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Yeah Yeah Beebiss I ([info]harrylovesron) wrote in [info]unfunny_fandom,
@ 2011-07-02 14:16:00


Previous Entry  Add to memories!  Tell a Friend!  Next Entry
I'm putting this behind a cut due to anti-semitic and Nazi imagery and apologism for said anti-semitic imagery.

I am completely unfamiliar with the series myself, but in short, Axis Powers Hetalia is a webcomic/manga/anime series that depicts history in the form of personified countries. Here's The TVTropes page.

The fandom has been in the unfunny spotlight several times (see: a group of Hetalia cosplayers doing a Nazi salute at Anime Boston), and here's another mindblowing example.

I am not sure which character(s) these folks are cosplaying, but that's irrelevant in the face of the fact that they were photographed POINTING GUNS AT a depiction of a Star of David.

Let that sink in for a moment.

A Tumblr user named yumikarp, who has since deleted their entire Tumblr, has been quoted in reblogs defending said cosplayers:

This is called art.
I see nothing wrong in it, they are just living into their roles and doing what history has told. I have nothing against Jews, not at all, but I see nothing wrong in this because there is nothing wrong of it.
Sheesh, it’s like the over-religious people being all against that photographer woman who made pictures of Jesus being gay and having group sex. She didn’t do it without a meaning, and it wasn’t a racist meaning of any kind. It’s called art.
This is just the same.
These two people might actually be Jews themselves, who knows.
All they’re doing is making a scene of what history has told in the past.
The end.
Why take it so personal?
Why so serious?


One of the Cosplayers also tries to defend the photo as a "joke".

Hello, I’m Prussia in this photo.

This was just for a joke and very casual, because that place isn’t a church or anything related… just toilets’s park. LOL

The ORIGINAL pic is in Deviantart and mature CENSORED for obvious reasons. The other place is Photobucket, an album made for the ones that were in this photoshot. We didn’t want to offend anyone.


---

Impossible is nothing xDD Really I don’t care about what can people say about a photo that supposely we offense Jews, my mind is clear, since beginning that photo was just a joke, nothing serious and in a non-sacred place (oh well, maybe park’s toilets are sacred after a “bad meal” <33) Anyway <333 Relax yourself, if we have to be this point almost all hetalia’s fandom is historycally offensive. xDDD

Finally, and advertisment <333 ~ Use copyright in photos, because you’ll never expect who wants to fight or be a jerk <33


Because adding hearts and "XD" faces totally makes it better amirite?


(Post a new comment)


[info]ninwhore
2011-07-02 09:28 pm UTC (link)
WHY DO PEOPLE THINK THIS IS OK

(Reply to this)


[info]cmdr_zoom
2011-07-02 09:42 pm UTC (link)
*facepalm*

(Reply to this)

Let me put this in a way they'll understand:
[info]nifflet
2011-07-02 09:46 pm UTC (link)
Hey people, when your XD joke at the expense of an entire population makes everyone all o.O, :|, and DDD:, maybe it's not as :) as you think it is.
<3,
Nifflet

(Reply to this)

*dons art major glasses*
[info]tehrin
2011-07-02 10:05 pm UTC (link)
Ok, claiming "art for art's sake" because someone says it is art post facto, according to the post-modern theory of what art is, doesn't erase the fact that it's antisemitic nor support the argument because it was not created to be art. To give some examples: If a swastika is painted on the window of a Jewish bookstore (like I saw earlier this year in a neighboring city) and someone claimed it was art after the fact, it would still be antisemitic in intent and made to hurt, not to make art. Nor would be the group photos white supremacists took with the bodies of lynching victims post-mortum be art. Nor would singing racist songs at Southern political rallies during Antebellum be art.

With that said, I don't think the cosplayers took the photo with art in mind thus it was not created to be art. Thus negating the point of calling it art after the fact. They may not have meant to be antisemitic, but anyone with a brain who lives in this century could have seen the meaning of doing what they did volunteered to say "Hey, this is a bad idea. Let's not do it." But no one did and it made them complicate in consciously creating the racist image. Even if they were in the spirit of portraying the characters, it is not excusable. "I'm not racist or antisemitic, but it was only cosplay" does not excuse creating a racist act or photo. Portraying a character from an anime with historical themes may not be racist, but that doesn't make what they did not racist. Someone can also claim provocateur-ship, but that doesn't make them less racist or less of an asshole.

The Holocaust/s and other ethnic genocides are not to be taken lightly. My family is still affected by it and so are other families and peoples.

(Reply to this)(Thread)

Re: *dons art major glasses*
[info]rosehiptea
2011-07-02 10:18 pm UTC (link)
I'm not an expert on art theory myself, but I personally think people are allowed to be offended by something even if it's art. I agree that calling a photo of cosplayers clowning around "art" is pretty debatable. But even if you want to define art as "something somebody says is art" and include virtually anything, it doesn't make whatever it is automatically OK. I've never quite understood that argument.

I'm sure I could find any number of examples of something that's pretty undeniably "art" but I think whoever created it should have thought twice and done something else. (Being generous, here.)

(Reply to this)(Parent)(Thread)

Re: *dons art major glasses* - [info]tehrin, 2011-07-02 10:24 pm UTC
Re: *dons art major glasses* - [info]rosehiptea, 2011-07-02 11:00 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]ninwhore, 2011-07-02 10:33 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]rosehiptea, 2011-07-02 10:58 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]ninwhore, 2011-07-02 11:34 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]sepiamagpie, 2011-07-03 12:14 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]beccastareyes, 2011-07-03 04:08 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]cmdr_zoom, 2011-07-03 04:16 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]littleshebear, 2011-07-03 05:26 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]napalmnacey, 2011-07-04 05:47 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]t_boy, 2011-07-03 04:50 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]sandglass, 2011-07-03 06:08 pm UTC
Re: *dons art major glasses*
[info]sandglass
2011-07-03 01:19 am UTC (link)
I wish people would stop using the "It's art!" defense for everything. Yes, art definitely deserves extra leeway, but art deserves extra leeway because of its ability to offer insight, criticism, perspective, philosophy, etc, and in ways that other ways of expression just can't. But this (and 99% of the time this defense comes up) doesn't do that!

Their defense seems to be "It reflects the past" which is fair, but this isn't a neglected part of the past. We all know Nazi Germany was antisemitic. They're not offering anything new, or even anything relevant. They're just going, "Look, we dressed up as antisemitic characters and are doing an antisemitic thing!"

Plus, an important part of art is the ability to then criticize it. A huge part of art is getting a reaction, even if the reaction is, "We do not accept this in our society." Offensive art can make us more moral people through our offense and rejection of the art.

(Reply to this)(Parent)


[info]rosehiptea
2011-07-02 10:12 pm UTC (link)
I see nothing wrong in it, they are just living into their roles and doing what history has told.

It's totally educational you guys!

The ORIGINAL pic is in Deviantart and mature CENSORED for obvious reasons.

That magically makes everything inoffensive, I guess. I'm going to try that next time.

(Reply to this)


[info]hadesphoenix
2011-07-02 10:25 pm UTC (link)
1. The original is censored for 'obvious reasons.'
2. The cosplayers don't see a reason to be offended by the picture.

Flawless logic.

(Reply to this)


[info]the__ivorytower
2011-07-02 10:31 pm UTC (link)
Dear Some Hetalia Fans,

Stop making me embarrassed to admit I like APH, even if it's problematic at times. The concept is neat. You're doing it wrong.

Signed,
IT

(Dear writer of APH - You could be somewhat less racist when you're coming up with your depictions of countries by having 'representative characters' that aren't actually representative of the whole population. - IT)

(Reply to this)(Thread)


[info]veneotaqueen
2011-07-03 03:53 am UTC (link)
Can I add my signature to your letter? Because I can't give you a cake over the internet.

(Reply to this)(Parent)


[info]bandit
2011-07-03 04:25 am UTC (link)
Or, you know, by not ignoring underprivileged countries. He could also be less sexist by making most of the countries be represented by males, among other things. To me personally, Hetalia is problematic ALL the time.

(Reply to this)(Parent)(Thread)

(no subject) - [info]the__ivorytower, 2011-07-03 05:52 am UTC
(no subject) - janegray, 2011-07-03 01:09 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]digigirl132, 2011-07-03 05:40 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]bandit, 2011-07-03 08:04 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]eclatante, 2011-07-04 01:34 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]bandit, 2011-07-04 01:59 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]eclatante, 2011-07-04 02:06 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]bandit, 2011-07-04 02:48 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]eclatante, 2011-07-04 02:55 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]chikane, 2011-07-04 08:20 am UTC

[info]aurussteelsword
2011-07-03 05:24 am UTC (link)
This. I'm pretty tired of the webcomic that I read for fun's sake becoming a source of shame and headdesking.

(Reply to this)(Parent)


[info]rubymellon
2011-07-02 11:19 pm UTC (link)
Hetalia is the fucking worst.

(Reply to this)


[info]sepiamagpie
2011-07-02 11:25 pm UTC (link)
I'm never going to understand this weird thing that people have that no one can call them on their stupid stuff because they liked it when they made it. Okay, I'm mostly thinking of a specific webcomicker who loses his shit whenever someone goes 'that's not funny', but I FEEL IT APPLIES SO OFTEN IN LIFE.

On the internet, anyway. Which is kind of like life? A distorted funhouse mirror of life where there's sonic the hedgehog porn hidden in the corners like spiders.

There's a spider in the corner of the room above my head and I can't reach it to kill it :(

(Reply to this)(Thread)


[info]rosehiptea
2011-07-03 12:00 am UTC (link)
I'm never going to understand this weird thing that people have that no one can call them on their stupid stuff because they liked it when they made it.

I'll never get that either. It's like fanficcers who defend something by saying they wrote it in thirty minutes. Oh, well, OK then!

A distorted funhouse mirror of life where there's sonic the hedgehog porn hidden in the corners like spiders.

I love this.

(Reply to this)(Parent)

(no subject) - [info]harrylovesron, 2011-07-03 03:14 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]lilychan, 2011-07-04 03:47 am UTC

[info]argylespy
2011-07-03 01:35 am UTC (link)
Relax yourself, if we have to be this point almost all hetalia’s fandom is historycally offensive. xDDD

Well, at least they admit it.

(No, seriously, I know they're not ALL this stupid, it's just that the stupid ones get more press.)

(Reply to this)


[info]duraniedrama
2011-07-03 02:25 am UTC (link)
Damn you for that TVTropes link. There went my entire fucking Saturday.

(Sheesh.)

(Reply to this)


[info]iamnotyourmuse
2011-07-03 02:49 am UTC (link)
My boss suggested that we host a Hetalia cosplay day at the library I work at. I struggled to explain to her just why that would be an incredibly horrible idea that we don't want any responsibility for. She countered that her teenage daughter loves the show and told her people do really amazing costumes and this year's summer reading theme is all to do with travel and multiculturalism so it would fit right in, right?

I was so tempted to just start mailing her unfunny links. This sort of shit is why I told her if she wanted to do it I wanted no part in it. All it would take would be one jackass fan and from what I can tell they travel in packs.

(Reply to this)(Thread)

(no subject) - [info]harrylovesron, 2011-07-03 02:59 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]harrylovesron, 2011-07-03 03:04 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]iamnotyourmuse, 2011-07-03 03:06 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]harrylovesron, 2011-07-03 03:10 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]iamnotyourmuse, 2011-07-03 03:18 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]harrylovesron, 2011-07-03 03:39 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]iamnotyourmuse, 2011-07-03 03:44 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]harrylovesron, 2011-07-03 03:53 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]iamnotyourmuse, 2011-07-03 04:03 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]harrylovesron, 2011-07-03 04:18 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]iamnotyourmuse, 2011-07-03 04:26 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]harrylovesron, 2011-07-03 04:28 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]iamnotyourmuse, 2011-07-03 04:31 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]platedlizard, 2011-07-04 03:24 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]full_metal_ox, 2011-07-05 11:51 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]platedlizard, 2011-07-06 02:19 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]full_metal_ox, 2011-07-06 03:01 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]bigbigtruck, 2011-07-06 05:32 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]full_metal_ox, 2011-07-06 10:08 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]full_metal_ox, 2011-07-05 11:58 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]cmdr_zoom, 2011-07-03 04:05 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]keri, 2011-07-03 03:14 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]harrylovesron, 2011-07-03 03:22 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]full_metal_ox, 2011-07-05 11:44 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]lied_ohne_worte, 2011-07-06 05:11 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]cygnia, 2011-07-03 03:27 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]iamnotyourmuse, 2011-07-03 03:32 am UTC

[info]t_boy
2011-07-03 04:39 am UTC (link)
It doesn't bode well when I see, "due to anti-semitic and Nazi imagery and apologism" and I think, "Great, Hetalia again is it?"

(Reply to this)(Thread)

(no subject) - [info]rosehiptea, 2011-07-03 05:11 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]full_metal_ox, 2011-07-06 12:00 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]rosehiptea, 2011-07-06 03:59 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]sepiamagpie, 2011-07-03 06:00 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]kumquat_of_doom, 2011-07-07 12:10 am UTC

[info]sisterelwood
2011-07-03 07:52 am UTC (link)
*looks at picture*looks at those defending it*

Pro-tip: When you feel the need to repeatedly defend yourself it usually means you DO think you did something wrong.

(Reply to this)


[info]chikane
2011-07-03 03:13 pm UTC (link)
Is it art? Yes. Of course it's art. The method behind its creation is art by definition regardless of content.

Art, however, does not excuse everything. This, for example, is inexcuseable. It is shitty art.


Also, is it just me or is the "xDD" and "<333" stuff making her apology seem so, so, SO much worse?

(Reply to this)(Thread)

(no subject) - [info]hallidae, 2011-07-03 06:53 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]harrylovesron, 2011-07-04 03:21 am UTC

[info]platedlizard
2011-07-04 03:00 am UTC (link)
Every time i think about maaaaybe sticking my toe in this fandom something like this happens. Are there any any series like this without the douchbag fans? The concept seems interesting, but dear FSM, the fans are more than enough to put me off.

(Reply to this)(Thread)

(no subject) - [info]harrylovesron, 2011-07-04 03:16 am UTC

[info]phosfate
2011-07-05 03:43 pm UTC (link)
Relax yourself, if we have to be this point almost all hetalia’s fandom is historycally offensive. xDDD

Well, yes. Your point?

(Reply to this)


[info]bof
2011-07-06 12:16 pm UTC (link)
Why take it so personal?
Why so serious?


Well, I think treating hatred that actively harms other human beings as a joke is insensitive and horrible.

(Reply to this)(Thread)

(no subject) - [info]full_metal_ox, 2011-07-06 09:42 pm UTC

[info]female_fanboy
2011-07-07 12:09 am UTC (link)

Sheesh, it’s like the over-religious people being all against that photographer woman who made pictures of Jesus being gay and having group sex. She didn’t do it without a meaning, and it wasn’t a racist meaning of any kind. It’s called art.
This is just the same.




You know, I'm pretty fucking sure people are allowed to be offended by art, especially if that are is - oh, I don't know - trivializing the fucking Holocaust

Just sayin'

(Reply to this)


 
   
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