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Charmian (![[info]](http://www.journalfen.net/img/userinfo.gif){kind=small} charmian) wrote,@ 2008-12-26 03:45:00 |
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Note, before you click this, watch out, because it contains a LOT of NSFW images. I turned images off, because I just don't want to have to load that many.
http://bradhanon.livejournal.com/789.ht
In general, I just ignored this discussion, because a) am not as interested in visual art, more into fandom in general for the stories, and b) most of the outrage seemed to stem from who the poster was (a male) than from what he was saying. Disliking someone's arguments based on who they are is ad hominem, and IMHO there have been a lot of female persons in fandom who have made all kinds of ridiculous arguments about 'all women believe this or want this' for me to think that it's just men who do this. (Which is not to say that I agree with Bradhanon. I think some good arguments have been made against his ideas, especially those which claim that slash fandom cannot be argued to be representative of 'women,' meaning that it cannot be argued that it is equivalent to the so-called 'Male Gaze.' And anyway, if Bradhanon doesn't really understand what it is, it is mistaken for him to write about it)
And also, WTF? Helloooooo there is INDEED A PAYING MARKET FOR M/M WORKS AIMED AT WOMEN, mostly in ebooks. It is ridiculous for people to behave as if m/m works aimed at women are owned only by fanfic writers, or should always be that way.
Frankly, it comes off as if they made mistakes out of ignorance, and notrafficlights, IMHO, is not speaking for the entire fandom(s) and should stop acting like she is. Also, she does not speak for all fans when she claims that fandom is opposed to capitalism.
Also: "And if I think any of it is worth it I'll be more than happy to steal it off the various pirate comms I am a part of on LJ and many other forums on the internet. :) Seriously, why would I give any ignorant money grabbing lying capitalist any of my hard-earned cash? Especially when they've still got so much to apologise for?"
Wow. It is interesting that even though all of the people involved in this endeavor, except for bradhanon are women, notrafficlights seems to believe that it is a good idea that any attempts to make money out of m/m for women be sabotaged. So.... does anyone remember that post that was written awhile back about how fanfic makes women poor? XD Well, certainly m/m will never make anyone a red cent if people feel that they should never, ever pay for it. Man, no one had better tell notrafficlights about the BL sector of the manga industry. That shows that even though doujinshi can be had, and online fanworks, people will STILL pay for m/m works.
(So now capitalist=anyone who wishes to make money off of their labor, or anyone who wishes to start a business?)
http://bradhanon.livejournal.com/789.ht
In general, I just ignored this discussion, because a) am not as interested in visual art, more into fandom in general for the stories, and b) most of the outrage seemed to stem from who the poster was (a male) than from what he was saying. Disliking someone's arguments based on who they are is ad hominem, and IMHO there have been a lot of female persons in fandom who have made all kinds of ridiculous arguments about 'all women believe this or want this' for me to think that it's just men who do this. (Which is not to say that I agree with Bradhanon. I think some good arguments have been made against his ideas, especially those which claim that slash fandom cannot be argued to be representative of 'women,' meaning that it cannot be argued that it is equivalent to the so-called 'Male Gaze.' And anyway, if Bradhanon doesn't really understand what it is, it is mistaken for him to write about it)
And also, WTF? Helloooooo there is INDEED A PAYING MARKET FOR M/M WORKS AIMED AT WOMEN, mostly in ebooks. It is ridiculous for people to behave as if m/m works aimed at women are owned only by fanfic writers, or should always be that way.
Frankly, it comes off as if they made mistakes out of ignorance, and notrafficlights, IMHO, is not speaking for the entire fandom(s) and should stop acting like she is. Also, she does not speak for all fans when she claims that fandom is opposed to capitalism.
Also: "And if I think any of it is worth it I'll be more than happy to steal it off the various pirate comms I am a part of on LJ and many other forums on the internet. :) Seriously, why would I give any ignorant money grabbing lying capitalist any of my hard-earned cash? Especially when they've still got so much to apologise for?"
Wow. It is interesting that even though all of the people involved in this endeavor, except for bradhanon are women, notrafficlights seems to believe that it is a good idea that any attempts to make money out of m/m for women be sabotaged. So.... does anyone remember that post that was written awhile back about how fanfic makes women poor? XD Well, certainly m/m will never make anyone a red cent if people feel that they should never, ever pay for it. Man, no one had better tell notrafficlights about the BL sector of the manga industry. That shows that even though doujinshi can be had, and online fanworks, people will STILL pay for m/m works.
(So now capitalist=anyone who wishes to make money off of their labor, or anyone who wishes to start a business?)
