(Post a new comment)

	aoibhe 2009-05-20 02:58 am UTC (link)
	...what. the. FUCK. ::froth:: (Reply to this)

quantumreality
2009-05-20 03:13 am UTC (link)

D:

I'm... wow. People do take drastic measures sometimes.

The thing that makes me wonder is if the boy was the one who refused treatment of his own volition or if his mother pushed him into it.

The dicey aspect to this is, at what point do teenagers have the right to refuse medical treatment? That's not something easily answered and I expect it is incidents like this that will force people to really consider all aspects of this issue.

(Reply to this)(Thread)

	bienegold 2009-05-20 03:34 am UTC (link)
	He is apparently illiterate and believes himself to be in perfect health. I do think children should have a say in their own medical care, but he isn't even close to being informed. (Reply to this)(Parent)(Thread)

	issendai 2009-05-20 04:15 am UTC (link)
	He appears to be in perfect health, while rating the pain from his chemo port as 10 out of 10. You'd think he'd at least try to get the doctors to do something about it. (Reply to this)(Parent)

rosehiptea
2009-05-20 04:28 am UTC (link)

Yeah, he really doesn't seem to understand the consequences, and neither do the parents.

I remember a case ages ago where a kid refused blood transfusions (they were Jehovah's Witnesses) and I felt a bit bad for him because the doctors kept telling him it was going to cure him when there was really a good chance it wouldn't. I guess I still felt like he should be forced to have it (he was only nine IIRC) but it sounded like they were lying to him.

But this kid has such a good chance of being cured. I can't believe the mom has done this.

(Reply to this)(Parent)

	adevyish 2009-05-20 08:11 am UTC (link)
	Isn't education supposed to be mandatory up to a certain age? (Reply to this)(Parent)(Thread)

	bienegold 2009-05-20 08:18 am UTC (link)
	Sure, but I still know plenty of adults who are functionally illiterate. Also, I believe the original article said he had learning disabilities. (Reply to this)(Parent)

	lady_ganesh 2009-05-20 05:36 pm UTC (link)
	They may have homeschooled. To try to preempt any wank: Lots of homeschooling parents are awesome. Some of them are not, mmkay? (Reply to this)(Parent)

	vzg 2009-05-20 06:16 pm UTC (link)
	Education, yes. Actual learning, no. (Reply to this)(Parent)

issendai
2009-05-20 04:22 am UTC (link)

The dicey aspect to this is, at what point do teenagers have the right to refuse medical treatment?

That's the tough part of this. The kid said he would punch and kick anyone who tried to force him to have chemo, and he's probably sincere. Even if it's for his own good, being forced to undergo chemo is a huge violation of his bodily privacy. And I'm not sure how easy it is to force chemo on a patient, anyway--would he need to be restrained while they did the treatment? That would be a double whammy for him.

You could handle a normal kid's normal antipathy to chemo by explaining how necessary it is, but his parents have no doubt given him a pile of explanations for why anything the doctors tell him is wrong.

Sometimes I want to kick them somewhere vital.

(Reply to this)(Parent)

lil_miss_stfu
2009-05-20 04:29 am UTC (link)

The thing that makes me wonder is if the boy was the one who refused treatment of his own volition or if his mother pushed him into it.

This is also what I'm wondering. And if it turns out that its mum putting the pressure on him and making sure he's not informed, she deserves to lose her son. Children already suffer so much for the prejudices of their parents, but this is Daniel's *life*.

(Reply to this)(Parent)

risha
2009-05-20 03:57 pm UTC (link)

The thing that makes me wonder is if the boy was the one who refused treatment of his own volition or if his mother pushed him into it.

I get that impression too, and that she might even be pushing the father into it as well. He's not helping find them, but he sounds fairly neutral about chemo on the whole. And she's the one deciding to leave, pushing them quickly out of the doctor's, etc.

(Reply to this)(Parent)

janegraddell
2009-05-20 05:10 pm UTC (link)

It's not the same, but I'm reminded of Hannah Jones, a 13-year-old who successfully won the right to not have a heart transplant. In her case, though, the child protection people who interviewed her wrote:

“Hannah appears to understand the serious nature of her condition . . . Treatment options were discussed and Hannah was able to express her clear views that she did not wish to go back on a pump or to go into hospital for cardiac treatment.”

She had a lot less chance of surviving, but she persuaded the child protection interviewer that she knew what she was doing. Her parents supported her wishes, too, and weren't, it seems, pressuring her either way.

Obviously this case is different, because this boy has a much greater chance of survival if he goes through with the treatment. But if he at least did understand how ill he was, if he could say he didn't want the treatment because of whatever reason, I'd feel maybe .01% less like strangling his parents. Maybe.

(Reply to this)(Parent)

ahiru
2009-05-20 06:42 pm UTC (link)

The dicey aspect to this is, at what point do teenagers have the right to refuse medical treatment?

I think it really comes down to full understanding of the issue. A teenager who has read the facts and knows the risks, who mentally mature enough to know that turning down treatment could very well lead to death and who has formed their own opinion based on this knowledge and still decides to forego medical treatment is far different from a kid like this, who almost certainly has no real idea of the risks he's in by not having treatment and who has probably been lied to extensively by his mother. This kid's not making an informed decision, he's making the decision likely based on lies and parental pressure.

(Reply to this)(Parent)

	wtf 2009-05-20 04:09 am UTC (link)
	-_______- I'm just gonna stare at your icon to cheer me up. (Reply to this)

	caito 2009-05-20 09:48 am UTC (link)
	I get the feeling that this will not end well. (Reply to this)

crazyace86
2009-05-20 10:08 am UTC (link)

Oh, damn it all to hell.

I mean, I understand citing religious reasons in cases of medical treatment. I don't entirely agree with it, but I understand it, and sure, people should have that right; but there's got to be a point where the line's drawn.

I've known people who've used alternative medicines-- but they used them in conjunction with the usual treatment, figuring they'd cover all the bases. (And if you do it, tell your doctor, so there's no bad interactions.) And maybe these medicines might help, who's to say? But they're not going to cure, and in the end more harm will be done than good.

I just... This pisses me off so much. I want to shake that woman and ask why she's killing her son, because every decent parent I know, no matter their personal beliefs, would do anything and everything to save their kid and would not deny them any form of viable treatment.

TL;DR as usual: This woman is nuts, and should her son die, I'd like to see her brought up on some form of charges. Unlikely to happen because of the religious reasons entanglement, but still.

(Reply to this)(Thread)

	lady_ganesh 2009-05-20 05:38 pm UTC (link)
	Well, chemo is absolute shit. It's horrible to go through. But it's so obvious that they're exploiting and-- apparently-- lying to their kid. (Reply to this)(Parent)(Thread)

	staroverthebay 2009-05-20 09:11 pm UTC (link)
	Chemo is horrible to go through, but it's temporary. Death is permanent. You'd think a parent would -- given the difficult choice -- rather see their child suffer through chemo in order to grow into a healthy, long-lived adult rather than see the child die in agony anyway because they wouldn't allow the treatment. (Reply to this)(Parent)(Thread)

	shadwing 2009-05-20 09:24 pm UTC (link)
	What was it the docs recommended? 6 Treatments total starting in Jaunary? In the time they have been bickering about this he might have completed the treatments (Reply to this)(Parent)

	lady_ganesh 2009-05-20 11:29 pm UTC (link)
	Oh, agreed, especially in this case. It's something else when the odds are different or when the patient is older. (Reply to this)(Parent)

indis_earfalas
2009-05-20 01:41 pm UTC (link)

Ugh. My mother and I were talking about this one today. She's absolutely disgusted too.

She also pointed out something I didn't even think about. In one breath they say they're Catholic but on the other hand they believe in "Nemenhah Band, a Missouri-based religious group". Which is it then? Because no catholics we know are anti medical treatment - and one of the basic ideas with catholics is that you don't "worship false idols".

(Reply to this)(Thread)

	vzg 2009-05-20 06:20 pm UTC (link)
	They also claim to be against chemo for religious reasons, but they already had him go through a chemo treatment. They're obviously lying their asses off. There's no reason for their religion to suddenly apply after they started. (Reply to this)(Parent)(Thread)

	damien 2009-05-20 08:35 pm UTC (link)
	Unless they converted AFTER the chemo treatment though from what I've read, that's not the case here. (Reply to this)(Parent)(Thread)

	shadwing 2009-05-20 09:26 pm UTC (link)
	I think thats what they are trying to claim, they started to ascribe to this second belief system AFTER the first treatment. Which doesn't really work that way (Reply to this)(Parent)

	hallidae 2009-05-20 08:33 pm UTC (link)
	As was mentioned in the other post, they apparently believe (or at least claim) they can be both without the two systems conflicting with each other. Bullshit. (Reply to this)(Parent)

	bigbigtruck 2009-05-20 02:41 pm UTC (link)
	Running away right before your court date really does a lot to enhance your credibility. no wait (Reply to this)

	tachikoma01 2009-05-20 03:21 pm UTC (link)
	Two more links: http://wcco.com/crime/chemo.trial.absent.2.1013457.html http://wcco.com/crime/chemo.trial.missing.2.1013970.html I hope they find the kid in time- or that there's a murder charge if they don't. (Reply to this)(Thread)

	thoms 2009-05-20 11:12 pm UTC (link)
	Ahh, WCCO links. So many fond memories of driving from Sioux Falls to Maplewood, with WCCO as my background noise. /OT. Sorry 'bout that. (Reply to this)(Parent)(Thread)

	tachikoma01 2009-05-21 02:52 pm UTC (link)
	NPR tends to be my business noise, largely because I can get the Twin Cities MPR station from St Paul all the way down into southern Minnesota (around Rochester the signal disappears, then I usually change over to Iowa or Wisconsin stations depending on which way I'm going.) /Also OT (Reply to this)(Parent)

	I thought it'd never exist. redwarrior 2009-05-21 08:28 pm UTC (link)
	Wow, a parent that actually makes me madder than the Octomom does. ~~This is child abuse, plain and simple.~~ (Reply to this)