Thread)

(no subject) - [info]shinysandals, 2011-04-20 11:03 pm UTC

[info]warchio
2011-04-20 10:50 pm UTC (link)
Unfortunately, if you are an idiot online then people will call you out on it. Frequently, even if you aren't an idiot you will still be called out on stuff. It is an avoidable facet of plonking yourself down in front of people and waving your opinions at them.

(That said, I AM a huge SOIAF fan and loved the show - http://www.culturenorthernireland.org/article/4018/tv-review-game-of-thrones - so I am biased against her.)

(Reply to this)(Thread)

(no subject) - [info]littleshebear, 2011-04-21 12:57 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]bubosquared, 2011-04-21 09:19 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]warchio, 2011-04-21 09:31 am UTC

[info]chienne
2011-04-21 05:47 am UTC (link)
Gina's response in a nutshell:

"It's my opinion, so it can't be wrong or offensive! Waaaaah!!!"

(Reply to this)


[info]bcaluroso
2011-04-23 10:08 am UTC (link)
This is fun!

I don't know any women who like Twilight, so I'll imply they don't exist!

I don't know any women who don't like fantasy, so I'll imply they don't exist!

I don't know any women who wear high heels, so I'll imply they don't exist!

I don't know any women who aren't Sherlock Holmes fans, so I'll imply they don't exist!

I don't know any women who don't make Star Trek jokes, so I'll imply they don't exist!

You know, on reflection, my social circle and family are a bunch of nerds.

(Reply to this)


 
   
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