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Like a book club, except with more sex! ([info]notjo) wrote in [info]unfunnybusiness,
@ 2009-04-12 11:05:00


Previous Entry  Add to memories!  Tell a Friend!  Next Entry
Amazon thinks you should be protected from GLTB novels
I got this from [info]rydra_wong here:

Amazon is stripping the sales ranks from GLBT books, thus preventing them from showing up in some bestseller lists and searches (and potentially directly damaging their sales), on the grounds that they are "adult" material.

(This is regardless of whether they contain any explicit sex. Meanwhile, books with explicit heterosexual sex scenes retain their sales rank, as long as they're not overtly marketed as "erotica".)


More details here

ETA:
A petition
Twitter - #amazonfail
Roundup Post, includes posts linking to what books are losing their sales ratings.
Contact Amazon's exec customer service dept at ecr@amazon.com to let them know what you think. Customer service phone number is 1-800-201-7575

From [info]arionhunter in the comments, FYI: Not only LGBT books are going under - feminist and general sexuality books are having their ranks stripped as well. Oh, those silly disabled people, trying to be intimate like the rest of us.

[I own that book linked. It's one of the few books that explicitly talks about sex for PWD and includes sections on kink.]

ETA 2:

Amazon Blames Glitch, blah blah. The PW site went down about five minutes after it hit twitter, so here is the text:

Amazon Says Glitch to Blame for "New" Adult Policy
By Rachel Deahl & Jim Milliot -- Publishers Weekly, 4/12/2009 5:49:00 PM

A groundswell of outrage, concern and confusion sprang up over the weekend, largely via Twitter, in response to what authors and others believed was a decision by Amazon to remove adult titles from its sales ranking. On Sunday evening, however, an Amazon spokesperson said that a glitch had occurred in its sales ranking feature that was in the process of being fixed. The spokesperson added that there was no new adult policy.

For most of the weekend on Twitter, in conversations with the hash tag "#amazonfail," users were discussing the fact that the e-tailer was removing the sales rankings for books that it deemed featured "adult content." Many readers, and writers, decried the fact that Amazon appears to be removing the sales ranking for titles that feature gay and lesbian characters and/or themes.

The director of the Erotic Authors Association, who goes by the pen name Erastes, told PW that many of her members "noticed their titles had been stripped of their sales rankings" on Amazon. One, Mark Probst, contacted a customer service representative at Amazon and wrote about the exchange on his blog. Probst wrote that the Amazon rep responded to his inquiry by saying that "'adult' material" is being excluded from appearing in "some searches and best seller lists" as a "consideration of our entire customer base."

Whether a glitch or new policy, titles like James Baldwin's Giovanni's Room and Annie Proulx's Brokeback Mountain are among the titles who have lost their ranking.

ETA 3:
I shoulda been a better OP and been posting updates as they came in.

This started in February

This is not a Glitch

Bantown theory [I don't buy this theory, but YMMV]

Dear Author does a timeline

Dear Author explains metatagging [This is the theory I buy]

Troll claims responsibility [Which I really don't buy, because a) It's Weev and b) it's been debunked. And c) because it only works if you think the only books targetted are GLTB books, and it wasn't.

Debunking of Troll-code



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[info]harukami
2009-04-13 01:51 am UTC (link)
What really has me foaming at the mouth is that the delisted book list includes Hello Cruel World: 101 Alternatives to Suicide for Teens, Freaks and Other Outlaws .

What the hell.

(Reply to this)(Thread)

(no subject) - [info]brennalarose, 2009-04-13 02:13 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]glossing2, 2009-04-13 03:22 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]ladysphinx, 2009-04-13 05:10 am UTC

[info]brennalarose
2009-04-13 02:11 am UTC (link)
Glitch, huh? Yeeeeeaaaaaahhh...

(Reply to this)


[info]lexingmouse3
2009-04-13 02:12 am UTC (link)
This explains why I couldn't find a bunch of books I was looking for Friday. Fuck you, Amazon.

"Glitch" is a lie because they've had Amazon spokespeople explaining it was deliberate in email.

(Reply to this)


[info]moosecharmer
2009-04-13 02:21 am UTC (link)
Well, I certainly won't be turning to them for any-oh crap! I bought this laptop on Amazon! Nooooo!

(Reply to this)(Thread)

(no subject) - [info]ladysphinx, 2009-04-13 05:12 am UTC

[info]isntitironic
2009-04-13 02:50 am UTC (link)
an Amazon spokesperson said that a glitch had occurred in its sales ranking feature that was in the process of being fixed.

Damn, I had $10 on 'our site was hacked!'

(Reply to this)(Thread)

(no subject) - [info]braidedbaka, 2009-04-13 05:48 am UTC

[info]bigbigtruck
2009-04-13 03:00 am UTC (link)
RAEG aside...

Why would any company, let alone THE major book retailer on the web, make such a stupid, stupid, STUPID move? It's not like they rely on fundie dollars to stay afloat. I'm curious to see how this will be addressed tomorrow (assuming most employees are out for the holiday)

(Reply to this)(Thread)

(no subject) - [info]isntitironic, 2009-04-13 03:07 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]bigbigtruck, 2009-04-13 04:46 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]isntitironic, 2009-04-13 04:48 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]bigbigtruck, 2009-04-13 05:01 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]altera, 2009-04-13 04:51 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]mydemand, 2009-04-13 08:31 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]toxictattoo, 2009-04-13 11:33 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]altera, 2009-04-13 02:32 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]moosecharmer, 2009-04-13 05:13 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]ladysphinx, 2009-04-13 05:19 am UTC
Nah. Doesn't fly. BECAUSE HITLER! - [info]jupiterpluvius, 2009-04-13 05:40 am UTC
Re: Nah. Doesn't fly. BECAUSE HITLER! - [info]ladysphinx, 2009-04-13 02:25 pm UTC
Re: Nah. Doesn't fly. BECAUSE HITLER! - [info]sandglass, 2009-04-13 05:52 pm UTC
Re: Nah. Doesn't fly. BECAUSE HITLER! - [info]snarkhunter, 2009-04-13 05:57 pm UTC
Re: Nah. Doesn't fly. BECAUSE HITLER! - [info]sandglass, 2009-04-13 06:03 pm UTC
Re: Nah. Doesn't fly. BECAUSE HITLER! - [info]snarkhunter, 2009-04-14 10:04 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]risha, 2009-04-13 02:15 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]bigbigtruck, 2009-04-13 02:56 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]risha, 2009-04-13 05:14 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]lady_ganesh, 2009-04-13 07:21 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]isntitironic, 2009-04-13 03:11 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]notjo, 2009-04-13 03:25 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]lady_ganesh, 2009-04-13 07:21 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]risha, 2009-04-13 05:11 pm UTC

[info]vzg
2009-04-13 03:21 am UTC (link)
This may be a stupid comment, so please bear with meβ€”

I've never paid attention to the rankings before (I tend to only buy stuff I'm already looking for on there, and if I'm searching for something new, I pay more attention to reviews than anything else) β€” aside from, well, ranking the books, what exactly do they do?

Also, it seems at least Running With Scissors has a ranking.

Amazon.com Sales Rank: #161,679 in Books (See Bestsellers in Books)
Popular in this category: (What's this?)
#62 in Books > Biographies & Memoirs > Family & Childhood


Is that lower than what it was before? The same? Something entirely different?

I'll note also though that it looks like it's been pulled from sales on Amazon β€” it's only listing third-party sellers at this point. So is Brokeback Mountain (except Brokeback Mountain: Now a Major Motion Picture, which I would guess would be because of a rights issue and which could very well go down later). I would guess that's related.

I desperately want them to make this right (by apologizing properly and, more importantly, by fixing it, and maybe even removing the dumb-ass ban on "adult" material altogether). Amazon was always so convenient, especially if I wanted a cheap, used copy of a book or something out of print.

(Reply to this)(Thread)

(no subject) - [info]influencethis, 2009-04-13 03:44 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]altera, 2009-04-13 04:53 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]magnolia_mama, 2009-04-13 03:24 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]snarkhunter, 2009-04-13 03:58 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]magnolia_mama, 2009-04-13 04:06 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]notjo, 2009-04-13 04:13 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]magnolia_mama, 2009-04-13 04:16 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]notjo, 2009-04-13 04:31 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]notjo, 2009-04-13 03:49 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]vzg, 2009-04-13 04:04 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]breecita, 2009-04-13 05:13 am UTC

[info]bienegold
2009-04-13 03:32 am UTC (link)
See Amazon. See Amazon backpedal. Backpedal, Amazon, backpedal!

(Reply to this)(Thread)

(no subject) - [info]evening_rose, 2009-04-13 03:41 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]bienegold, 2009-04-13 03:55 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]evening_rose, 2009-04-13 04:02 am UTC

[info]disdainful_soul
2009-04-13 03:51 am UTC (link)
Another suggestion for places to shop: http://bookdepository.co.uk/

Comparative prices as Amazon.com (sometimes cheaper, sometimes slightly more expensive, but that's to be expected) and with FREE WORLDWIDE SHIPPING.

:D

(Reply to this)(Thread)

(no subject) - [info]altera, 2009-04-13 04:55 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]ellensmithee, 2009-04-13 06:13 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]disdainful_soul, 2009-04-13 06:21 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]ellensmithee, 2009-04-13 06:26 am UTC

[info]sandglass
2009-04-13 04:01 am UTC (link)
It was all a glitch, sure. And I bet that customer service rep had just gotten up from her computer for a soda and her younger brother sent the e-mail.

(Reply to this)(Thread)

(no subject) - [info]jupiterpluvius, 2009-04-13 05:40 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]notjo, 2009-04-13 05:42 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]honorh, 2009-04-13 07:31 am UTC

[info]julian_black
2009-04-13 05:47 am UTC (link)
I've been selling used books through Amazon for a long time--not any more. I'm going to miss the extra money, but I'm not giving them any more of mine, nor am I letting them take another penny in commissions from my sales. (And, to be honest, I need to get out of the used book trade for good. So I'm taking this bit of fuckery as a sign.)

So I've pulled my inventory offline, deleted my wishlist, and canceled all my pre-orders. Glitch, my ass. LOL, no.

I'm lucky enough to live in a place that still has independent booksellers, as well as good used bookstores. I'll give them my business instead.

(Reply to this)


[info]risha
2009-04-13 06:35 am UTC (link)
This is the best thing I've read today in this whole mess; specifically, her phone conversation with an Amazon manager a little ways down the thread.

(Reply to this)


[info]darksumomo
2009-04-13 08:16 am UTC (link)
This is blowing up spectacularly on Daily Kos.

Amazon's New "Morality" - for your protection

485 comments and counting.

(Reply to this)


[info]mydemand
2009-04-13 08:34 am UTC (link)
I'm seeing some great bookstore suggestions on here. Could I suggest posting them onto my Alternatives to Amazon form? (self-link). I tried looking for a site that listed them, but there didn't seem to be any good comprehensive ones, so I figured I'd start one (as a Google doc).

(Reply to this)


[info]lazzchan
2009-04-13 01:33 pm UTC (link)
I was positive this was going to show up here-- if it hadn't I would have posted this whole mess of fail.

(Reply to this)


[info]julesnoctambule
2009-04-13 02:53 pm UTC (link)
Time to pimp my local:

http://quailridgebooks.booksense.com/

You can order online, and hey -- what's that right there on the front page? Why, it's:
'All are welcome to join the Religion & Ethics group tonight. Guest speaker Jimmy Creech discusses his selection, Homosexuality is Not a Sin, from the book CRISIS: 40 STORIES REVEALING THE PERSONAL, SOCIAL, AND RELIGIOUS PAIN AND TRAUMA OF GROWING UP GAY IN AMERICA.'

(Reply to this)


[info]isntitironic
2009-04-13 03:20 pm UTC (link)
Good Morning, Amazon!

(Reply to this)(Thread)

(no subject) - [info]snarkhunter, 2009-04-13 03:55 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]notjo, 2009-04-13 03:57 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]isntitironic, 2009-04-13 04:03 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]snarkhunter, 2009-04-13 04:11 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]bigbigtruck, 2009-04-13 04:05 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]snarkhunter, 2009-04-13 04:10 pm UTC

[info]bof
2009-04-13 04:40 pm UTC (link)
Some guy is claiming responsibility, but at least one person has called bluff.

(Reply to this)(Thread)

(no subject) - [info]notjo, 2009-04-13 04:42 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]bof, 2009-04-13 04:49 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]snarkhunter, 2009-04-13 05:29 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]bof, 2009-04-13 05:40 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]chikane, 2009-04-13 05:20 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]bof, 2009-04-13 05:40 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]darksumomo, 2009-04-13 05:28 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]snarkhunter, 2009-04-13 05:35 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]darksumomo, 2009-04-13 05:57 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]notjo, 2009-04-13 06:05 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]bof, 2009-04-13 05:43 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]darksumomo, 2009-04-13 05:58 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]notjo, 2009-04-13 06:05 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]darksumomo, 2009-04-13 06:27 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]notjo, 2009-04-13 06:28 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]darksumomo, 2009-04-14 01:14 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]kaesa, 2009-04-13 07:04 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]darksumomo, 2009-04-14 01:29 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]kaesa, 2009-04-14 03:25 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]darksumomo, 2009-04-17 10:32 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]darksumomo, 2009-04-14 01:46 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]notjo, 2009-04-14 01:48 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]kaesa, 2009-04-14 03:44 pm UTC

[info]seriousbusiness
2009-04-13 05:19 pm UTC (link)
If anyone could tell me where I could get the TM Network World Heritage box outside of Amazon.jp, I'd be grateful.

No 30,000 yen order for you, Amazon!

(Reply to this)(Thread)

(no subject) - [info]kosaginolegion, 2009-04-13 05:55 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]seriousbusiness, 2009-04-14 05:29 pm UTC
OMG
[info]tiye
2009-04-13 06:05 pm UTC (link)
Have you heard about this yet? An LJ user has taken credit for the whole debacle here.

(Reply to this)(Thread)

Re: OMG - [info]tiye, 2009-04-13 06:06 pm UTC

[info]sneer
2009-04-13 06:15 pm UTC (link)
Oh dear. Indecision has gotten hold of it.

(Reply to this)(Thread)

(no subject) - [info]notjo, 2009-04-13 06:22 pm UTC

[info]becktionary
2009-04-13 06:35 pm UTC (link)
GLAAD has released a statement saying that Amazon told them it's all a mistake and it'll get fixed.

I still want to hear it from the horse's mouth. In detail.

(Reply to this)(Thread)

(no subject) - [info]redwarrior, 2009-04-13 08:01 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]becktionary, 2009-04-13 08:02 pm UTC

[info]julian_black
2009-04-13 07:40 pm UTC (link)
From the Amazon forums:

Francine St. Marie says:
Hi Everyone,

I'm the author of THE SECRET TRILOGY and several other gay/lesbian titles available here on Amazon, all of which which were censored like this in Amazon's Kindle store until March 2009. I can shed even more light on this so called "glitch" as Amazon refers to it:

For nearly a year Amazon would not allow sales ranks to be posted for any of my titles in the Kindle store. This also precluded them from appearing on their bestseller lists, which served, not incidentally, to suppress my sales.

For nearly a year, I (and Team Saint Marie) pursued the issue of sales rankings with Amazon--a truly humiliating endeavor which only resulted in the "accidental" deletion of all of the five-star reviews from some of my paperback titles. In fact, it was not until last month, when we finally removed all "gay/lesbian" and "adult" tags and categories from my Kindle editions and then republished them, that my Kindle rankings IMMEDIATELY appeared. After that, for some reason, we were allowed to reinstate the relevant gay/lesbian categories without consequence. This means, of course, that, contrary to Amazon's assertions today on Yahoo News, it's no glitch at all, but rather a sophisticated form of gay censorship they've built right into their system. (See gay/lesbian forum post by Brooke Donny called "kindle's queer bias") [Here]

Now, a few days ago, I discovered to my dismay that four of my paperbacks have had their rankings deleted (both editions of "The Secret Keeping" and also "Fortune Is a Woman" and "Keeping Mr. Right") so the abuse continues.

I would say, though, that boycotting Amazon for this, only hurts authors like me, who are chiefly Independent and rely heavily on our presence here. Something else, however, must be done.

I hope this information is useful--
Warm regards to you all,

Francine Saint Marie

(Reply to this)


[info]redwarrior
2009-04-13 08:04 pm UTC (link)
I'm going to stop using Amazon.

(Reply to this)


[info]airborne_rodent
2009-04-13 08:30 pm UTC (link)
Some people have been saying that these books were flagged by customers as inappropriate. How? I haven't been able to find a way to flag a book as inappropriate.

(Reply to this)(Thread)

(no subject) - [info]vzg, 2009-04-13 11:08 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]risha, 2009-04-14 05:02 pm UTC


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