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bacon_lover ([info]bacon_lover) wrote in [info]unfunnybusiness,
@ 2012-01-08 13:31:00


Previous Entry  Add to memories!  Tell a Friend!  Next Entry
A professor not calling on a student violates the 1st Amendment, I guess?
Posting in unfunny business because wanker expresses concerns for her safety--and I didn't want to deal with unfunny comments in other coms. Possible trigger warnings for safety and ableism.

That portion aside, this is a 4,000+ long e-mail about how terrible not being called on is, and how a professor should be fired for giving an assignment with no alternative. This college student really did not want to write a report on OWS.

The sense of entitlement is strong with this one.

Edit: ableism trigger warning added. Apologies.


(Post a new comment)


[info]quantumreality
2012-01-09 03:44 am UTC (link)
At first I thought you meant 4000 emails :O

Anyway I'm reading that e-mail and the thing making my eyes hurt is that she's liberally interspersed it with all kinds of bold, italic and underline formatting and frankly, made some pretty OTT accusations about others and statements about herself.

(Reply to this)


[info]keri
2012-01-09 04:51 am UTC (link)
Holy crap. I just started her list of grievances and the entitlement! wow.

I hear a lot about students with entitlement problems from professor friends and... "In one particularly notable email, Professor Zaloom told me that my personal stance on OWS was making 'conceptual progress in the class difficult to sustain.'" - this makes me cringe so hard, because one of my friends has described almost the exact same thing. Using a topic that is in the news and everyone knows about in order to illustrate various points, but being unable to actually get to those illustrations because one particular student refuses to get beyond the very first step of "this is happening now, and is important, and we will be discussing it in class". Which is just...bizarre for a cultural/social analysis course (or anthropology or sociology) especially.

And then...

DuringJen's 2nd and 3rd lectures, she mostly refused to call on me, even when I was the only student raising my hand.

... Maybe because you were derailing the lecture, and she needed to be able to keep to the topic at hand for all the other students who were following along? Can't stop class for the single person who is struggling when there are at least a dozen other people there. I learned that really quick in undergrad, and I learned to write down my questions and take notes and arrange time later to go over what I didn't understand.

Yikes. I feel kind of bad commenting on her emails, because it seems clear to me that there's something going wrong. The professor did give her an alternate assignment (though it still involved OWS, which seems to be the primary theme of that section of the course), and the dean did say that he told her how to make a formal complaint, yet after she sent copies of emails that referred to those things, she says none of this happened? And then she says that she went to the OWS site anyway, but still can't write the paper, even about the data she gathered then.

I think she's a bit misinformed about why mental health workers might be useful for students, also. :/

I don't know. I say I feel weird rubbernecking about this, because there's something not right, but I still feel jaw-dropped enough that I go "wow, she seems like she really isn't aware of how universities work"

(Reply to this)(Thread)


[info]white_tean
2012-01-09 05:41 am UTC (link)
I think she's a bit misinformed about why mental health workers might be useful for students, also. :/

Exactly. In my experience universities are very cautious with students who are stressed, and want to get them to their mental health services and take off as much pressure as they can. If they're recommending mental health services to you, it's not an attempt at oppression, it's that they don't want you jumping off a building (a student I know had to be hauled off a ledge this year).

(Reply to this)(Parent)(Thread)


[info]quantumreality
2012-01-09 06:01 am UTC (link)
At the same time, our society tends to be pretty quick to label people who have the "crazy" label, and if she's at all aware of this she's probably extremely sensitive to the likelihood that her complaints might be sidelined owing to a mental health diagnosis. Yes, these things are supposed to be confidential, but even just having to see a shrink sometimes carries a "where there's smoke" aura around it.

What concerns me is people will just see "entitled selfish student" all over her and not consider, as you and [info]keri did, the possibility that the student probably really does need to decompress in a major way.

(Reply to this)(Parent)(Thread)

(no subject) - [info]keri, 2012-01-09 06:12 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]bacon_lover, 2012-01-09 04:05 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]white_tean, 2012-01-09 06:13 am UTC

[info]brennalarose
2012-01-09 03:24 pm UTC (link)
At least they did recommend mental health. When I had a stress-related health issue at my tiny college, the best they did was offer me an opportunity to come back and either do a fabulous job in every class I took, or never come back to them again.

(Reply to this)(Parent)


[info]rganymede
2012-01-09 06:45 pm UTC (link)
Eh, my experience is the exact opposite. I came down with depression-like symptoms once in college -- almost completely unable to get out of bed, no amount of sleep felt restful, uncontrollable crying, every problem felt insurmountable, etc. I, completely on my own, eventually figured out that I was having side effects from the pill (which I'd been on for three years before having any adverse reaction).

However, before I figured out the actual cause of the problem and solved it on my own, I made several attempts to see a counselor, because, well, long history of depression and other mental illness on both sides of my family. To get an appointment with a counselor at the university I went to, you have to call up the counseling office that day and hope they can fit you in. My attempts went something like this:

Day 1, Afternoon:
"This is the counseling office."
"Um, I'd like to see a counselor."
"Are you having thoughts of suicide?"
"What? No."
"All slots are filled for today. Trying calling back tomorrow as early as possible."
"At eight* in the morning, you mean?" *the official opening time for the office
"Just before eight if possible. Appointments fill up fast."

Day 2:
7:45AM: "The counseling office is not yet open. Please try again later."
7:50AM: "All lines are busy. Please try again in a few minutes."
7:52AM: "All lines are busy. Please try again in a few minutes."
7:57AM: "All lines are busy. Please try again in a few minutes."

7:59AM:
"This is the counseling office."
"Yeah, I'd like to make an appointment--"
"Are you having thoughts of suicide?"
"No, but--"
"All slots are filled for today."

I was lucky in that my problem turned out to be entirely physical and easily solvable in nature, but since then I've always wondered how the hell non-suicidal students who are having problems are supposed to get the help they need. Also, how many times someone in that state needs to hear the question "Are you having thoughts of suicide?" before they start having them when they wouldn't have otherwise...

(Reply to this)(Parent)(Thread)

(no subject) - [info]miera_c, 2012-01-11 04:26 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]life_on_mars, 2012-01-11 09:10 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]notjo, 2012-01-12 06:01 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]kijikun, 2012-01-15 07:38 pm UTC

[info]white_tean
2012-01-09 05:23 am UTC (link)
It's disturbing, if she has the resume she claims to have, why she thinks anything done by the professor she's cited are firing offenses. ...and then she goes on to include details about the professors husband... creepy. So is seeming to not understand that your right to free speech is entitled to over-ride classroom decorum. No one will stop you exercising that right, you'll just be exercising your right outside of the classroom, and possibly off the campus entirely. Our professors also remind us that it is our right to appeal, but that an appeal can go either way.
"The way I interpret this statement is that Professor Zaloom asked me to stop expressing my views in class—by the way,according to the American Constitution, and many academic policies, this is both my legal and academic right"

I don't think anyone has been gas-lighting her, and am glad the university seems to have been taking steps to give this person the support she actually seems to need in this situation.

(Reply to this)


[info]keri
2012-01-09 06:05 am UTC (link)
Wait a sec. According to http://spoiledrichkids.blogspot.com/2012/01/email-that-led-zaloom-to-file-security.html - there are more emails that Sara has published somewhere. I'm a bit confused about the chronology right now, but there's a lot going on.

What's really troubling to me is that this is far from an isolated case, judging from what my professor friends (and even what I saw in undergrad 6 years ago) have talked about. Maybe never so blown up and public as this, but still, it happens. I'm wondering if something shouldn't be done in high schools to stave it off. Perhaps get rid of all the NCLB nonsense as a start?

(Reply to this)(Thread)


[info]shadwing
2012-01-09 06:53 pm UTC (link)
Thats what I'm thinking. I remember a plagerism case where a HS teacher failed about 2/3rds of a class for obvious plagerism in the classes final project, one that was to be done thoughout the whole year, one they were told was to be the majority of their grade and where in the class outline they got on day one stated that 'Any plagerism found would result in an automatic F on that assignment'

The Parents BITCHED and as a result the School Board forced the teacher to give the kids passing grades anyway. Teacher eventually quit in protest.

These are the kids entering the Collage Level...OMG...they are so not ready, the collages expect young adults, not brats. This girl is either an utterly entitled brat at the worst or a kid cracking under the extreme pressure to perform when she never had to really push herself in the past.

(Reply to this)(Parent)(Thread)


[info]miera_c
2012-01-11 04:31 am UTC (link)
I gave zeros to 2 students for plagiarism a few years ago. It was clear cut. I had evidence. I followed the college procedure exactly. Neither student failed due to that paper (they failed because of additional complications). They both complained, and their parents bitched up a storm, but as the instructor of record, I refused to even consider changing their grades and there wasn't anything that could be done about it (neither student was willing to file a formal challenge).

I got written up by my horrific toady of a chair who said it was my fault the students cheated because my instructions confused them. And I got put on probation for it.

This shit? Is why I and a lot of other people flee teaching.

(Reply to this)(Parent)(Thread)

(no subject) - [info]shadwing, 2012-01-11 04:42 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]white_tean, 2012-01-11 04:57 am UTC

[info]notjo
2012-01-12 06:02 am UTC (link)
What is NCLB?

(Reply to this)(Parent)(Thread)

(no subject) - [info]keri, 2012-01-12 12:39 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]shadwing, 2012-01-12 01:58 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]keri, 2012-01-12 10:10 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]shadwing, 2012-01-13 06:13 pm UTC

[info]sandglass
2012-01-09 06:39 am UTC (link)
Trigger/content warning for ableism please?

at one point, Ackerman complains that a guest lecturer refused to call on her despite her hand being raised for a minute and 15 seconds ("a long time to keep one's arm raised"

HA. I've had my hand raised for at least twice that. Of course I don't get called on because I talk too much in class most the time. Since she asked for an alternative assignment by raising her hand in class, apparently numerous times, no wonder she doesn't get called on.

(Reply to this)(Thread)


[info]notjo
2012-01-12 06:02 am UTC (link)
When I first saw this I thought it was going to be about that boy who stuttered and the prof refused to call on him even though he kept up his hand for an entire class.

(Reply to this)(Parent)


[info]thoms
2012-01-09 07:09 am UTC (link)
The fuck did I just read? My eyes are all swimmy from the underlining and bold and oh my god, the asterisks.

The entitlement is strong with this one. I can't wait to talk to an NYU friend tomorrow and get her thoughts on all this.

(Reply to this)(Thread)


[info]queencallipygos
2012-01-09 02:55 pm UTC (link)
Oh, this is NYU?

For some reason this makes that make more sense. (When I was there in the early 90's we had a newspaper columnist who had some questionable language edited out of his column in October and then spent THE REST OF THE YEAR bitching about it.)

(Reply to this)(Parent)


[info]children_of_lir
2012-01-09 01:53 pm UTC (link)
Damn. 0_o

If that screed were pasted into a plain-text field to strip off all the formatting, I wonder if it'd actually make any sense.

(Reply to this)


[info]tronella
2012-01-09 06:21 pm UTC (link)
Can someone explain to me what she means by PNG when she says "she ordered a PNG to be put on my head a few weeks ago"?

(Reply to this)(Thread)


[info]keri
2012-01-09 06:43 pm UTC (link)
The closest I could figure out was "persona non grata"? Maybe a not-quite restraining order? I'm not certain, though, and I'm not sure how to improve my googlefu to find the answer. I think it might be something specific to NYU's procedures for disruptive/potentially harmful students.

(Reply to this)(Parent)(Thread)

(no subject) - [info]shadwing, 2012-01-09 06:54 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]tronella, 2012-01-09 07:38 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]jyuu, 2012-01-10 01:21 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]keri, 2012-01-10 10:41 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]shadwing, 2012-01-11 04:44 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]keri, 2012-01-11 04:48 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]mistal, 2012-01-11 07:18 pm UTC

[info]shadwing
2012-01-09 06:44 pm UTC (link)
Gooood question as far as I know PNG is a graphic file.

(Reply to this)(Parent)(Thread)

(no subject) - [info]rganymede, 2012-01-09 07:08 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]keri, 2012-01-09 07:21 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]tronella, 2012-01-09 07:39 pm UTC

[info]were_lemur
2012-01-10 11:25 am UTC (link)
I'd have sympathy for the "there are some scary people at OWS" explanation; there were reported rapes and sexual harassment. But it struck me that the "violation of her core values" to even interview people who disagreed with her is the real reason. And that just reeks of not getting it.

(Disclaimer: I have anxiety attacks that can be triggered by being in a crowd, which kept me from participating in my local Occupy demonstration.)

(Reply to this)(Thread)


[info]sockpuppeteer
2012-01-10 09:50 pm UTC (link)
See you had a real reason that you couldn't participate or be in the crowd.

She was given an alternative that was still connected to the OWS but wouldn't make it so she had to go down there and she still didn't wanna.

I am sorry that you have problems with crowds.

I recently worked a convention where one of the guests had a panic attack trying to get through the crowd to their table so my sympathies.

(Reply to this)(Parent)(Thread)

(no subject) - [info]were_lemur, 2012-01-13 05:31 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]sockpuppeteer, 2012-01-14 02:16 am UTC

[info]shadwing
2012-01-10 10:10 pm UTC (link)
Yeah it was like she played the 'OMG I could get assaulted/I'm in fear of my life' card AFTER being told by the professor she wouldn't get another assignment. Which is an insult to people with real issues with crowds or a history of being assaulted.

It turned out she DID go down with FRIENDS, in a group to gather data...and she still didn't turn in the assignemt.

(Reply to this)(Parent)(Thread)

(no subject) - [info]rhosyn_du, 2012-01-11 07:57 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]shadwing, 2012-01-11 09:35 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]were_lemur, 2012-01-13 05:35 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]were_lemur, 2012-01-13 05:34 am UTC

[info]emily_goddess
2012-01-11 02:20 am UTC (link)
Someone above linked to another letter where she repeatedly refers to the professor and others as "irrational liberals", so I'm with you and everyone else who thinks the safety concerns were tacked on to give weight to her butthurt at having to interact with ~liberals~.

Also, "but it violates my core values!" shouldn't fly in anthropology or sociology. You're only supposed to observe, anyway, and if you can't even observe people you disagree with, there won't be much for you to study.

(Reply to this)(Parent)(Thread)

(no subject) - [info]shadwing, 2012-01-11 03:34 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]risha, 2012-01-11 04:31 am UTC
(no subject) - [info]chibikaijuu, 2012-01-11 07:08 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]enrythe8th, 2012-01-20 09:50 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]lexingmouse3, 2012-02-02 07:39 am UTC

[info]drakyndra
2012-01-11 01:12 pm UTC (link)
So, who else (from non NYU universities) has been asked to do an ethnographic analysis of a local protest?

Because I got asked to do one a couple of years back in either my first or second year of uni, and it seems to be a relatively standard part of a sociology course.

I did mine on the local Anonymous Scientology protest. No harassment or assaults occurred, though I did have someone invite me to an orgy. I declined.

(Reply to this)


[info]lexingmouse3
2012-02-02 07:32 am UTC (link)
This idiot needs to be flunked and kicked out of university.

(Reply to this)


 
   
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