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theninth
2011-07-11 11:39 pm UTC (link)

Am I the only person in the world who doesn't care if someone messes with geography for the purpose of a book or a TV show? I mean clearly it's not Chicago As We Know it. I don't care if he moves locations around.

As for everything else that's wrong, I just assume it's the character's flaws and keep going. Butcher should've just said "I am not a wizard named Harry who lives in Chicago" and shut the hell up.

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	rosehiptea 2011-07-11 11:47 pm UTC (link)
	That depends on what you mean. If someone wants to put Disneyland in Los Angeles (not a real example) I'll just roll my eyes and live with it, generally. But describing neighborhoods as being really lousy is obviously a more sensitive issue. (Not saying you don't realize that.) (Reply to this)(Parent)(Thread)

	theninth 2011-07-12 12:11 am UTC (link)
	Even that doesn't bother me because I'm not going to base my perception of a neighborhood on fantasy. (Reply to this)(Parent)

eleutheria
2011-07-12 12:45 am UTC (link)

IDK, I don't mind when people take liberties and they know it. I've read at least one book where the author put in a forward saying "hey, I know this is wrong, but I'm doing it for plot reasons. Apologies for moving the geography around a bit."

I mind a lot more when it's something that a ten-minute Google or Wikipedia would have prevented (or even just having a local look it over) and it's really clear that the author just doesn't know any better. Then it's careless and sloppy, and it bugs me a little-- at least, enough to laugh at it (X-Files, I'll never forget that Metro station in Georgetown, that was a hoot!). OTOH, sensitive things like this, where you're basically slamming people's homes because of privilege + don'tgiveashititis, that's worse.

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sistercoyote
2011-07-12 01:37 am UTC (link)

For you it's the X-files, for me it's been a couple of issues of Bones; the first where they went to the "Pacific Northwest" (Season 1; I think they were supposed to be in Seattle, maybe?) and one of the segments opened up with a long-shot of FREAKING HALF-DOME (WTF NO, editor); the other was something that probably only a native Angeleno with a bad habit of visiting amusement parks would have noticed the subway Sweets found himself in when the "earthquake" happened was rather obviously the "Earthquake!" portion of the Universal Studios Tour....

Still, though...

OTOH, sensitive things like this, where you're basically slamming people's homes because of privilege + don'tgiveashititis, that's worse.

Much, much worse.

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	rosehiptea 2011-07-12 04:53 am UTC (link)
	Speaking of things Angelenos recognize in Bones, isn't the outside of their "Smithsonian" actually the back of the Natural History Museum? It's been a while since I've seen it though, and they may be using a different shot now. (Reply to this)(Parent)(Thread)

	sistercoyote 2011-07-12 05:17 pm UTC (link)
	Do you know, I've never been to the Natural History Museum in L.A.? Now, if you asked me to identify the Steinhart/Natural History Museum/Cal Sciences, that I could do -- go figure. That said, though, it wouldn't surprise me in the least. I'm pretty sure they used the Rose Garden at USC (which is absolutely gorgeous) in at least one ep. (Reply to this)(Parent)

ladyvorkosigan
2011-07-13 04:15 pm UTC (link)

Bones is hilarious in terms of DC geography too. They had a whole episode centered in "Kalorama Park" showing it with street performers and artists - my mom asked if we could go there when she visited and I was like "Uhh, it's that patch of grass right around the corner from where I used to live - we walked through it all the time."

To say nothing of the fact that they photoshop the Washington Monument into random spots.

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	ekaterinv 2011-07-12 07:59 am UTC (link)
	The X-Files treated Michigan as if it were straight out of Deliverance. Also they made a reference to the supposed infamous "Michigan mud", which was ridiculous enough to diffuse my anger at the rest of it. (Reply to this)(Parent)

sgaana
2011-07-12 07:48 pm UTC (link)

The X-Files episode supposedly set in Atlantic City, NJ was a real thigh-slapper for anyone familiar with the area.

(I remember they had the forest of the "Pine Barrens" -- being played, of course, by the entirely-different-looking tall, straight pines of the Pacific NW -- running right up to the city limits. This is... difficult, as Atlantic City is in fact an island, and the forest stops quite a long way inland to make way for extensive salt marshes that give out into the bay that separates the mainland from Atlantic City itself. Good times.)

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silrana
2011-07-12 09:19 pm UTC (link)

Living in Florida, I've gotten used to bizarre geography in the media. Tourists are frequently baffled to discover that Disney World, Daytona Beach and Miami aren't all within a ten minute drive of each other, because that's how it looks on TV and movies. People who work at the Disney hotel reservation phone line will tell you that they constantly get requests for rooms with an oceanfront view.

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	full_metal_ox 2011-07-13 12:35 am UTC (link)
	And have you ever seen cattle ranching--an industry in which the Sunshine State is second only to Texas--used as an offhand bit of Florida local color? (Reply to this)(Parent)(Thread)

	silrana 2011-07-13 02:11 am UTC (link)
	Of course not. We're wall to wall orange groves, everyone knows that. (Reply to this)(Parent)(Thread)

full_metal_ox
2011-07-15 01:47 am UTC (link)

And where are the interminable roadside stretches of scrub forest? And the curtains of Spanish moss, a plant not exclusive to the Spooky Voodoo-Haunted Louisiana Bayou (which is an unfortunate trope package all its own, of course.)

And I would pass out from sheer delight to see big honking school-bus-yellow grasshoppers--with pink wings, yet!--as a bit of Florida local color.

(I'm not a Floridian, but I have a lot of family there.)

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silrana
2011-07-15 04:35 pm UTC (link)

Burn Notice, which is set in Miami, comes to mind as one of the very few that gets it right. Outside-the-city scenes actually haves the roads with scrub pines and mangy brush that you see so often.

Of course, you usually don't see much Spanish Moss except in rural and wilder areas, because any native or longtime resident knows to cut it out of their trees. It is a parasite that eventually kills the host tree, so you don't see it much in the burbs. Well, except in the yards of the northern transplants who think it looks romantic.

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evilsqueakers
2011-07-13 08:54 pm UTC (link)

Please see Matlock episodes of Atlanta.

Palm trees, oceans in the background, big concrete monolithic buildings in the 80s and 90s off of downtown Peachtree? Not reaaaaallly problem when you're 4 hours from the nearest beach. Whether it's NC or Los Angeles...not reaaaallly the same geography.

I'm rather used to the crappy research. Of course, this was pre-internet. But still. Doesn't mean that nowadays there aren't amazing resources to find. For instance, finding a writer buddy that lives in Chicago to give you some details about basic things.

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	duraniedrama 2011-07-15 03:53 pm UTC (link)
	My friend who grew up in Savannah found the film version of Midnight in the Garden of Good and Evil terribly disorienting. Even though it was shot in Savannah, people kept opening the door on the outside of one building and then closing it on the interior of a completely different one. (Reply to this)(Parent)(Thread)

	evilsqueakers 2011-07-16 06:37 am UTC (link)
	Then there's the One Tree Hill episode where a setting NC is supposed to be SCAD...and you know it's not. By any means, considering I've a friend at SCAD that completely laughed out loud at. Savannah shouldn't be that hard to map out or use. It's so teeny. (Reply to this)(Parent)

	re_weird 2011-07-23 05:20 am UTC (link)
	Almost everything set in San Francisco does this. They drive in four different neighborhoods in 5 minutes! ~~and instantly get parking how~~ (Reply to this)(Parent)

sandglass
2011-07-12 04:01 am UTC (link)

Well, like someone said, he could have picked a city he knows well, like Milwaukee, or even a nameless city or made up one close to another, a la Metropolis and Gotham. He picked Chicago, so he is responsible for either researching (or coping with the criticism that he's getting it wrong). If he wants to put a real name on things, he should put in the necessary work to have it accurate, because real people live in real places.

Then, there's the issue that there's no reason why his Chicago should be lacking black people, or the other issues.

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shadwing
2011-07-12 11:15 pm UTC (link)

The books were originally set in Kansas City a town Jim knows well since he lives close by. But TPTB stated "Oh no that's too close to St Louis! And Laurell K Hamiliton's (NYT Best Seller..at the time...Writer of the Anita Blake Books) turf setting you have to change it, NOW" He glanced at a Map and picked Chicago at random with little or no time to fill in the blanks or research.

Jim's pretty open to crit, however I don't think F-Bombs are appro for Con-Crit and yeah I think there is MORE than enough fail to go around. The original blogger and Jim's reactions

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	sandglass 2011-07-13 12:01 am UTC (link)
	He could have researched after, at least. Or not been a privileged failbag. The original complaint was never meant to be concrit, just someone venting about something racist. (Reply to this)(Parent)

	seiberwing 2011-07-12 06:53 am UTC (link)
	But it's technically supposed to be Chicago As We Know It But With Magic. (Reply to this)(Parent)

	dunmurderin 2011-07-13 01:45 am UTC (link)
	If it was a case of him fictionalizing an existing neighborhood, ehhhh, no prob. But switching the names of existing neighborhoods seemingly at random is just...lazy. (Reply to this)(Parent)

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