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well, at least she's a good-looking spy ([info]blue_penguin) wrote in [info]unfunny_fandom,
@ 2011-09-24 16:54:00


Previous Entry  Add to memories!  Tell a Friend!  Next Entry
"Gay comics characters don't look gay enough!"
This has been making the fandom rounds, but I haven't seen it here yet, so here goes:

Brett Booth and Scott Lobdell, the team behind the relaunch of Teen Titans, have decided to add a new gay character to the team. Cool, right?

Unfortunately, Booth's comments on the reasoning behind this decision are somewhat less cool. A few choice quotes:

I’ve seen all the other gay superheroes out there, Ok maybe not all. They look just like regular heterosexuals, they act like regular heterosexuals, they just happen to have sex with people of their own gender, under the covers and in the dark. Sure you might get a kiss on a page, but that’s all (an no we won’t be doing any sex scenes in TT, get your minds OUT of the gutters

We wanted to show an interesting character who’s homosexuality is part of him, not something that’s hidden.


[...]

As for the children.. Most simply don’t know or don’t care. It’s not like Migg’s is going to be doing a one man gay pride parade. I don’t think we even mention that he’s gay, you see him, you know it, no need to harp on about it. He’s just a happy fun loving guy! He won’t be wearing anything that I haven’t seen at Walmart. Well maybe Target;)

Which (a) has the unpleasant implication that gay characters (and indeed actual gay people) are Not Gay Enough unless they fit certain stereotypes and (b) leads to concerns that the character in question may be written as a sort of sexless Gay Best Friend type who you "know" is gay not because he expresses any interest in men, but because he's effeminate. Fun!

This RPG.net thread has a good discussion of it (turning partway into a discussion of comics characters who were conceived as queer vs. ones that were retconned to be, but that's interesting too!); it's also been posted on inclusive_geeks on LJ. (Those are the only places I've seen it, but if anyone has more links, by all means let me know!)


(Post a new comment)


[info]cyan_aura
2011-09-25 05:58 pm UTC (link)
Why does this remind me of when they did the Millennium series, and they had Harbinger locate ten people around the world to become the New Guardians, and they got this flamboyantly gay South American guy who dressed in purple and oh btw turned out to be HIV positive?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Millennium_%28comics%29

in the picture on the right, note the guy on the left side of the page at the top. With a pompadour, no less!

Seriously, I like retro too but not back to 1987 please.

(Reply to this)(Thread)


[info]seiberwing
2011-09-25 08:16 pm UTC (link)
On the other hand, they had a supervillain who was powered by cocaine.

(Reply to this)(Parent)(Thread)

(no subject) - [info]sadisticferret, 2011-09-25 08:20 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]sistercoyote, 2011-09-26 02:45 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]rosehiptea, 2011-09-26 09:58 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]arachnejericho, 2011-10-04 09:49 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]arachnejericho, 2011-10-04 09:54 pm UTC

[info]cmdr_zoom
2011-09-25 10:40 pm UTC (link)
I don't even have to look; I remember it.

"See, his name means 'strange' in Spanish, and that's why he's queer! Also, the Japanese guy talks to computers, and the Chinese woman is a mystic who works with the Earth's "Dragon Lines"..."

Team Stereotype is GO!

(Reply to this)(Parent)(Thread)

(no subject) - [info]seiberwing, 2011-09-27 05:37 pm UTC

[info]bemysty
2011-09-26 04:08 am UTC (link)
Obviously it's now my duty to link Linkara's review of the New Guardians issue with the aforementioned villain fueled by cocaine.

(Reply to this)(Parent)


[info]airawyn
2011-09-25 06:37 pm UTC (link)
I'm holding onto the (extremely unlikely) hope that this character's being introduced to be a love interest for Tim Drake and the poor boy can finally come out of the closet.

Although after reading Lobdell's Red Hood and the Outlaws this week, I'm terrified of how bad Teen Titans is going to be.

(Reply to this)


[info]the__ivorytower
2011-09-25 06:37 pm UTC (link)
They look just like regular heterosexuals, they act like regular heterosexuals, they just happen to have sex with people of their own gender, under the covers and in the dark.

WELL WHY DO YOU THINK THAT MAY BE?

DO YOU THINK IT MAY POSSIBLY BE BECAUSE GAY PEOPLE ARE LIKE ANYONE ELSE? THAT YOU DO NOT WEAR YOUR SEXUALITY ON YOUR SLEEVE?

Excuse me while I go mutter to myself.

(Reply to this)(Thread)


[info]seiberwing
2011-09-25 09:05 pm UTC (link)
While I've probably said all I need to say in the i_g post, I'll add that I take high offense to the idea that those of us who don't ping gaydar at a thousand paces are somehow repressed or hiding ourselves.

Some of us flame. Some of us smoulder. And to be honest, sexuality doesn't matter for either.

(Reply to this)(Parent)(Thread)

(no subject) - [info]phosfate, 2011-10-03 11:42 pm UTC

[info]chikane
2011-09-25 07:01 pm UTC (link)
They look just like regular heterosexuals, they act like regular heterosexuals, they just happen to have sex with people of their own gender, under the covers and in the dark.

Emphasis mine.

Insert (Picard facepalm.jpg) here.

Regular people = hetero, gotcha. Thanks but no thanks, douche.

(Reply to this)(Thread)


[info]cmdr_zoom
2011-09-25 08:34 pm UTC (link)
Heterosexual white males are the "average", the standard against which all others are measured as deviations therefrom.

(Reply to this)(Parent)


[info]spawn_of_kong
2011-09-25 10:28 pm UTC (link)
Not Picard, but hopefully this icon will suffice.

(Reply to this)(Parent)


[info]ekaterinv
2011-09-26 02:18 am UTC (link)
Also, this is a side issue, but it looks like they're saying "regular heterosexuals" have sex under the covers and in the dark. Um wut. Issues, they have them.

(Reply to this)(Parent)(Thread)

(no subject) - [info]chikane, 2011-09-26 11:23 am UTC

[info]seca
2011-09-25 07:32 pm UTC (link)
I would like to know what happened to Scott Lobdell. I mean he was the one who wrote the Alpha Flight issue Northstar came out in and it was a good story whose main focus was bringing up that AIDS wasn't a "gay illness".

Honestly I'm beginning to think the Scott Lobdell of recent years isn't the same one from the 90s, as I like his older work but the stuff he writes nowadays are the kind of things that make me avoid picking up comic books again.

(Reply to this)(Thread)


[info]kumquat_of_doom
2011-09-25 08:42 pm UTC (link)
MTE.

*uses oblig. Northstar icon*

Incidentally, any idea what's happened with Northstar lately? I've pretty much given up on comics so I've not been keeping up.

(Reply to this)(Parent)(Thread)

(no subject) - [info]seca, 2011-09-26 02:13 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]female_fanboy, 2011-09-27 10:28 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]anarchicq, 2011-09-25 11:07 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]seca, 2011-09-26 02:15 am UTC

[info]female_fanboy
2011-09-25 07:40 pm UTC (link)
I’ve seen all the other gay superheroes out there, Ok maybe not all. They look just like regular heterosexuals, they act like regular heterosexuals, they just happen to have sex with people of their own gender

The nerve of those gays, acting like they can go out in public without lisping and wearing feather boas. Don't they know it's the only way people can tell they're gay?

*facepalm*

One of these days, straight white people will realize they don't have a monopoly on "normal".

(Reply to this)


[info]quantumreality
2011-09-25 08:07 pm UTC (link)
Honestly, I like that they're putting the gay character in at all, and I think these guys just have a really poor way of getting it across. Their comment seems like the kind of bog-standard thing a straight guy might say who believes he's pretty open-minded, but doesn't quite get it yet that the way he comes off is dismissive rather than supportive.

On the whole, I will be squinty like my icon right now.

(Reply to this)(Thread)

(no subject) - [info]seiberwing, 2011-09-25 08:51 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]quantumreality, 2011-09-25 09:02 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]seiberwing, 2011-09-25 09:08 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]sandglass, 2011-09-26 06:44 am UTC

[info]sandglass
2011-09-25 08:17 pm UTC (link)
I am so far past being happy about the mere presence of a gay person in media, so I'll just be over here, seething at them.

How homophobic do you have to be for this to be a good idea?

(Reply to this)(Thread)

(no subject) - [info]seiberwing, 2011-09-25 09:00 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]sandglass, 2011-09-25 09:06 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]seiberwing, 2011-09-25 09:09 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]sandglass, 2011-09-25 09:11 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]seiberwing, 2011-09-25 09:14 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]sandglass, 2011-09-25 09:18 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]seiberwing, 2011-09-25 09:23 pm UTC
Reposted for clarity - [info]sandglass, 2011-09-25 09:43 pm UTC
Re: Reposted for clarity - [info]seiberwing, 2011-09-25 09:44 pm UTC
Re: Reposted for clarity - [info]sandglass, 2011-09-25 09:44 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]spawn_of_kong, 2011-09-25 10:45 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]sandglass, 2011-09-25 11:05 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]mmanurere, 2011-09-27 10:30 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]cmdr_zoom, 2011-09-25 10:26 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]spawn_of_kong, 2011-09-25 10:36 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]ekaterinv, 2011-09-26 01:41 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]white_tean, 2011-09-27 01:33 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]white_tean, 2011-09-27 01:32 pm UTC

[info]rosehiptea
2011-09-25 09:43 pm UTC (link)
When I first heard it, I thought it was something like "It's OK to be gay no matter how you express it" which is not a bad thing per se. But reading what he actually has to say it just sounds awful, like "It's OK to be gay only if you are flamboyant and you don't otherwise talk about it." Which is horrible and actually is an idea that has actually been around for ages in media.

(Reply to this)(Thread)

(no subject) - [info]ekaterinv, 2011-09-26 01:46 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]rosehiptea, 2011-09-26 02:33 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]sandglass, 2011-09-26 06:31 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]la_fono, 2011-09-26 02:29 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]rosehiptea, 2011-09-26 02:34 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]cygnia, 2011-09-26 05:02 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]sandglass, 2011-09-26 06:41 am UTC

[info]la_fono
2011-09-26 02:19 am UTC (link)
...He's called Bunker? Eeh, maybe it's my way of classifying words for 'places to hide in', but I keep coming back to "What, was Closet taken?".

(Reply to this)(Thread)

(no subject) - [info]tehrin, 2011-09-26 03:41 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]la_fono, 2011-09-26 03:49 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]blue_penguin, 2011-09-26 04:12 am UTC

[info]tehrin
2011-09-26 03:42 am UTC (link)
This is going to hurt. :(

(Reply to this)


[info]maverickz3r0
2011-09-26 04:53 am UTC (link)
Huh. This is pretty awful and the back of my brain is fuming and going 'this is absolutely ridiculous what the hell is wrong with these people' but then I was distracted by the bad grammar in the quoted parts. Misspelled 'and', didn't end the parentheses, it's whose not 'who's,' ellipses are three dots and periods are one and there's no reason to have just two anywhere, unless the guy's name is Migg's then you shouldn't have is after it again because that's a tautology, blerg blerg blerg grammar part of my brain please shut up so I can be properly infuriated by all this fuckery.

Okay sorry. Proper reaction time. *ahem*

What.

Seriously. Comics guys. Hey comics guys! I thought you were cool. Why so uncool?

(Reply to this)


[info]female_fanboy
2011-09-26 07:15 am UTC (link)
Having looked at what Miguel's plainclothes look like, I have come to the conclusion that Booth and Lobdel do not have the same definition of flamboyant as the rest of the world does.

You see, their definition is "has a fauxhawk and wears a sweater vest over a pink Hawaiian shirt" -- which isn't most people's definition of flamboyant so much as it's their definition of terrible fashion sense

Observe:

(Reply to this)(Thread)

(no subject) - [info]ekaterinv, 2011-09-26 07:28 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]the__ivorytower, 2011-09-26 03:23 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]hydriotaphia, 2011-09-28 05:58 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]looking_glass, 2011-09-26 04:15 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]gerorin, 2011-09-28 04:56 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]cygnia, 2011-09-26 10:33 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]sgaana, 2011-09-27 04:58 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]mmanurere, 2011-09-27 10:33 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]sadisticferret, 2011-09-27 03:03 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]anarchicq, 2011-09-27 08:42 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]franzen, 2011-09-28 06:16 pm UTC

[info]misachan
2011-09-26 06:38 pm UTC (link)
My teeth grind every time someone frets about "the children" making the shocking discovery that gay people exist. As if there aren't gay kids reading these comics, too.

(Reply to this)(Thread)

(no subject) - [info]cmdr_zoom, 2011-09-26 08:31 pm UTC

[info]obsidianwolf
2011-09-26 07:00 pm UTC (link)
Well first off it is nice to get another gay character in comics. Of course the fact that based on those and other interviews the character will just be a walking collection of stereotypes kills any enthusiasm I had for the character.

I'm also pretty sure that since he's in a team book with popular established characters that he basically exist just to kill fan speculation about any of the bigger name characters being LBGT in the reboot.

I doubt he'll get much in the way of actual development.

(Reply to this)(Thread)

(no subject) - [info]franzen, 2011-09-28 06:18 pm UTC

[info]mmanurere
2011-09-27 10:28 am UTC (link)
They look just like regular heterosexuals, they act like regular heterosexuals, they just happen to have sex with people of their own gender, under the covers and in the dark. Sure you might get a kiss on a page, but that’s all (an no we won’t be doing any sex scenes in TT, get your minds OUT of the gutters

We wanted to show an interesting character who’s homosexuality is part of him, not something that’s hidden.


In other words:

"Sure, we could have a gay character just be gay in that real-world 'is attracted to people of the same sex' sense of the word -- but that wouldn't be keeping it real enough, so we're going to see how many stereotypes we can shove into one character." Silly me, here I was thinking that it was my liking cock that marked me as gay, with my general flaminess being perhaps a hint as to said trait. But no, these straight men have enlightened me: if I'm gay, I must fit a very narrow and asexualized stereotype for the entertainment of straight people! After all, that's what being gay is all about -- just ask the straight comics-people who have decided that I exist for their amusement!

(Reply to this)


[info]airawyn
2011-09-28 06:41 pm UTC (link)
DC is doing a market research survey, so it's a good time to tell them what you think.

(Reply to this)


 
   
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