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oulangi
2008-05-29 12:17 pm UTC (link)

This is someone taking pictures of real life people, in real life, and posting them in ways that are easily identifiable to anyone who sees the pictures and knows them.
So IF someone already knows the people IN the pictures, they'll recognize their picture? What? Seriously, the post is asshole-y BUT the faces are covered. Moreover, I doubt there's a hell of a lot of cross over between SASS and say, WisConners targetted by the post who also attend UW. So this "She brought it to REAL LIFE FIRST" argument doesn't fly.

Yes. I've HAD my picture posted online. Yes it sucks. Somehow I managed to avoid threatening to kill the people responsible.

Given that I'VE seen threats - including from someone here who said they wanted to punch her, but for reasons unexplained, we should all just automatically understand she doesn't really really mean it - and I've only been following this from my flist/here - and that some of those threats were made on the wiscon google group, I'd say "we" have a pretty good idea who's made them. Frantic editing, locking, and deleting of some of the nastier business aside, of course.

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	eleutheria 2008-05-29 12:21 pm UTC (link)
	Given that I'VE seen threats - including from someone here who said they wanted to punch her, but for reasons unexplained, we should all just automatically understand she doesn't really really mean it - So every time someone says "die in a fire", you think that means that they're threatening to force you to burn to death? Come on. (Reply to this)(Parent)(Thread)

	esclaramonde 2008-05-29 12:28 pm UTC (link)
	If someone said my real name and address, and then said DIAF? Yeah, I'd be pretty freaked out. (Reply to this)(Parent)(Thread)

	pyratejenni 2008-05-29 07:13 pm UTC (link)
	You'd think no one remembered fpb got banned from fandom_wank for threatening to kill people who made jokes about his mother, eh? (Reply to this)(Parent)

	oulangi 2008-05-29 12:29 pm UTC (link)
	Uh no. But the people saying they wanted to stab or punch her, and that they knew what she looked like/where she lived works? I think that's actually creepy. (Reply to this)(Parent)(Thread)

	lady_ganesh 2008-05-30 02:16 am UTC (link)
	Agreed. (Reply to this)(Parent)

ladyvorkosigan
2008-05-29 12:22 pm UTC (link)

Except that con reports - particularly the nasty ones - always seemed to be linked everywhere. It seems almost certain that this would spread beyond something awful (which, in fact, it did) and that, at a minimum, it would be seen by pretty much everyone who attended the con. Now, the OP may very well not have thought of that, true, but that doesn't change the fact that it was going to be seen in a very public manner.

I guess we just have a different view of the "punch her in the face" threat because that seems like the paradigmatic thing you use as a hyperbolic threat that doesn't mean anything to me.

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	oulangi 2008-05-29 12:32 pm UTC (link)
	Don't forget the stab her threat, that one was special too. (Reply to this)(Parent)(Thread)

ladyvorkosigan
2008-05-29 12:40 pm UTC (link)

I didn't see/notice it, but I'm not going to argue that people shouldn't be saying things like that. I still am not sure it's a real threat in the contexts of the internets where "stab, stab, stab" is a generic "I don't like that," but yeah, you still shouldn't do it. And I also am not going to argue that posting her actual address isn't a terrible idea. It's this "OMG, her identity deserves to be protected because she was just doing things on the internet" idea that really offends me.

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oulangi
2008-05-29 12:54 pm UTC (link)

Yeah that one (and it wasn't really a stab stab stab comment - at least I didn't read it as such. It was more I WANT TO STAB HER AND SHE LIVES HERE comment) was off - and what's disturbed me has been the lack of people IN this group; people I normally think of as thinky reasonable types, coming out and saying, "Hey guys? I know were all upset here but this is NOT COOL".

"OMG, her identity deserves to be protected because she was just doing things on the internet" idea that really offends me. I really am not sure what you're getting at, but it sounds like what you're saying is that, if say this conversation REALLY pissed me off, then outing your real life info, and invitng all of journalfen to write to your work to tell them that you're spending time on an adult only site (instead of working) is ok with you. I would (luckily, apparently) disagree.

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ladyvorkosigan
2008-05-29 01:13 pm UTC (link)

Nope, not at all, although I do like to think that I don't write things under pseudonyms that I generally wouldn't stand by in my real life, but I understand that's 100% not true for a lot of people for a number of different, entirely valid reasons. What I'm saying is that I don't think this actually happened on the Internet, so to speak, and I don't think it's a legitimate exercise of anonymous speech - she was at a (god, I hate this term, but I can't think of a better alternative) meat space event, taking pictures of people for the sole purpose of mocking them, and then used the Internet for the purpose of more widely disseminating. If she had distributed an anonymous pamphlet with the pictures and commentary would it be wrong for people to come forward with her name? I certainly don't think so (maybe you do? If so, are there any conditions under which you think it's acceptable to out someone who was acting anonymously). But because she posted the pictures on the Internet instead, people are saying it falls within the fandom sphere of anonymity we generally grant.

I mean, honestly, it's entirely possible that some of the statements she made were legally actionable. This isn't the kind of honest, good faith speech we usually accept as legitimately anonymous.